No 1 Peter is not talking about water baptism"After being made alive, he went and made proclamation to the imprisoned spirits— to those who were disobedient long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water, and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge of a clear conscience toward God." 1Peter 3:19-21a NIV (my emphasis).
The meaning is clear: the reference is symbolic, but it's clear that water baptism saves you. (according to whoever wrote 1 Peter)
Non1 Peter is not talking about water baptism
The "one baptism" must be the saving baptism spoken of by Peter and Jesus. So, if we say that water was meant in that verse then we would have to add water baptism for salvation, which the scripture does not teach. The gospel has no mention of adding water to it ( read 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 KJV).
we read of the saving baptism in 1 peter 3:21;
"The like figure whereunto evenbaptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:"(1 Peter 3:21 KJV)
Notice that the saving baptism is not a putting away of the filth of the flesh (or an outward washing with water) but it is an inward work and a the response to the inquiery of a good conscience.
The conscience cannot be clean, or perfect or good by outward ordinances or shadows. But only by the inward work of the resurrected Lord and as we are risen with him to the newness of life. Then we have the witness in ourselves and a good conscience
consider some scripture here
"Which was a figure for the time then present, in which were offered both gifts and sacrifices, that could not make him that did the service perfect, as pertaining to the conscience;10 Which stood only in meats and drinks, and divers washings, and carnal ordinances, imposed on them until the time of reformation. 11 But Christ being come an high priest of good things to come, by a greater and more perfect tabernacle, not made with hands, that is to say, not of this building; 12 Neither by the blood of goats and calves, but by his own blood he entered in once into the holy place, having obtained eternal redemption for us. 13 For if the blood of bulls and of goats, and the ashes of an heifer sprinkling the unclean, sanctifieth to the purifying of the flesh: 14 How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?"(Hebrews 9:9-14 KJV)
The figure of the 8 souls saved in the ark is a type of believers being baptized into Christ and raised up with him into the new life raised above the water into the heavens and into rest in Christ
Your wrong the KJV is the Bible to be used today. But that’s a 45 hour talk maybe another time but many have already given good post on this.You can quote the KJV, then re-interpret it in modern English to mean what you want, but I prefer to read Scripture in the language that you and I and everyone else uses. Clearly 1 Peter 3:21 is referring to water baptism.
You then jump over to Hebrews and recommend reading 1 Corinthians (both in archaic Englyshe) to prove your erroneous interpretation. I strongly recommend using a modern translation that uses the language that we all use to understand what the Bible actually says.
No, the subject is the same being that of salvation. Here is some more info I wrote about this.You're hoping to change the subject then?
But being saved (or having the assurance of salvation) wasn't what we were discussing. It was about baptism.No, the subject is the same being that of salvation. Here is some more info I wrote about this.
Mark 16:16 “He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved”
Jesus tells us that two things are needed to be saved,..
When anyone believes this gospel and is baptized they shall be SAVED. We must therefore define what the baptism is here, because this is of vital importance...
In my view (and that of most Christian churches) you've simply misunderstood Paul. There is no way to make the various references to baptisms being performed that we find in the New Testament be understood as just somebody having a brainstorm or new spiritual insights, completely unrelated to the physical act that is sacramental baptism. So, it's too bad that we cannot come to agreement, but it looks like that won't happen.This two fold aspect of “believe” and “be baptised” to be saved, is identical to being saved by “faith” and “grace”. This is revealed in many types in the Old Testament, one being the water crossings of Moses and Joshua.
As I showed before , the word baptism does not mean just water baptism. Scripture is clear in this truth. But to make baptism only water baptism misses the spiritual dimension and the other baptisms.But being saved (or having the assurance of salvation) wasn't what we were discussing. It was about baptism.
In my view (and that of most Christian churches) you've simply misunderstood Paul. There is no way to make the various references to baptisms being performed that we find in the New Testament be understood as just somebody having a brainstorm or new spiritual insights, completely unrelated to the physical act that is sacramental baptism. So, it's too bad that we cannot come to agreement, but it looks like that won't happen.
Yeah, it does. All other references to "baptism" in Scripture are called that as a comparison to actual baptism, what you call "water baptism."As I showed before , the word baptism does not mean just water baptism.
Immersion doesn’t only mean water believers are immersed into Christ as wellYeah, it does. All other references to "baptism" in Scripture are called that as a comparison to actual baptism, what you call "water baptism."
It's like calling something a "baptism of fire" these days. When that is said, it doesn't mean there literally IS a religious initiation in which the candidate walks on hot coals or something like that. No, the phrase simply means that whatever he went through was like sacramental baptism for being the experience that started him on some path, etc or initiated him into something. It's an analogy.
Besides, you have argued that the word baptism means immersion. It does...and also can mean to dip or wash or several other actions involving water!!
So now you are arguing that there are some other actions or events that don't even use water! Everything about what Christ showed us in his own baptism, what he commanded his Apostles to go and do, and what the New Testament describes several famous converts doing as a result of having confessed Christ...have been turned into just a figurative references.
I am aware of these things but much of this has nothing to do with scripture.skip read to here.
Chapter 7. Concerning Baptism. And concerning baptism, baptize this way: Having first said all these things, baptize into the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit, in living water. But if you have no living water, baptize into other water; and if you cannot do so in cold water, do so in warm. But if you have neither, pour out water three times upon the head into the name of Father and Son and Holy Spirit. But before the baptism let the baptizer fast, and the baptized, and whoever else can; but you shall order the baptized to fast one or two days before.
Didache. The Teaching of the Twelve Apostles (translation Roberts-Donaldson).
Hebrews 6:2
English Standard Version
2 and of instruction about washings, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment.
Common English Bible
Chapter Parallel
Hebrews 6:2 (CEB) of teaching about ritual ways to wash with water, laying on of hands, the resurrection from the dead, and eternal judgment—all over again.
The Message Bible
Hebrews 6:2 (MSG) baptismal instructions; laying on of hands; resurrection of the dead; eternal judgment.
New American Standard Bible
Hebrews 6:2 (NAS) of instruction about washings and laying on of hands, and the resurrection of the dead and eternal judgment.
New International Reader's Version
Hebrews 6:2 (NIRV) They taught us about different kinds of baptism. They taught us about placing hands on people. They taught us that people will rise from the dead. They taught us that God will judge everyone. And they taught us that what he decides will last forever.
New International Version
Hebrews 6:2 (NIV) instruction about cleansing rites, the laying on of hands, the resurrection of the dead, and eternal judgment.
Hebrews 9:10
They are only a matter of food and drink and various ceremonial washings—external regulations applying until the time of the new order.
I am looking at possibilities. 1.) The different modes of baptism in the Didache. 2.) places where baptism of the Spirit and other types are used in a figurative sense.
We should encourage discussion that is true .and consider each persons input. However some things are not according to scripture and the truth in the Spirit.I think we should value each person's input.
Every water dunking was figurative just as circumcision was figurative and animal sacrifices and all other “diverse washings and carnal ordinances imposed on them until the time of reformation” (Hebrews 9) .Yeah, it does. All other references to "baptism" in Scripture are called that as a comparison to actual baptism, what you call "water baptism."
It's like calling something a "baptism of fire" these days. When that is said, it doesn't mean there literally IS a religious initiation in which the candidate walks on hot coals or something like that. No, the phrase simply means that whatever he went through was like sacramental baptism for being the experience that started him on some path, etc or initiated him into something. It's an analogy.
Besides, you have argued that the word baptism means immersion. It does...and also can mean to dip or wash or several other actions involving water!!
So now you are arguing that there are some other actions or events that don't even use water! Everything about what Christ showed us in his own baptism, what he commanded his Apostles to go and do, and what the New Testament describes several famous converts doing as a result of having confessed Christ...have been turned into just a figurative references.
Proof is hereThat strange theory is completely at odds with the testimony of the New Testament and there is no evidence to the contrary. Therefore, this issue is not worth debating further.
All baptisms in scripture are NOT water baptism as I showed in previous textYeh, it does.
What I teach is not a strange theory it is all seen in scripture as I have been showing, and it is harder to maintain a man made tradition as many have about water baptism today and the added words men put to scripture to make it fit.That strange theory is completely at odds with the testimony of the New Testament and there is no evidence to the contrary. Therefore, this issue is not worth debating further.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?