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<blockquote data-quote="muichimotsu" data-source="post: 74276173" data-attributes="member: 149131"><p>Yeah, the ad hoc rationalization is old hat, you can always invoke the covenant defense to basically say that some things still apply, even though Jesus didn't say he was changing the law itself, only "fulfillfing" it. But that still gets into using God itself as a scapegoat to solve problems God initiated by knowingly creating flawed beings. </p><p></p><p>Also the Jews would partly disagree with you on that, not sure how you're going to argue how they're wrong just because they don't agree with your ilk. Not all Jews, sure, but those Orthodox ones probably still maintain the kosher aspects. And that just leads into the other issue of Christians being "so different" because they don't have "works based" theology, even though your holy text doesn't have that consistent message, it argues that good works are reflective of grace, not something wholly unnecessary, so the phrasing doesn't work anyway, esp. if it isn't necessarily the case that Jews and Muslims say that the works themselves get them into heaven, but reflect their faith in God, the only difference being the notion of some "grace" that basically negates your freewill</p><p></p><p>Again, you can quote it, doesn't mean your interpretation is strictly accurate or even as intended by the writers. And even if it was, that doesn't make it more defensible, because you're just assuming everyone else will just go along because of how "righteous" you seem to follow your god's law.</p><p></p><p>No, I'm not saying that, because I don't believe in sin, I'm claiming the notion that "bringing sin into your house" will somehow be a stumbling block is fallacious logic of conflating someone's state with you being influenced. If you're going to be a moralizing zealot, at least be consistent instead of selectively interpreting things so you don't appear utterly insane and on the fringe of society</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="muichimotsu, post: 74276173, member: 149131"] Yeah, the ad hoc rationalization is old hat, you can always invoke the covenant defense to basically say that some things still apply, even though Jesus didn't say he was changing the law itself, only "fulfillfing" it. But that still gets into using God itself as a scapegoat to solve problems God initiated by knowingly creating flawed beings. Also the Jews would partly disagree with you on that, not sure how you're going to argue how they're wrong just because they don't agree with your ilk. Not all Jews, sure, but those Orthodox ones probably still maintain the kosher aspects. And that just leads into the other issue of Christians being "so different" because they don't have "works based" theology, even though your holy text doesn't have that consistent message, it argues that good works are reflective of grace, not something wholly unnecessary, so the phrasing doesn't work anyway, esp. if it isn't necessarily the case that Jews and Muslims say that the works themselves get them into heaven, but reflect their faith in God, the only difference being the notion of some "grace" that basically negates your freewill Again, you can quote it, doesn't mean your interpretation is strictly accurate or even as intended by the writers. And even if it was, that doesn't make it more defensible, because you're just assuming everyone else will just go along because of how "righteous" you seem to follow your god's law. No, I'm not saying that, because I don't believe in sin, I'm claiming the notion that "bringing sin into your house" will somehow be a stumbling block is fallacious logic of conflating someone's state with you being influenced. If you're going to be a moralizing zealot, at least be consistent instead of selectively interpreting things so you don't appear utterly insane and on the fringe of society [/QUOTE]
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