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CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.
Baptism
- Thread starter Meshavrischika
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Yes, as an adult you have to voluntarily be baptized. Kidnapping people and dunking them, or stealthily doing it to people in their sleep while they are unaware would be invalid.
I think you're putting the proverbial cart in front of the horse. While it's a true statement that an adult must believe to be saved, we must understand that that's because with belief comes the action of being baptized, or at least it always has among all but a few small groups. So you can say the belief saves or baptism saves and both are correct, if we understand their relationship correctly. If our belief leads us to be yoked to Christ in baptism, then it was the first step toward being saved. If we believe and do nothing, then we will perish in the age to come--think of the seeds sewn among weeds or on rocks.
Basil
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but you make it an obligation when it is not obligation, but has rewards and is the fruit of who you are.
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Thekla
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which is likely why you don't "practice" this; but please understand - for those of us who adhere to this understanding, it would be deeply remiss to not practice as we do.
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obviously, but this does not make one's interpretation "right" for anyone but the person practicing.
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In Acts 2:38, Peter, by inspiration of the Holy Ghost, told his listeners to be baptized. "Be baptized" is in the imperative mood, a command. ['Repent' in this verse is also in the imperative mood.]
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Thekla
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actually, I would say responsibility; responsibility is a manifestation or result of love. Responsibility is relational. So, in this sense, it is my responsibility to feed my children. I do this because I love them. I may not feel like doing it (cooking, going to the grocery, etc), and then it feels like work/doing/obligation.
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ah. so PETER said. normally, when God says something the text looks like this:
"God said..." which really happens quite often if you look. Do you think that maybe just the listeners in that group were told this?
"God said..." which really happens quite often if you look. Do you think that maybe just the listeners in that group were told this?
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then it's self imposed responsibility because it's not like eating and breathing, but again, that goes to you practicing what you believe. I just stand on "don't say YOU MUST to anyone else"
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MamaZ
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Notice though that He does not say that who is not baptized will be condemned but those who disbelieve.
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I appreciate that, but not everyone will/can be baptized... and not everyone who does not is destined to "death".
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God thru Peter said to repent and be baptized, Peter's words were inspired by the Holy Spirit. As Paul tells Timothy "all scripture" is given by inspiration of God, 1 Tim 3:16.
ElasnRandiMom said:
No. What Peter was doing in Acts 2:38 was carrying out the great commission of the Lord per Lk 24:47. This is Luke's account of the great commission where Jesus said "repentance and remission of sins should be preached in His name among all nations beginning at Jerusalem." So Acts 2:38 began with Peter at Jerusalem and was to go to all nations from there.
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Jesus said for Zacheus to come down from the tree... should we ALL come down? or was that a situational reference?
come on people. you really have to look at context and the fact that most of this was correspondance, not "a book".
come on people. you really have to look at context and the fact that most of this was correspondance, not "a book".
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MamaZ
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Baptism is not what wll save you. Believing in Christ is salvation.. For in Him alone does salvation come. We are told that those who do not believe will be condemned. For they are condemned already for they have not believed in Jesus..
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In Acts 16:30,31, the jailer asked 'what must I do to be saved?'. He was told by Paul to "believe". The verb "believe" here is in the imperative mood also, hence believing is commanded. Is Paul's commands just as binding as Peter's? Was Paul's words just as inspired as Peter's? If the command to be baptized is optional then why not the command to believe be optional also?
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