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I can only tell you so many times, my remarks are not aimed at you. I am not attacking you. I am not criticising you. I am not making this about you in any way. There is an issue here that is bigger than any one person, any one tradition, or denomination, or whatever. I'm not making it personal.If you aim your remarks at a group, you are including the people in the group.
I can only tell you so many times, my remarks are not aimed at you. I am not attacking you. I am not criticising you. I am not making this about you in any way. There is an issue here that is bigger than any one person, any one tradition, or denomination, or whatever. I'm not making it personal.
You should take into account that I am writing using Google Translator (I speak Ukrainian and Russian, and am currently studying English). It is possible that something was translated incorrectly.This is humbling to read
Stephen Covey believes that much advice is autobiographical. The person heard and remembered that something similar happened in his life, or he read in books, watched in a movie. But even if he himself solved a similar problem, his solution will not suit everyone. This is the same as if you went to an ophthalmologist, and he took off his glasses and lets you use them, although your situation is completely different. You need your own glasses. And for this you need to carefully diagnose.What we take in will inevitably find its way to the other. This was one of my most important lessons many years ago. When I stopped listening to my friends and seeking their input. I developed the ability to keep my own counsel. They were well meaning and equally clueless. Now it's the blind leading the blind to our detriment.
Probably a mistranslation again. It said that the woman overestimated her strength, but when she got tired, she lost control of herself. As for disputes, the saints of the 1st century advised offering your opinion up to 3 times, and if it is not accepted, then not insisting on it any more. The main thing is not to lose the spiritual peace.I've long held that arguments are counterproductive to healthy connections.
One famous preacher said the same thing: such offensive things are said to a husband (or wife) that would never be said, not just to a boss at work or a policeman on the street, but even to a friend.If you won't do the same to your boss, the police, the judge, or another you hold in regard. Why would you do it to them?
It seems to me that neither you nor your chosen one will be able to find out before the wedding how each of them will behave in marriage. The same aforementioned psychologist, Professor Nina Krygina (who became a nun) had extensive experience in counseling couples. As I understand from her words, there is almost no couple who would not have to face surprises. So she urges everyone to be patient. Usually young people think: everything will be different with us. Either because we are more educated than others, or we are more religious and pious, or for other reasons. But some time passes and something happens that cannot be resolved without patience.When I was contemplating suitors the barometer for selection was their alignment with my purpose and my suitability for theirs. God isn't the author of confusion. He won't unite me with a gentleman who opposes the work He's called me to. Nor would He give him a companion ill-suited for his mission and its accomplishment. There must be harmony.
Putting that front and center put the rest in its proper context. If they didn't tick that box the others didn't matter. And the kingdom is first and I wouldn't compromise. I didn't simply take his word for that. I put it to the test. Because everybody has a threshold. I knew where I stood and needed to make certain he was in the same sphere.
Beg pardon? You're talking about the Abraham who tried to pimp his wife out, more than once. Eg. see here: Issues in Genesis: The Trafficking of Sarah, Part 1But we know that neither Abraham in relation to Sarah, nor Isaac in relation to Rebekah had any abuses.
You should take into account that I am writing using Google Translator (I speak Ukrainian and Russian, and am currently studying English). It is possible that something was translated incorrectly.
Stephen Covey believes that much advice is autobiographical. The person heard and remembered that something similar happened in his life, or he read in books, watched in a movie.
As for disputes, the saints of the 1st century advised offering your opinion up to 3 times, and if it is not accepted, then not insisting on it any more. The main thing is not to lose the spiritual peace.
It seems to me that neither you nor your chosen one will be able to find out before the wedding how each of them will behave in marriage.
It's easy to talk Christianly. But it is difficult to live as a Christian. Without patience and God’s help it is completely impossible.
If you are talking about believing families, then this is only possible if someone pretends to be a Christian: he goes to church meetings, but does not work at all on himself to fulfill the commandments of Christ. The problem here is the hypocrisy of one or both spouses, not gender roles.
I explained the mechanism above. 1. Men in USSR never complained about abuse by wife to those bodies that record statistics. 2. It is psychological and therefore difficult to prove. 3. When a woman goes into conflict and a man has 2 options: to submit to his own wife or to submit to a representative of the authorities, a man in the USSR chose to submit to his own wife.
That is, first, each side chose a strategy of competition for power (in the words of Stephen Covey, “win/lose”). If a man lost, he either went into a career, or service to the state, or became an alcoholic. If he became an alcoholic, his personality changed and his state of negative emotions grew. A person who loses and gives in all the time eventually breaks down. And since he was already inclined to drink alcohol, then what happened was what was already recorded by government statistics.
But government statistics did not record absolutely the period of time from the moment of the wedding to the moment when the husband became an alcoholic.
Good post.This is right: get to know yourself and look for a partner to approach you, and then try to understand the other and solve problems together.
But what prevents this?
1. Many people cannot understand themselves for decades. And in their youth, even more so, they do not understand themselves correctly. The girl pictured an ideal man in her imagination, attributed this to her fiancé and promises to obey like the Church of Christ. But as Nina Krygina says, in 99% of cases, shortcomings are discovered in the other person that were invisible if you did not live together. And if the girl decided and promised that she would obey, but deceived herself, then she will cancel her decision. She thought that she would do this because she would listen to the command of the New Testament, but then she says: my husband is not as holy as I imagined him to be, so I cancel my decision. Initially, there was an unconscious mistake: to submit not for the sake of Christ, but for the sake of the qualities of the future husband. Also, the husband may encounter something that he did not see in his parental family and not know what to do about it. The relationship is not like that of his parents and he has no instructions on how to behave. While he was overwhelmed by passion and the bride did not know his sore spots, he thought that he would easily bear insults according to the Savior’s words “if she hit you on the cheek, turn the other one.” But later the bride used empathy to hit the most painful places and after that, not only turning the other cheek, it’s even difficult to discuss all this.
2. Inability to listen to others. It often seems that what pleases one person should also please the other. For example, today I heard such prejudice that a man chooses a wife who looks like his mother. But when the wife begins to behave like a mother (someone advised that her husband would like it that way), the husband considers himself deeply offended that he has been humiliated to the level of a child. Professor Nina Krygina also talks about this in the video above. In fact, the wife should try to understand her husband, what will please him, and not listen to the advice of smart psychologists, what pleases them and transfer this to her husband. In the same way, a husband should listen to and understand his wife, which makes her happy.
Her husband, for example, likes camping on the lake. And she likes to relax in a comfortable hotel room. She gives in, goes camping with him and is sad and whining all the time in the tent and thereby spoils her husband’s mood or even gets angry. She might even reprimand her husband: I went through such difficulties for you, but you don’t appreciate it. You scoundrel! I don't love you anymore! The holiday is ruined. At the same time, she could want to appear virtuous and hide from her husband that she does not like camping, and say: the main thing for me is that you spend these days the way you want, this will already make me happy. But she didn’t recognize herself, overestimated her strength and lost control. In the same way, a husband should not believe his wife’s words that she only enjoys what her husband wants. He should have first listened to my wife about what her ideal vacation would be. And as an option that suits both, you could choose a hotel on the shore of a lake or sea, rather than a campsite. Inside the hotel room there is comfort for the wife, and outside there is nature for the husband.
Problems: 1) no sincerity with oneself; 2) at first they did not try to understand what would please the other person.
The God-given right of a man to control his wife is not violence, because the wife voluntarily marries and agrees to have such a relationship with the man. Obedience is one of the virtues that a woman must demonstrate in marriage. And, of course, obedience to a husband, like obedience to the state, is valid only if it corresponds to the Divine Law. Likewise, Christ submitted to the authorities only when it corresponded to the Divine will.That's really not quite what I'm saying.
What I'm trying to say is that if we talk about things like headship, submission, leadership, authority (etc) in ways which reinforce ideas of household hierarchy, dynamics of power and control, rigid roles, and so on, that drives the attitudes which underlie abuse, even if we are simultaneously saying that the text is against any abuse.
Partly because if - for example - a man believes he has a God-given right to control his wife, he won't see that as abuse. He won't recognise the problem with what he's doing.
I am really not smearing you. This is not about you.
Well, all of you who have spent most of this thread telling me that headship is not about control, and so on, how will you respond to this? How will you speak up against this distortion of Scripture?The God-given right of a man to control his wife is not violence, because the wife voluntarily marries and agrees to have such a relationship with the man. ...
Thus, God, although He created people equal in nature, nevertheless gave each different advantages. And the advantage of a husband is power over a wife. Denying this advantage, in my opinion, is resisting the will of God to give man and woman what He wants.
Power over his wife? What do you mean, physically or as head of the family? If you mean physically, as some kind of metaphor from God that grants him the justification for dominating her by force - then you've put your finger on a key attitude that is destroying marriages.The God-given right of a man to control his wife is not violence, because the wife voluntarily marries and agrees to have such a relationship with the man. Obedience is one of the virtues that a woman must demonstrate in marriage. And, of course, obedience to a husband, like obedience to the state, is valid only if it corresponds to the Divine Law. Likewise, Christ submitted to the authorities only when it corresponded to the Divine will.
If one of the men abuses this commandment, this should in no way cancel or distort the commandment of Christ. Therefore, your attempts to promote “mutual submission”, arguing them with statistics of domestic violence, are just an excuse not to follow the Holy Scriptures.
Thus, God, although He created people equal in nature, nevertheless gave each different advantages. And the advantage of a husband is power over a wife. Denying this advantage, in my opinion, is resisting the will of God to give man and woman what He wants.
because the wife voluntarily marries and agrees to have such a relationship with the man.
Thus, God, although He created people equal in nature, nevertheless gave each different advantages.
The God-given right of a man to control his wife is not violence, because the wife voluntarily marries and agrees to have such a relationship with the man. Obedience is one of the virtues that a woman must demonstrate in marriage. And, of course, obedience to a husband, like obedience to the state, is valid only if it corresponds to the Divine Law. Likewise, Christ submitted to the authorities only when it corresponded to the Divine will.
If one of the men abuses this commandment, this should in no way cancel or distort the commandment of Christ. Therefore, your attempts to promote “mutual submission”, arguing them with statistics of domestic violence, are just an excuse not to follow the Holy Scriptures.
Thus, God, although He created people equal in nature, nevertheless gave each different advantages. And the advantage of a husband is power over a wife. Denying this advantage, in my opinion, is resisting the will of God to give man and woman what He wants.
Likewise, a good Christian man cannot order a woman to do something that does not comply with the Law of God. Otherwise, his words will no longer correspond to the divine command, and therefore should not be fulfilled. So, I don’t see any abuse here.
Someone must take ownership of the whole and delegate as required. Entrusting her with responsibilities she manages isn't a negation of her gifts or lessening of contribution. But if you want to be him why are you required? He doesn't need a twin he needs a complement.
~bella
Yes, and a husband would be foolish to not recognize his wife's abilities in areas where she is well suited to give such help. Over the years my wife has been in charge of many aspects of the family that I trusted her to handle, because she was suited for it, and the family was better off for it.
No, I mean that a man is allowed to have authority over his wife only within the framework of the commandments of Scripture and the natural Law of God.Can you clarify your recent statement, and the one previously? When you indicate that his words will no longer correspond to the divine command:
Are you saying that the husband's authority is absolute, and God intends him to control every aspect of his wife's life, unless it goes against a specific command of God?
I wasn't talking about men's power and control over women in general. There is actually no such right in Scripture. We are talking only about the power of a husband over his wife, not just a man and a woman.Well, all of you who have spent most of this thread telling me that headship is not about control, and so on, how will you respond to this? How will you speak up against this distortion of Scripture?
Or is it only a problem when people argue for the safety, the value, and the flourishing of women, and not a problem when people argue for the power and control of men?
Wives, be subject to your husbands as you are to the Lord (Eph.5:22)I say that God does not give a man the right to control his wife. That is not what the texts say, or mean, at all. And any such control is abuse.
That's still a massive problem.We are talking only about the power of a husband over his wife, not just a man and a woman.
And where, there, do you see any instruction or permission for a husband to coerce or control his wife?Wives, be subject to your husbands as you are to the Lord (Eph.5:22)
Indeed, man was not made from woman, but woman from man. Neither was man created for the sake of woman, but woman for the sake of man. For this reason a woman ought to have a symbol of authority on her head, because of the angels (1Cor.11:8-10).
I find the assumption that a marriage in which both spouses work together as equals, leads to conflict, to be very strange, and not at all in keeping with reality.That is, in order to avoid dual power and conflict in the family, only the man should have power.
The husband can use physical violence in exceptional cases when, for example, the wife does not control herself and threatens the health of herself and others. In other cases, the husband cannot inflict physical violence, because as you rightly said, it destroys families.Power over his wife? What do you mean, physically or as head of the family? If you mean physically, as some kind of metaphor from God that grants him the justification for dominating her by force - then you've put your finger on a key attitude that is destroying marriages.
In contrast, God couldn't be more clear about how He instructs the husband to conduct himself as leader:
1 Peter 3:7 NKJV
"Husbands, likewise, dwell with them with understanding, giving honor to the wife, as to the weaker vessel, and as being heirs together of the grace of life, that your prayers may not be hindered."
Did God give this privilege to the husband due to his physical prowess or any other "advantage"? No. He did so to serve as a testimony of Christ' relationship to His bride - the Church.
God bless!
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