Being Gay and Christian...is this possible?

ghendricks63 · Jun 6, 2011

theWaris1 said:
Imo they appeared to be trying to do something they knew was wrong. There was no joy there. none

And this statement appears to be made from a great personal bias. I believe you simply saw what your prejudice dictated.

Jase · Jun 6, 2011

theWaris1 said:
No one attacked my coworker. He felt convicted in his spirit and it don't matter what you call it.

No one has to personally attack your coworker. The societal stigma of being gay has a huge impact on one's psychology, even if they never personally get insulted by an anti-gay person.

theWaris1 · Jun 6, 2011

Jase said:
No one has to personally attack your coworker. The societal stigma of being gay has a huge impact on one's psychology, even if they never personally get insulted by an anti-gay person.

You made it sound as if the conservative Christians attacked him. Are you back peddling? No one was ugly to him and no one knew he was gay.
The stigmas come mostly from the OT teachings. The scriptures do not approve of homosexual behavior regardless of what a liberal Christian claims.

ghendricks63 · Jun 6, 2011

theWaris1 said:
The scriptures do not approve of homosexual behavior regardless of what a liberal Christian claims.

The scriptures do not condemn responsible homosexual behavior regardless of what a conservative Christian claims.

(Normally I would prefer an actual discussion/debate with substance. But hey if you can make a simple declarative statement with no substance...so can I)

Of course the difference between our versions of the same sentence is that yours is false and mine is true.

(I thought I would throw in another declarative statement for good measure)

theWaris1 · Jun 6, 2011

ghendricks63 said:
The scriptures do not condemn responsible homosexual behavior regardless of what a conservative Christian claims.

(Normally I would prefer an actual discussion/debate with substance. But hey if you can make a simple declarative statement with no substance...so can I)

Of course the difference between our versions of the same sentence is that yours is false and mine is true.

(I thought I would throw in another declarative statement for good measure)

I suppose you can declare whatever you like. There isn't anything true about what you said tho.

ghendricks63 · Jun 6, 2011

theWaris1 said:
I suppose you can declare whatever you like. There isn't anything true about what you said tho.

I think that was my point exactly about your previous post. LOL

theWaris1 · Jun 6, 2011

ghendricks63 said:
I think that was my point exactly about your previous post. LOL

Does that amuse you somehow? I don't get your points at all. You should just say what you mean and stop trying to be smart.

ghendricks63 · Jun 6, 2011

theWaris1 said:
Does that amuse you somehow? I don't get your points at all. You should just say what you mean and stop trying to be smart.

Yes it does amuse me very much.

There has been an extensive discussion in the thread and many others about this very issue with excellent points made concerning scripture on this very important issue of our faith. Simply coming in oblivious to the issues being discussed and believing that such declarative statements help really is funny to me. Perhaps you would benefit from spending some time reading the entire thread and at least learning about the scriptural views pertaining to this by liberals. And of course remembering that this is a liberal forum with rules about the subject we are discussing that are different than most other forums here would be helpful as well.

Octorock · Jun 6, 2011

theWaris1 said:
Imo they appeared to be trying to do something they knew was wrong. There was no joy there. none

Couldn't their lack of joy possibly be from their peers constantly insisting that they were "trying to do something they knew was wrong"?

meliagaunt · Jun 6, 2011

theWaris1 said:
I watched a metropolitan Homosexual church on TV a few times and it was so very dry... the spirit seemed quenched. I don't believe one can live in this lifestyle and be truly spirit filled and certainly not in a position to teach or preach the word with conviction. That is my opinion from observations.

Sometimes I have watched Songs of Praise, a long-running and often dull British Sunday evening TV show. Often it seems so very dry... the spirit seems quenched. Not always, to be fair.

I don't put down the dryness to the lifestyle of the participants, more to the artificiality of putting worship on TV, or else to my own inability to sense the mood the people there were feeling.

I don't see the observation on the TV programming as providing compelling support for the statement about 'this lifestyle' not being 'truly spirit filled'.

david.disciple.of.jc · Jun 6, 2011

going back to the OP yes you can be gay n be Christian just like some Christians are liers or use money in the worng way ect we are all siners so why does one sin means u cant be a Christian over a other, i myself am pansexul thou God comes frist in my life.

btw i havent kissed anyone much less anything esle yet but does not mean i do not see love in jsut women to me love is love whter it for men,women,or anywhere in the mix.

theWaris1 · Jun 6, 2011

meliagaunt said:
Sometimes I have watched Songs of Praise, a long-running and often dull British Sunday evening TV show. Often it seems so very dry... the spirit seems quenched. Not always, to be fair.

I don't put down the dryness to the lifestyle of the participants, more to the artificiality of putting worship on TV, or else to my own inability to sense the mood the people there were feeling.

I don't see the observation on the TV programming as providing compelling support for the statement about 'this lifestyle' not being 'truly spirit filled'.

Well I do. They service was dead and I've seen live services full of the spirit.

david.disciple.of.jc · Jun 6, 2011

Brother Chris said:
I know this is a liberal section and today people are being told whosoever may come, you can come as you are and stay as you are. I'm sorry, this is not what the bible teaches. Here are Jesus terms if you want to be saved:

John 3:16

New International Version (NIV)

16 For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

i do not see an foot note or * saying ect gays do you?

ghendricks63 · Jun 7, 2011

Brother Chris said:
First off, let me just say what the bible teaches about sexual sin. Any sexual activity, outside of marriage between a man and woman is sexual sin. It does not matter if you're heterosexual having sex outside of marriage, or a homosexual. God condemns all sexual sin.

Yes the bible condemns sexual sin just like any other sin. It is your definition as to what sexual sin is that is not scriptural. And the bible most certainly does NOT teach that all sex outside of marriage of a man and a woman is sin. Taking a couple of verses totally out of context and trying to use them as some sort of proof text means nothing and is easily debunked.

Jase · Jun 7, 2011

Brother Chris said:
No, these are Jesus exact words. Look them up! People today are being told that if they want to be saved all they have to do is pray a prayer and ask Jesus to come into your heart. This is the biggest false teaching today and it is nowhere in scripture. If you didn't come to Jesus on His terms, you're not saved. It's that simple.

Jesus never cited Levitical Law or Romans or Corinthians. How are they his exact words? Jesus did not write the Bible.

ghendricks63 · Jun 7, 2011

Brother Chris said:
No, these are Jesus exact words. Look them up! People today are being told that if they want to be saved all they have to do is pray a prayer and ask Jesus to come into your heart. This is the biggest false teaching today and it is nowhere in scripture. If you didn't come to Jesus on His terms, you're not saved. It's that simple.

Yeah I am with Jase on this. If you are going to claim something as "Jesus exact words" then you need to provide the scripture reference.

Jase · Jun 7, 2011

Episaw said:
There is one major failing with this comment Jase. What you are contending is that unless Jesus said it we ignore what is said. Of course scripture is not on your side with this one because it says that ALL scripture is given by inspiration of God and is profitable....2 Timothy 3:16, meaning that whether Jesus said it or not, it is from God.

Well, every Christian on this planet ignores Mosaic Law, so that's already the case.

2 Timothy applies ONLY to the Tanakh (more importantly the Torah). There was no New Testament at the time, nor was it used for teaching. Timothy also does not indicate that the Bible is inerrant or accurate on things not related to righteousness. If your argument were true, we'd also have to view the Book of Enoch, Maccabees, Jubilee, other Gospels, etc. etc. as inspired by God since they are deemed scripture. They just weren't deemed worthy of being in the canon by the Church.

2 Timothy has to be one of the most abused verses in the Bible.

Can you give us some evidence that you cannot not be homosexual if you are?

Facts About Changing Sexual Orientation

the results of scientifically valid research indicate that it is unlikely that individuals will be able to reduce same-sex attractions or increase other-sex sexual attractions through SOCE" (pp. 2-3).
In addition, the Task Force found evidence to indicate that some individuals experienced harm or believed they had been harmed by these interventions.

No, human beings cannot choose to be either gay or straight. For most people, sexual orientation emerges in early adolescence without any prior sexual experience. Although we can choose whether to act on our feelings, psychologists do not consider sexual orientation to be a conscious choice that can be voluntarily changed.

No; even though most homosexuals live successful, happy lives, some homosexual or bisexual people may seek to change their sexual orientation through therapy, often coerced by family members or religious groups to try and do so. The reality is that homosexuality is not an illness. It does not require treatment and is not changeable.

Sexual orientation, homosexuality and bisexuality

Every legitimate medical assocation in the world agrees with these statements. The only ones who claim you can change orientation are anti-gay hate groups like NARTH and Family Research Council which falsify data and use bad methodology to purposely get the result they want. They are not accepted by the medical community and their methods are considered very dangerous.

Can you give us some evidence that homosexuality is not sinful from scripture bearing in mind what I said earlier about ALL scripture?

No, just like I can't give you evidence from the Bible that driving a car isn't a sin. What we understand as homosexuality (the predisposition to be attracted to members of the same sex) does not exist in the Bible. Same-sex behavior outlined in the Bible was exclusively pagan prostitution, pederasty, or rape. And the people involved would have most likely been straight.

QuakerOats · Jun 7, 2011

If I may, I'd like to begin by saying that while CF has its official definition of what it is to be a Christian, we here at WWMC often take a broader view and ask that non-members please respect that when posting in our forums. It's against the overall rules to accuse someone of not being a Christian, if they profess to be.

As to the topic at hand, because we believe that context is extremely important when reading the bible, many of us feel that there's enough cause for doubt where the verses used against homosexuality are concerned. If you're interested in our reasons, they're available throughout the thread. I will say, however, that I think most of us are in agreement that we simply can't know for sure.

I'd also like to address the accusation of not believing in repentance. While I can't speak for all of us, many do believe in the idea of repentance, as laid out in the Gospels. If said accusation stems from the fact that a many of us are accepting of homosexuality, I refer to my previous paragraph and let it rest there.

Mr.SteveSir · Jun 7, 2011

Paintedgoldfish,
First of all, let me say that this must be a frightening and strange time for you. Coming to Christ and then wondering if your whole world has to be turned upside down to be a good Christian. It is a problem many have faced for many different reasons. You are not alone in your distress, God loves you and will strengthen you, along with your new brothers and sisters. To address the issue of your sexuality, Scripture says that homosexual acts are a sin, being tempted by homosexual attraction is not. I'm sure these verses have been pointed out to you,

1Corinthians 6:9 Don't you know that evil people won't have a share in the blessings of God's kingdom? Don't fool yourselves! No one who is immoral or worships idols or is unfaithful in marriage or is a pervert or behaves like a homosexual,
Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

It is the sexual act that is a sin, not the temptation. If your partner can accept a celibate relationship then you have a workable solution. If not, you may have to give it up. I know you are in a dificult situation and I will be praying for you. Let me leave you with another verse.
2Corinthians 4:16 We never give up. Our bodies are gradually dying, but we ourselves are being made stronger each day. 17 These little troubles are getting us ready for an eternal glory that will make all our troubles seem like nothing. 18 Things that are seen don't last forever, but things that are not seen are eternal. That's why we keep our minds on the things that cannot be seen.

Mr.SteveSir · Jun 7, 2011

Paintedgoldfish,
First of all, let me say that this must be a frightening and strange time for you. Coming to Christ and then wondering if your whole world has to be turned upside down to be a good Christian. It is a problem many have faced for many different reasons. You are not alone in your distress, God loves you and will strengthen you, along with your new brothers and sisters. To address the issue of your sexuality, Scripture says that homosexual acts are a sin, being tempted by homosexual attraction is not. I'm sure these verses have been pointed out to you,

1Corinthians 6:9 Don't you know that evil people won't have a share in the blessings of God's kingdom? Don't fool yourselves! No one who is immoral or worships idols or is unfaithful in marriage or is a pervert or behaves like a homosexual,
Rom 1:26 For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature:27 And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

It is the sexual act that is a sin, not the temptation. If your partner can accept a celibate relationship then you have a workable solution. If not, you may have to give it up. I know you are in a dificult situation and I will be praying for you. Let me leave you with another verse.
2Corinthians 4:16 We never give up. Our bodies are gradually dying, but we ourselves are being made stronger each day. 17 These little troubles are getting us ready for an eternal glory that will make all our troubles seem like nothing. 18 Things that are seen don't last forever, but things that are not seen are eternal. That's why we keep our minds on the things that cannot be seen.

Being Gay and Christian...is this possible?

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