Being angry with sinners

[pescador]

Being angry with sinners makes as much sense to me as being angry with people who have infections. In other words, since the New Covenant, God isn't angry with sinners -- "for God so loved the world -- so why should Christians be different from God?

Whatever the sin, those who haven't received the Spirit commit sins because they have no alternative. All one has to do is read Romans 7 to see the dilemma of those who haven't received the Spirit -- it is no longer the sinner who commits sin but the sin living within them.


Jesus most certainly turned no one away because of their sin. Even in Romans 1 God gave the worst of sinners up to the natural result of their sins; he didn't punish them directly as he did Israel.


The only anger that I see in the New Covenant are the apostles being angry with Christians who, having received the Spirit, continue sinning. So why are some Christians angry at sinners when God, Jesus, and the apostles weren't and aren't?

 

[joshuanazar]

Being angry with sinners makes as much sense to me as being angry with people who have infections. In other words, since the New Covenant, God isn't angry with sinners -- "for God so loved the world -- so why should Christians be different from God?

Whatever the sin, those who haven't received the Spirit commit sins because they have no alternative. All one has to do is read Romans 7 to see the dilemma of those who haven't received the Spirit -- it is no longer the sinner who commits sin but the sin living within them.


Jesus most certainly turned no one away because of their sin. Even in Romans 1 God gave the worst of sinners up to the natural result of their sins; he didn't punish them directly as he did Israel.


The only anger that I see in the New Covenant are the apostles being angry with Christians who, having received the Spirit, continue sinning. So why are some Christians angry at sinners when God, Jesus, and the apostles weren't and aren't?

I perfectly agree.

 

[FanthatSpark]

It happens when a Christian straddles the fence of law and faith . Duality of self as the judge of the flesh gets in the way in pride of judgment. Situations like he/she does that , gives one a superior feeling in the judgment on many levels of the mind . Continuous feeding on pride in judgment will manifest in anger , disappointment , low self esteem depending on judgment of self or another. Non perfection of love lives in those feelings.

For this one, the following verses had to be applied to self first, so this one would treat another the same ...Matt 22:37-39. John 8:15. James 1:27.

Seek Joy not judgment . Believers get lost in questions like , "are you a felon"? If one says yes then a predetermined "type" has been allotted and in the mind of the non felon, a superiority in, "at least "I" didn't". That is judgment of the flesh that totally ignores scripture of john 8:15. This is but an example and may not apply to some .

Well worded OP is ... Wheres the fruits Galatians 5:22-23 in anger ...... .

 

[ToBeBlessed]

It happens when a Christian straddles the fence of law and faith . Duality of self as the judge of the flesh gets in the way in pride of judgmentSituations like he/she does that , gives one a superior feeling in the judgment on many levels of the mind . Continuous feeding on pride in judgment will manifest in anger , disappointment , low self esteem depending on judgment of self or another. Non perfection of love lives in those feelings.

For this one, the following verses had to be applied to self first, so this one would treat another the same ...Matt 22:37-39. John 8:15. James 1:27.

Seek Joy not judgment . Believers get lost in questions like , "are you a felon"? If one says yes then a predetermined "type" has been allotted and in the mind of the non felon, a superiority in, "at least "I" didn't". That is judgment of the flesh that totally ignores scripture of john 8:15. This is but an example and may not apply to some .

Well worded OP is ... Wheres the fruits Galatians 5:22-23 in anger ...... .

Yup. First sentence.

 

[iplay4JC]

I agree to a certain extent of what you've posted. However even though we are a new creation in Christ, we are still in human form. And we will continue to sin, miss the mark, until He calls us home. Anyone who says differently is not being truthful.

To be angry with sinners, to me, is akin to being a Pharisee; Proud, puffed up with a position, having knowledge about the word but not discernment, etc. God forgive me should I ever forget who I was before Christ!

IMHO the only thing that separates me from a non-believer is grace, the blood that was shed for the remission of my sins. That doesn't make me better or at put me a level higher - it just means I'm forgiven.

 

[Neogaia777]

How can we be angry at what we once were,(Romans 2:1) and then project that anger towards others, who are like what we once were, or still are, according to Paul...

God Bless!

 

[pescador]

I agree to a certain extent of what you've posted. However even though we are a new creation in Christ, we are still in human form. And we will continue to sin, miss the mark, until He calls us home. Anyone who says differently is not being truthful.

To be angry with sinners, to me, is akin to being a Pharisee; Proud, puffed up with a position, having knowledge about the word but not discernment, etc. God forgive me should I ever forget who I was before Christ!

IMHO the only thing that separates me from a non-believer is grace, the blood that was shed for the remission of my sins. That doesn't make me better or at put me a level higher - it just means I'm forgiven.

I'm glad my OP has been received so positively! I just want to comment on your last paragraph... Jesus' blood was shed for the remission of everyone's sins, not just those of believers. It is a serious tragedy that all people have been forgiven but so many, many people just don't accept it. I feel so deeply sorry for them as the time will come when they no longer have the opportunity to receive God's forgiveness.

 

[BryanW92]

I'm glad my OP has been received so positively! I just want to comment on your last paragraph... Jesus' blood was shed for the remission of everyone's sins, not just those of believers. It is a serious tragedy that all people have been forgiven but so many, many people just don't accept it. I feel so deeply sorry for them as the time will come when they no longer have the opportunity to receive God's forgiveness.

But the sacrifice of Christ is only effective for believers. The non-believer is not forgiven. The serious tragedy is that the non-believer persists in his unbelief when forgiveness is only a step away.

 

[thesunisout]

Being angry with sinners makes as much sense to me as being angry with people who have infections. In other words, since the New Covenant, God isn't angry with sinners -- "for God so loved the world -- so why should Christians be different from God?

Whatever the sin, those who haven't received the Spirit commit sins because they have no alternative. All one has to do is read Romans 7 to see the dilemma of those who haven't received the Spirit -- it is no longer the sinner who commits sin but the sin living within them.


Jesus most certainly turned no one away because of their sin. Even in Romans 1 God gave the worst of sinners up to the natural result of their sins; he didn't punish them directly as he did Israel.


The only anger that I see in the New Covenant are the apostles being angry with Christians who, having received the Spirit, continue sinning. So why are some Christians angry at sinners when God, Jesus, and the apostles weren't and aren't?

We shouldn't be angry with sinners, we should love sinners. If we are angry at sinners, we should try to remember what God has forgiven us for. What I don't agree with is that you say God isn't angry with sinners.

Psalm 7:11 God judges the righteous, and God is angry with the wicked every day.

In case you think that is just the Old Testament, look at what Paul says:

Romans 2:5 But according to your hardness and your impenitent heart, do you treasure up wrath for yourself in a day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God,

One day, God is going to judge the world with fire and pour out the full measure of His wrath upon sin. That's upon sinners, and that suggests that while God loved the world and gave us grace through His Son, His Spirit will not strive with man forever.

 

[pescador]

But the sacrifice of Christ is only effective for believers. The non-believer is not forgiven. The serious tragedy is that the non-believer persists in his unbelief when forgiveness is only a step away.

Jesus' sacrifice wasn't just for believers it was for everyone. All are forgiven, but they must accept the forgiveness. It is as though I have committed a crime, someone else has paid the fine, and the judge has said that my crime is forgiven. If have a choice: either I accept the pardon or I don't. If I accept it I am free -- there is no double jeopardy -- otherwise I am in prison forever. The decision is mine to either believe what the judge has said or not.

 

[pescador]

We shouldn't be angry with sinners, we should love sinners. If we are angry at sinners, we should try to remember what God has forgiven us for. What I don't agree with is that you say God isn't angry with sinners.

Psalm 7:11 God judges the righteous, and God is angry with the wicked every day.

In case you think that is just the Old Testament, look at what Paul says:

Romans 2:5 But according to your hardness and your impenitent heart, do you treasure up wrath for yourself in a day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God,

One day, God is going to judge the world with fire and pour out the full measure of His wrath upon sin. That's upon sinners, and that suggests that while God loved the world and gave us grace through His Son, His Spirit will not strive with man forever.

Citing only these two verses out of context doesn't mean much. The psalms also say that the Lord is my shepherd who leads me beside still waters and restores my soul, hardly an act of anger. Regarding the part of Romans you quote, The wrath of God will come in the future, but God is being patient now because he loves the world.

 

[iplay4JC]

But the sacrifice of Christ is only effective for believers. The non-believer is not forgiven. The serious tragedy is that the non-believer persists in his unbelief when forgiveness is only a step away.

Agreed. A non-believer is not in the Family of God therefore their sins are not forgiven. Check out Luke 1:77, Acts 10:43 and let's not forget Ephesians 2:8-9.

Peace.

 

[com7fy8]

So, it is clear to me that it is bad to have condemning anger against someone.

Have compassion, in prayer with hope for any person, at all,
for all that is possible with God.

"He can have compassion on those who are ignorant and going astray,
since he himself is also subject to weakness." (Hebrews 5:2)

Be busy with this, instead of reacting with anger.

"So then, my beloved brethren,
let every man be swift to hear,
. . . . slow to speak,
. . . . . . . . . slow to wrath;
for the wrath of man does not produce the righteousness of God."
(James 1:19-20)

But can God's wrath produce what is good? I see in the early scriptures that when God was angry He did what was good, about the problem. He made things better, not necessarily for evil people, though, but for others.

"God resists the proud,
but gives grace to the humble."
(in James 4:6, and in 1 Peter 5:5)

When we start getting angry about things, it can be because God is resisting us while we are doing things in ego. He can "use" wrong people, to resist us; so getting angry, even about what is wrong, may not be the solution to our problem. If we are with God, we will know what good to do, instead of only reacting.

"Let all bitterness, wrath, anger, clamor, and evil speaking be put away from you, with all malice." (Ephesians 4:31)

For me, this includes evil speaking in my thoughts and imagination, not just what shows to others. I need to be stronger and more real in love, with creative reacting and praying for, instead of anger against.

"And be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God in Christ forgave you." (Ephesians 4:32)

So, if we are busy with being "tenderhearted" with one another, this will keep us busy away from just reacting angrily.

But I do remember how Jesus was angry (Mark 3:1-5) when the hypocrites were against Him healing on the Sabbath. But His anger brought Him to do what is good, I consider > he healed the man; also, He said things which could help the hypocritical people, even though they did not receive it well, at that time > it could be a seed to help someone later.

It says Jesus "had looked around Him with anger,

being grieved by the hardness of their hearts."

And our Apostle Paul does say,

"And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, by whom you were sealed for the day of redemption." (Ephesians 4:30)

So, even though we are now in the New Testament time, it looks like this means it is possible to grieve the Holy Spirit. And the scriptures after this help to show what can grieve the Holy Spirit and how we can be pleasing instead