Baptismal Regeneration

[JM]

Hey folks,

How did you become convinced of baptismal regeneration, what was it that convince you?

Yours in the Lord,

jm

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Hey folks,

How did you become convinced of baptismal regeneration, what was it that convince you?

Yours in the Lord,

jm

Are you talking about the baptism of His Holy Spirit?

 

[JM]

"Baptismal regeneration is the name given to doctrines held by the Catholic, Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, Lutheran, Anglican churches, and other Protestant denominations which maintain that salvation is intimately linked to the act of baptism, without necessarily holding that salvation is impossible apart from it." Wikipedia

 

[Daniel9v9]

It was a bit of a journey for me and something I wrestled with, as growing up, I understood Baptism as a public declaration of faith. But what eventually compelled me to change my position was simply God's Word, which describes Baptism with a much richer language than what I had previously been taught.

So, in other words, I think if we read everything the Scriptures have to say about Baptism, the question isn't really why we should embrace Baptismal regeneration, but why anyone should think less of Baptism. That is, the burden of proof is not on those who hold to the orthodox teaching of Baptismal regeneration, but on those who reject it. But the difficulty with this is that we can't simply compare what one church body teaches about Baptism against what another church body teaches. We have to look at their entire theological system and understand how Baptism fits into the different systems.

Very simply, though. I think a strong case can be made from the words of Paul, who says: "When the goodness and loving kindness of God our Saviour appeared, He saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to His own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Saviour, so that being justified by His grace we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life."

And: "Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave Himself up for her, that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, so that He might present the church to Himself in splendour, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish."

 

[JM]

I'm listening to the Being Lutheran podcast on baptism.

 

[Shane R]

It was a bit of a journey for me and something I wrestled with, as growing up, I understood Baptism as a public declaration of faith. But what eventually compelled me to change my position was simply God's Word, which describes Baptism with a much richer language than what I had previously been taught.

So, in other words, I think if we read everything the Scriptures have to say about Baptism, the question isn't really why we should embrace Baptismal regeneration, but why anyone should think less of Baptism. That is, the burden of proof is not on those who hold to the orthodox teaching of Baptismal regeneration, but on those who reject it. But the difficulty with this is that we can't simply compare what one church body teaches about Baptism against what another church body teaches. We have to look at their entire theological system and understand how Baptism fits into the different systems.

Very simply, though. I think a strong case can be made from the words of Paul, who says: "When the goodness and loving kindness of God our Saviour appeared, He saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to His own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit, whom He poured out on us richly through Jesus Christ our Saviour, so that being justified by His grace we might become heirs according to the hope of eternal life."

And: "Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave Himself up for her, that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, so that He might present the church to Himself in splendour, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish."

You and I know what those passages are about but most evangelicals and Pentecostals would choose to be obtuse and argue that these are not referring to baptism, since the precise word is not used.

 

[Daniel9v9]

You and I know what those passages are about but most evangelicals and Pentecostals would choose to be obtuse and argue that these are not referring to baptism, since the precise word is not used.

Oh, yeah, I can relate to this! But that's why I think it's very helpful to compare and discuss theological systems in their entirety as opposed to one aspect of them. However, if we were to begin with the doctrine of Baptism, perhaps a good place to start is with what they assert is the mode and function of Baptism, then simply read everything God's Word has to say about Baptism. Then once we've done that, then we can look at the passages mentioned above. But it's a long walk and it's difficult to convey in a few words — at least for me!

In my experience, they may not be entirely compelled, but they tend to be more open to it once they see how the Bible talks about Baptism. Namely, in connection to faith, salvation, forgiveness of sins, a birth from above, the gift of the Holy Spirit, entering the kingdom of God, being baptised into Jesus’ death, a good conscience, a circumcision of Christ, a washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit, a baptism into Christ, putting on Christ etc.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Hey folks,

How did you become convinced of baptismal regeneration, what was it that convince you?

Yours in the Lord,

jm

The short version? I had to stop fighting Scripture and learn to believe the words I was reading meant what they said.

The long version? Learning to understand that the Sacraments are not works we do for God, which is how I saw them growing up outside of the Lutheran tradition (I was raised Evangelical/Pentecostal), and that ironically it was the decision-based theology I had grown up with that was actually works-based salvation was instrumental and also a very large hill for me to get over. In some ways it was an "Aha! Eureka!" moment followed by more of those and a very long process of de-programming and re-learning a lot of things.

But I had been through that process before with other things, when I finally realized that I couldn't support pre-tribulation rapturism with Scripture without butchering the Bible I had to deal with the fallout that I would have to be willing to challenge and question things I had been taught to believe and go and read more Scripture and do more study with theology. So that helped prepare me for later challenging issues. That I could be wrong about something and learn to be corrected by Scripture.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Markie Boy]

This is one I'm not sold on yet, due to simple evidence.

I have seen many people that were baptized as infants, and through their life they surely do not look "Regenerated".

I simply can't say that baptism Alone regenerates based on the world around me. Baptism and faith - yes - just baptism, I feel like I'd be denying reality.

 

[ViaCrucis]

This is one I'm not sold on yet, due to simple evidence.

I have seen many people that were baptized as infants, and through their life they surely do not look "Regenerated".

I simply can't say that baptism Alone regenerates based on the world around me. Baptism and faith - yes - just baptism, I feel like I'd be denying reality.

I'd want to point out two things in relation to this:

1) We should be exceedingly careful about trying to judge another person's status before God based on the things we see. Each and every single one of us is a sinner, and there are times in our lives which may be highs and others which may be lows. And each Christian is a work in progress, so that even if it may not be obvious, God has still committed Himself to working in us and on us, to conform us to His Son.

2) That we were baptized and that we believe does not mean that we cannot make shipwreck of our faith. Apostasy is very real, and Scripture warns many times about the dangers of grieving the Spirit, of making shipwreck of our faith, of letting sin come in and choking us and killing us and which may drive us toward throwing God's promises away and returning to a life of faithlessness. Which is why the Scriptures also teach us and tell us to inhabit prayer and repentance, to inhabit a life of confession and believing, to be at the receiving end of God's grace through the Means of Word and Sacrament. Jesus told us He is the Vine and we are the branches, we need Him; we don't just need Jesus that first day we believed we need Jesus every hour of every day, and every second of every hour, 24 hours a day, seven days a week, every day of the year, every year.

That you may see someone who was baptized as an infant who, today, is not walking in faith doesn't mean God's promises failed. No more than if you see someone who as an adult, was brought to faith, and then later on turned and walked away from the faith nullify God's promises. The word of God does not fail, but we do. We can only have confidence and assurance of our salvation in Christ through faith. Without Christ, without faith, we have nothing. Which is why we don't believe "only baptism regenerates", it is the faith which baptism gives and strengthens that is our regeneration from God, and so we are to live and walk and abide in our baptism, in the promises of God which are in our baptism. And at the same time, make sure that we do not dismiss a person out of hand, for what the eyes cannot see God does see.

-CryptoLutheran