(Baptist Views please)-- abortion

[ArchangelGabriel]

what is the baptist veiw on abortion?
-is it wrong or right?
-is it always wrong/right?
-why is it always or not always right/wrong?
-etc.

 

[arunma]

There's no definite Baptist view, because Baptists come in both liberal and conservative flavors. Most of us, however, strongly oppose abortion. We think it is a form of killing, and so we don't believe that anyone has the "right" to abortion anymore than people should have the right to conventional murder.

The only time I think abortion should be permitted is when it is necessary to save a mother's life. And even then, I think that all other options should first be exhausted.

 

[ArchangelGabriel]

There's no definite Baptist view, because Baptists come in both liberal and conservative flavors. Most of us, however, strongly oppose abortion. We think it is a form of killing, and so we don't believe that anyone has the "right" to abortion anymore than people should have the right to conventional murder.

The only time I think abortion should be permitted is when it is necessary to save a mother's life. And even then, I think that all other options should first be exhausted.

well i was more or less looking for that answer to ask a diff. one so thats why i started in the baptist area but this area will work too

- but how can there be a exception to Gods law?

 

[leia]

Alrighty then! You have to first state what you think God's laws are and then we can debate. Otherwise, we won't even know when we disagree.

 

[mesue]

what is the baptist veiw on abortion?
-is it wrong or right?
-is it always wrong/right?
-why is it always or not always right/wrong?
-etc.

Before I say anything, I need to say this, I believe in being as transparent as I can, with that said, I speak as a forgiven, blood bought child of God and as a woman who's had an abortion, and a nurse. I have always said I broke the top ten commandments, murder was one of them. I have a baby in Jesus' arms right now.
It is wrong to kill a person for the convienence of one's self. I did that. I was a divorced mom of a toddler. I was on public assistance and didn't want to burden myself with another baby to take care of while I was in college. Towards the end of my college career I was pregnant again. I remained "Pro-Choice" and chose to have the baby. (Really "Pro-Choice" is pro abortion. I'm actually Pro Life.)
I recently spoke to a young girl (17) who became pregnant and was contemplating abortion. This would have been her second abortion in 5 months. She said she didn't believe in birth control. I told her tha abortion is a form of birth control in that she is controling whether or not the baby would be birthed. She chose to keep the baby.
Another girl said that she could have any one else raise the baby but her and she dicided to have an abortion. When I heard this I said "You don't want it, so you get rid of it? Wow." She had never had an abortion before, so I told her what I went through.I told her that an abortion is not just a medical procedure, like removing a wart. Sooner, or later, you come to the realization that you were carrying life and willfully ended that life. That the life killed will be mourned. That I still mourn my baby's loss. Twice a year I mourn. The time of year I killed my baby and the time of year my baby would have been due. For 20 years now, it still hurts. Nobody in the clinic tells you this stuff before the abortion.
In the cases of an ectopic pregnancy, both the mom and baby will die. This is a hard thing. Abortion is the only treatment option for the mother.
Jesus died for all sins, even abortion.

 

[leia]

May I ask why you began this thread, child?

 

[Kathryn13]

Not just a Baptist belief, but the biblical stance....It's always wrong to kill another human being...and a baby is a human being wheather it's inside a stomach or outside of it. The only exception to this is when it is self defense. If the mother is going to die, then the baby could sadly be aborted.

 

[arunma]

- but how can there be a exception to Gods law?

The argument against abortion (well, my argument anyway) is that a woman who aborts her child is killing a human life for her own personal convenience. I am not against abortion because the Republican party tells me so, or because Pat Robertson says that I'm not a Christian unless I "vote pro-life." I am against abortion because I genuinely think it amounts to murder. God's law is that we may not murder, and I don't need a politician to force the dogma on me.

The problem is that if a woman would lose her own life by having a child, then she is forced to choose between two lives. In good conscience, I can't ask one human to sacrifice her life for another. If that were the case, then we might as well charge people with murder for defending themselves against assailants. In fact, the commandment against murder prohibits causing a person's death through one's own negligence. Since I base my opposition to abortion on the Bible and not on political dogma, I think this is the only exception to the philosophy that abortion is sinful.

By the way, last I heard, George W. Bush agrees with me (in fact, he adds rape and incest to the list). He might have changed his position in the past few years, but I'm not sure.

 

[TwinCrier]

Abortion is murder. I've heard pro-choicers say that the early church didn't consider a baby to be 'ensouled' until the mother felt movement. Since women feel movement at different times during pregnancy and some not at all, this is not a relible method. I see no real evidence that such a belief was held, just that 'quickening' is what they called the moment when the mother 'felt' movement. Science shows that at conception, the zygote possesses 100% human dna that is unique. It is not part of the mother's body because it has different dna, and it is not a parasite because it is the same species of the 'host.' It's a human being in early development. As the old hymn od promise goes, In the bulb there is a flower; in the seed, an apple tree.

 

[woman.at.the.well]

Not just a Baptist belief, but the biblical stance....It's always wrong to kill another human being...and a baby is a human being wheather it's inside a stomach or outside of it. The only exception to this is when it is self defense. If the mother is going to die, then the baby could sadly be aborted.

and Amen.

 

[arunma]

I've heard pro-choicers say that the early church didn't consider a baby to be 'ensouled' until the mother felt movement.

That isn't true at all. The early Christians produced a document called the Didache, also known as the Teaching of the Apostles (you can Google it for the entire text), which they believed was an accurate reflection of the apostles' teachings. It was probably written around 200 AD. Here is the Didache's second commandment:

And this is the second commandment of the teaching.

{Thou shalt do no murder, thou shalt not commit adultery,} thou shalt not corrupt boys, thou shalt not commit fornication, {thou shalt not steal,} thou shalt not deal in magic, thou shalt do no sorcery, thou shalt not murder a child by abortion nor kill them when born, {thou shalt not covet thy neighbour's goods, thou shalt not perjure thyself, thou shalt not bear false witness,} thou shalt not speak evil, thou shalt not cherish a grudge, thou shalt not be double-minded nor double-tongued. (2:1-2)

​

It says quite clearly, "thou shalt not murder a child by abortion." If a pro-choicer ever tells you that the early church believed that abortion was acceptable, then please show this to them. Maybe it will soften their hearts to God's truth that even his little ones are precious to him.

 

[BibleDude89]

I doubt Christ would ever allow the murder of an innocent child in any cincumstance!

 

[Gwenyfur]

My views on abortions are pretty cut and dried...
There is never an excuse to take a human life. Whether or not *you* think it's a life and not a tumor is irrelevant to me. If someone aborts a child, they are committing murder...impure and simple.

Thou shalt not murder didn't just include adults...it covers children as well.

 

[GraceAnneWinter]

There's no definite Baptist view, because Baptists come in both liberal and conservative flavors. Most of us, however, strongly oppose abortion. We think it is a form of killing, and so we don't believe that anyone has the "right" to abortion anymore than people should have the right to conventional murder.

The only time I think abortion should be permitted is when it is necessary to save a mother's life. And even then, I think that all other options should first be exhausted.

Through God, all things are possible, so don't you think through the power of prayer the mother's life could be saved? And even if she were to die, it was all in God's plan. He has a reason for everything that happens. Therefore, that is why I, who goes to a Baptist church, believe there should be no exception to abortion. It is trying to change God's plan. It is sad and devastating when a girl is raped and becomes pregnant, but what if that baby was to be a wonderful missionary and be the reason why thousands learn of Christ's love. You just have to leave it to Him to take care of everything.

 

[Akathist]

[Mod Hat On]​

The following rules indicate what topics need citations. Personal experience and opinion is not considered a citation. You can use scripture or quotes from authoritative sources. All quotes need citations of where they came from (for example, what book or better, a link to a website that has the material for review) Bible verses need Book, chapter and verse number.

Here are the rules that indicate the topics that need citations.
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In addition, discussion of the above topics must be backed by evidence complete with citations. Standard citations are acceptable but links are preferred.

Any posts about abortion from this point forward that has no citations will be removed.

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[ZiSunka]

What is a citation?

 

[Akathist]

A citation is like a reference you would have in a paper for school. It is some other authoritative source to back up your opinion.

Many people prefer to use bible verses.

For example: Exodus 20:13
"You shall not murder." might be one someone who is anti abortion might use.

But it could be a reference to the Catholic Catacism. For example you might quote it and give the numbers that goes with it.

Or quote a famous or well known author like Billy Grahm, but include where you obtained the quote.

 

[ZiSunka]

So only ideas coming from other people are acceptable, and any ideas or opinions we have are unacceptable?

 

[ZiSunka]

Okay, here goes:

Abortion is wrong because it cheapens human life and makes human beings disposable if they are unwanted or unvalued. God says we are to see that other people are valuable, everyone. Selfishness should never be an excuse for terminating a life.

Let nothing be done through selfish ambition or conceit, but in lowliness of mind let each esteem others better than himself. Php 2:3

Yet, most abortions are a matter of convenience for women seeking abortion. According to Wikipedia, Planned Parenthood reports the following statistics for induced abortion:

The term "abortion" is usually used by lay people to refer to induced abortion. Women from 27 nations reported the following reasons for seeking an induced abortion: [1]

• 25.5% – Want to postpone childbearing
• 21.3% – Cannot afford a baby
• 14.1% – Has relationship problem or partner does not want pregnancy
• 12.2% – Too young; parent(s) or other(s) object to pregnancy
• 10.8% – Having a child will disrupt education or job
• 7.9% – Want no (more) children
• 3.3% – Risk to fetal health
• 2.8% – Risk to mother's health
• 2.1% – Rape, incest, other

In other words, more than 90% of abortions are elected due to non-medical reasons of not valuing the child as a human being or belief that the child will be an inconvenient burden or pressure from others who do not value the child or who see the child as an inconvenient burden.

If it's okay to murder an unwanted child before it is born, why is it illegal to kill it after it is born?

 

[ZiSunka]

As far as I know, we still live in a republic where majority rules, but while the majority Americans believe that abortion is too available (The United States: A CNN/USA Today/Gallup poll conducted in November 2005 revealed that 39% believe that abortion should be legal only in "a few circumstances" and another 16% think that it should be legal under "no circumstances", whereas 26% believe it should remain legal in "all circumstances" (the current law under Roe v. Wade) and 16% said it should be legal under "most circumstances". [18] Additional recent U.S. polling data can be found here. [19] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abortion), it is fully legal because of Supreme Court rulings.

As for the concept that legal abortion is safe and that deaths from abortion are a thing of the past, consider these stats:

In the book, ABORTED WOMEN, SILENT NO MORE, David Reardon interviewed women who had obtained legal abortions. His survey revealed that:

47% of all abortions result in some type of physical complication
6% have resulted in total hysterectomies
6% reported cervical cancer
8% had blocked fallopian tubes
9% had infections
8% had cervical incompetence
15% had post-operative hemorrhage
22% miscarried a later wanted child
(some reported more than one complication)
And those are the women that survived their abortions. Lawyers are now specializing in abortion malpractice, which wouldn't be possible if women were having safe abortions at these legalized clinics.

And what risks should women be willing to take in order to serve convenience or outside pressure? Should a boyfriend who doesn't want this baby cause a woman to endure a 50-50 chance of losing a future pregnancy or never having a child of her own at a later date? And do the high rate of abortion complications really mean that legal abortions are safe? It seems to me that if my doctor said to me, "I'm going to treat the wart on your hand, but it carries a 50-50 chance that you will never have children," I would not consider that safe in the least.

So, what is safe about the "safe, legal abortion" the pro-abortion people are always talking about?