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Be fruitful & Multiply?

Godcreatedsteve

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Originally Posted by IisJustMe
This is a vision, and therefore does not depict actual persons or heavenly beings.
A vision by a prophet of God is always of actual things, or else it is a false prophet.

Also, this is the second time you've broken your word by answering my post. My understanding was that you report my posts to the muckety-mucks rather than answering them.
 
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Harry3142

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GodCreatedSteve-

Are you implying that those who chose to have wives and fanilies were less than spiritual. That is gnosticism, not Christianity. In fact, one of the gnostic books, St. Paul and Thecla, focuses on her resistance to marrying because if she does so it will cost Thecla her salvation.

But the passage in Romans did not mean to imply that those who engaged in marital relations were either inherently evil, or on a lower rung from those who chose to remain celibate. Celibacy too is a gnostic attitude, not the attitude of the Christians of the 1st century. Instead, it was meant to tell them that those who desired the carnality of the numerous houses of prostitution which littered the region were not to be seen as equal with those who sought spirituality.

Paul wrote that he preferred that they remain unmarried, as he was, but that was his personal opinion, not to be confused with orthodox teaching. And because he was reared in Tarsus, a city located in the Gentile area, he knew more than others what persecutions faced the Christians. This included the killing of their entire families as punishment for their faith in Jesus Christ.

As for Maimonides, I have read his list myself, as well as reading what other rabbis have said concerning this commandment. So you stand alone by seeing it as a blessing rather than a commandment, because universally it is seen as a prerogative. They are to marry and have children.
 
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KimberlyAA

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I won't advocate gay and lesbian relationships as I believe God is firmly against that. You raised some good points, however, I think in the beginning when God said to be fruitful and multiply He meant both physically and spiritually. Physically because he wanted humans to fill the Earth and have dominion over it and also he wanted to bless Adam's descendants through Noah and future generations. Spiritually because he wanted everyone to come to know Him and to bear fruits of the Spirit such as love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control.
<H3 class="r g0">fruit·ful/&#712;fro&#862;otf&#601;l/
Adjective:
  • (of a tree, a plant, or land) Producing much fruit; fertile.
  • Producing good or helpful results; productive: "years of fruitful collaboration"; "the two days of talks had been fruitful".
<H3 class="r g0">mul·ti·ply/&#712;m&#601;lt&#601;&#716;pl&#299;/
Verb:Obtain from (a number) another that contains the first number a specified number of times.Adverb:In several different ways or respects: "multiply injured patients".Synonyms:increase - propagate - augment - reproduce - breed

</H3></H3>
 
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SayaOtonashi

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In the bible it's state that children are a gift from god but then it states that it's worse to have children when a father doesn't support his father . Also this can't be a universal rule because paul state marriage is for a loving relationship. Paul star the wife doesnt own her body and husband doesn't own his body. Paul doesn't said for mothr to go and children. Also some women can never have children even do to her health or is bare. God doesn't away bless people with children
 
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daydreamergurl15

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In Scripture God deals with every one of these scenarios and never retracted the command "be fruitful and multiply".
 
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SayaOtonashi

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That means all single people have sinned. Jesus never said anything about have many children. Paul never said anything. Christan aren't under the law. What this command be in the 10 commandants where christans aren't even under the law. Paul never married. Jesus never married. Paul as a personal choice said not to married to stay single. That means Paul as sinned. God said its a blessing not a commdant To have children.
 
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daydreamergurl15

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[FONT=&quot]&#8220;behold, there came out two women, and the wind was in their wings; for they had wings like the wings of a stork.&#8221; [/FONT][FONT=&quot](Zeck 5:9)[/FONT]

One of the most precious thing about the bible is context and I love context...

Zechariah 5:5-11
5 Then the angel who talked with me came out and said to me, &#8220;Lift your eyes now, and see what this is that goes forth.&#8221;

6 So I asked, &#8220;What is it?&#8221; And he said, &#8220;It is a basket that is going forth.&#8221;

He also said, &#8220;This is their resemblance throughout the earth: 7 Here is a lead disc lifted up, and this is a woman sitting inside the basket&#8221;; 8 then he said, &#8220;This is Wickedness!&#8221; And he thrust her down into the basket, and threw the lead cover over its mouth. 9 Then I raised my eyes and looked, and there were two women, coming with the wind in their wings; for they had wings like the wings of a stork, and they lifted up the basket between earth and heaven.

10 So I said to the angel who talked with me, &#8220;Where are they carrying the basket?&#8221;

11 And he said to me, &#8220;To build a house for it in the land of Shinar; when it is ready, the basket will be set there on its base.&#8221;​

You might think that it's speaking about Angels because it uses the word "wings" almost all cultures usually describes Angels as having wings...But Angels in Scripture are not described as having "wings" however Living Beings (Creatures), Cherubs and Seraphim in the heavenly hosts have them--[I should note that Scripture also describes God as having wings but I don't know if they mean that metaphorically or an actual description of Him).

This search was done with the NKJV but you can choose any version you like. You'll notice that wings and angels are not associated together. The only time you do see them associated is in Zech 5 and that's because they are describing the women as having wings not that an angel has wings...

BibleGateway.com - Keyword Search: wings


With the descriptions that the bible gives us about creatures with wings, I would assume these ladies could be Living Creatures, Cherubs or Seraphins. But that's anyone's guest. The bible is pretty silent on the description of Angels in their heavenly appearance. Most of the descriptions we have are Angels in their earthly appearance usually described as taking a form of an earthly man.
 
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daydreamergurl15

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All I know is that God told the earth "to be fruitful and multiply" after He created it and then He told Noah and His Sons to repopulate the world, whether that command is in effect or not in your opinion, that is what He asked. This command was given before the old law and if Christ said that it's okay NOT TO BE MARRIED in Matthew 19--and again He gives the exception of why not to be married-- then it will only be logical to assume that you will not "be fruitful and multiply" and He's fine with that. And if He knows that women were/are barren, it also will be logical to realize that they can't have kids. And please realize, I'm talking about this in a marriage relationship, single people shouldn't be having sex outside of marriage.

It obvious that we're still being "fruitful and multiplying", for humans, not everyone is doing it in the communion of marriage. I think we're taking things a little too serious, for Christ lived and was never married, if we consider it a sin not to have kids then Christ sinned so obviously we know that God's got this taken care of.
 
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Puptart

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Good post. I agree with you, especially as a child-free Christian.

 
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