Baptism question???

[Stinker]

Ephesians 5:25-6 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her to make her holy, cleansing her by the washing with water through the word, and to present her to himself as a radiant church, without stain or wrinkle or any other blemish, but holy and blameless.

Titus 3:4-7 But when the kindness and love of God our Savior appeared, he saved us, not because of righteous things we had done, but because of his mercy. He saved us through the washing of rebirth and renewal by the Holy Spirit, whom he poured out on us generously through Jesus Christ our Savior, so that, having been justified by his grace, we might become heirs having the hope of eternal life.

1 Peter 3:18-22 For Christ died for sins once for all, the righteous for the unrighteous, to bring you to God. He was put to death in the body but made alive by the Spirit, through whom also he went and preached to the spirits in prison who disobeyed long ago when God waited patiently in the days of Noah while the ark was being built. In it only a few people, eight in all, were saved through water, and this water symbolizes baptism that now saves you also—not the removal of dirt from the body but the pledge[e] of a good conscience toward God. It saves you by the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who has gone into heaven and is at God's right hand—with angels, authorities and powers in submission to him.

Acts 2:38 Peter replied, "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit."

Rom 6:3-4 Or don't you know that all of us who were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into his death? 4We were therefore buried with him through baptism into death in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead through the glory of the Father, we too may live a new life.

Heb 10:22-23 Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, with our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water. Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for he who promised is faithful.

Acts 22:12-16 "And one Ananias, a devout man according to the law, well spoken of by all the Jews who lived there, came to me, and standing by me said to me, 'Brother Saul, receive your sight.' And at that very hour I received my sight and saw him. And he said, 'The God of our fathers appointed you to know his will, to see the Righteous One and to hear a voice from his mouth; for you will be a witness for him to everyone of what you have seen and heard. And now why do you wait? Rise and be baptized and wash away your sins, calling on his name.'"

Gal 3:26-27 You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, 27for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ.


Nope. Nothing "symbolic" about any of that. I really have doubts about liberals who don't believe what the Bible says....

I do not think a person should quote passages that they think support water baptism as being essential to the forgiveness of sins, that begin at Acts 2:38

I would like to know how all the people that were water baptized by Christ and His immediate disciples, got into Christ (Rom.6:3-6) without being re-baptized?

Consider:
Jesus was administering this same baptism near the end of John the Baptist's carreer. He administered it to His immediate disciples who in turn administered it upon their converts. The only difference between the two was that Jesus was administering it (via His disciples Jn.4:2) by His own authority (in His own name).

After Christ's resurrection He commanded His disciples to, "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit:" (Mt.28:19)

Now, many are taught today (by implication) that everyone that was water baptized by Christ and His disciples....had to be re-baptized after His resurrection! They imply through their teaching, that water baptism puts one's soul into contact with Christ's blood. Since Christ had not shed His blood till the day He was stripped, whipped, beaten, and then crucified, their teaching implies that He and His disciples were doing the work of John the Baptist when they were making and water baptizing more disciples than he was.

The real truth that the water baptism that Christ was administering in Aenon near to Salim (Jn.3:22-23), was later to be coined the Baptism of the Great Commission, is found in Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,...

This verse teaches that everyone who was a disciple of John the Baptist was commanded to become a disciple of Jesus Christ and be re-baptized, this time in His name. That everyone who was a disciple of the Pharisees was commanded to become a disciple of Jesus Christ and be baptized in His name.

Later on, it is recorded that every time a disciple of John the Baptist was found, they were re-baptized, this time in the name of Jesus Christ. (Acts 18:25, 19:1-5)

Therefore, the water baptism of Mt.28:19 (Great Commission) was first administered by Christ near the end of John the Baptist's mission:

John 3:22 (New International Version)


John the Baptist's Testimony About Jesus

22After this, Jesus and his disciples went out into the Judean countryside, where he spent some time with them, and baptized.
23Now John also was baptizing at Aenon near Salim, because there was plenty of water, and people were constantly coming to be baptized.


26They came to John and said to him, "Rabbi, that man who was with you on the other side of the Jordan—the one you testified about—well, he is baptizing, and everyone is going to him."

 

[KEPLER]

I do not think a person should quote passages that they think support water baptism as being essential to the forgiveness of sins, that begin at Acts 2:38

I would like to know how all the people that were water baptized by Christ and His immediate disciples, got into Christ (Rom.6:3-6) without being re-baptized?

Consider:
Jesus was administering this same baptism near the end of John the Baptist's carreer. He administered it to His immediate disciples who in turn administered it upon their converts. The only difference between the two was that Jesus was administering it (via His disciples Jn.4:2) by His own authority (in His own name).

After Christ's resurrection He commanded His disciples to, "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit:" (Mt.28:19)

Now, many are taught today (by implication) that everyone that was water baptized by Christ and His disciples....had to be re-baptized after His resurrection! They imply through their teaching, that water baptism puts one's soul into contact with Christ's blood. Since Christ had not shed His blood till the day He was stripped, whipped, beaten, and then crucified, their teaching implies that He and His disciples were doing the work of John the Baptist when they were making and water baptizing more disciples than he was.

The real truth that the water baptism that Christ was administering in Aenon near to Salim (Jn.3:22-23), was later to be coined the Baptism of the Great Commission, is found in Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,...

This verse teaches that everyone who was a disciple of John the Baptist was commanded to become a disciple of Jesus Christ and be re-baptized, this time in His name. That everyone who was a disciple of the Pharisees was commanded to become a disciple of Jesus Christ and be baptized in His name.

Later on, it is recorded that every time a disciple of John the Baptist was found, they were re-baptized, this time in the name of Jesus Christ. (Acts 18:25, 19:1-5)

Therefore, the water baptism of Mt.28:19 (Great Commission) was first administered by Christ near the end of John the Baptist's mission:

John 3:22 (New International Version)


John the Baptist's Testimony About Jesus

22After this, Jesus and his disciples went out into the Judean countryside, where he spent some time with them, and baptized.
23Now John also was baptizing at Aenon near Salim, because there was plenty of water, and people were constantly coming to be baptized.


26They came to John and said to him, "Rabbi, that man who was with you on the other side of the Jordan—the one you testified about—well, he is baptizing, and everyone is going to him."

Stinker,

We all read this the first time you posted it and doesn't make any more sense now than it did then. This is nothing but utter confusion, questions all the attributes of God, and virtually denies the Divinity of Christ. Whoever is teaching you this cr@p oughtta be run out of town.

 

[KEPLER]

Ok.

Yes, really. Why? It has to do with a relationship with Jesus Christ, our Lord and God. For there to be a relationship, it takes two. Our focus is all about Jesus, but it takes Him and us coming together to make it so.

God bless,

Lucas

You see, this is where the "warm-n-fuzzy" "personal realtionship" "walks in the garden with me" Jesus and the Jesus of the Bible collide into a vast cosmic explosion.

Lucas (hold your breath, what I'm about to say is REALLY going to upset you!): JESUS. IS. NOT. YOUR. GIRLFRIEND.

He is the Ancient of Days. He is One with the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. He is God in the Flesh.

Using an analogy about a "personal relationship" as the baseline for how we relate to God in Christ takes away significantly from the actual relationship.

Jesus is the Mighty Warrior: we are the helplesss victims snatched from the jaws of death.

We don't relate (primarily) to Jesus like our "best buddy"...our primary relationship to Jesus is more like our relationship to our Cardiologist after a massive myocardial infarction: AWE. UNEXPRESSABLE GRATITUDE. ABSOLUTE UNBELIEF AT HOW CLOSE WE CAME TO DEATH. But we do not say to cardiologist, "Hey! Let's go get a chocolate Sundae!" Aside fromlecturing us about the cholesterol in Ice Cream, he's got more work to do, more lives to save. And he has to continue monitoring us, cuz we still may slip away at any second.

Sure, my relationship with my cardiologist "takes two": me, at death's door, and the doctor, the only one who can save my life.

The only thing we "contribute" to our relationship with God is sin, death, disease, anger and hatred.

And He loves us anyway.

He gives us a gift in baptism. How stupid would we be not to receive it?

 

[CaDan]

DEAL. WITH. THE. TEXT.

Just had to repeat this.

 

[Asinner]

JESUS. IS. NOT. YOUR. GIRLFRIEND.

This is my favorite.

God Bless

 

[CaDan]

[/SIZE][/FONT]This is my favorite.

God Bless

Just saw it myself.

I've even used that phrase myself when I'm making fun of bad CCM.

Hint: If you can replace the chorus with "Jesus is my girlfriend," it's bad CCM.

 

[Endotek06]

If it is a requirement to be baptised for salvation, what happended to the theif on the cross next to Jesus? He was not baptised. "And Jesus said unto him, verily, I say unto thee, Today shalt thou be with me in paradise." Luke 23:43. One cannot argue that it was Jesus who saved him because Jesus saves everyone who accepts, we only speak the words. Baptism is very important. Jesus was baptised and we are to be like Jesus, it also shows our obedience to Him.

Couldn't agree more! While it's apparent that baptism isn't necessary to make it into Heaven, our Bible also teaches us to be Christlike. Jesus' ministry began with His baptism (Matthew 3). Likewise, if you want to be Christlike, you should get baptised if you're not already.

 

[Stinker]

Stinker,

We all read this the first time you posted it and doesn't make any more sense now than it did then. This is nothing but utter confusion, questions all the attributes of God, and virtually denies the Divinity of Christ. Whoever is teaching you this cr@p oughtta be run out of town.

I might understand that what I posted could be confusing to some people, but to charge that my post questions all the attributes of God and virtually denies the divinity of Christ ????

How does my post do that? Please give me at least one example in my post that does that.

If it is too confusing for anyone to do so, then one should not make those kinds of charges against it.

 

[LibraryOwl]

So far as we know, the 'old covenant', and the 'new covenant' are the only sure ways to salvation, and baptism and faith in Christ are the conditoins of the new covenant.

I define Baptism as the 'profession of faith' in the trinity, as well as the administering of some quantity of water.

But faith is, to me, the 'action of faith', that is to say, the repentance of sin, and the committing of sin without presumption, that being a process we grow into, with the actual bar of faith required for salvation ebing low, but that bar being high enough that, no godfearing man should fail to aspire to push himself higher.

Of course, God is allmighty, and his judgements all-wise. God can save anybody he wants to save, after all, he shall 'look into the hearts of the philosophers, and judge them but what is in thier hearts.'

But Christian teaching should remain confined to the new covenant.

 

[f.o.o.t.man]

How necessary is baptism to our salvation as christians? Is it a requirement or just a sacrament that gives us grace from God?

God bless,

Lucas

Baptism is not necessary for salvation. It does not give us additional grace either. Rather, it is an act of obedience as well as a public statement. When John the Baptist baptized, people came to be baptized because they identified with John's message of repentance. In the same way, when Jesus commissioned his disciples to make disciples and then to baptize, he called people to identify with Jesus' gospel of salvation. Baptism is both a command and a responsibility that we have AFTER we have given our life to Christ. I must emphasize that BAPTISM IN NO WAY DETERMINES A PERSON'S SALVATION! BAPTISM IS AN ACT OF OBEDIENCE! Only putting your faith and trust in Jesus ALONE will guaranttee salvation. Jesus + [anything else] = Nothing and it certainly doesn't equal heaven.

 

[KEPLER]

I might understand that what I posted could be confusing to some people, but to charge that my post questions all the attributes of God and virtually denies the divinity of Christ ????

How does my post do that? Please give me at least one example in my post that does that.

If it is too confusing for anyone to do so, then one should not make those kinds of charges against it.

Fair enough. Let's start with the part that your post is utter confusion. Perhaps if it were worded better, I would not be so suspicious...we shall see.

I do not think a person should quote passages that they think support water baptism as being essential to the forgiveness of sins, that begin at Acts 2:38

Not sure at all what this sentence means...? Are there words missing?

I would like to know how all the people that were water baptized by Christ and His immediate disciples, got into Christ (Rom.6:3-6) without being re-baptized?

Erm, "all the people" ?? Which people?

Consider:
Jesus was administering this same baptism near the end of John the Baptist's carreer. He administered it to His immediate disciples who in turn administered it upon their converts. The only difference between the two was that Jesus was administering it (via His disciples Jn.4:2) by His own authority (in His own name).

Uh, "this same baptism"...??? "same" as WHAT? To what does "this" refer? Pronouns without antecedents give me a headache.

After Christ's resurrection He commanded His disciples to, "Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Spirit:" (Mt.28:19)

Ah! Something clear. Yes, I agree. Jesus did do that.

Now, many are taught today (by implication) that everyone that was water baptized by Christ and His disciples....had to be re-baptized after His resurrection!

Really? Never heard that one before. Can you elaborate? Is there a particular sect or cult that teaches this? I know of no "standard" Christian denomination which teaches this. Don't get me wrong...I'm not doubting you. I am genuinely curious.

They imply through their teaching, that water baptism puts one's soul into contact with Christ's blood.

"They"...? The word "they" in this sentence refers to the most recent subject. The most recent subject is the "many" who "are taught". But I suspect that the "many" are not the "they" to whom you wanted to refer...I suspect the "they" ought to refer to those who are teaching the "many"...but that's not actually what you said.

There are rules for using pronouns. You would do well to learn them.

However, I suppose (by extension) that I believe something like this. Paul tells us that those who have been baptized have been "clothed with Christ" (Gal 3:27). So, yes, according to Paul, Baptism most definitely connects us the Christ's saving work. No doubt about it.

Since Christ had not shed His blood till the day He was stripped, whipped, beaten, and then crucified, their teaching implies that He and His disciples were doing the work of John the Baptist when they were making and water baptizing more disciples than he was.

And here is the rub. At this point, you deny both the omnipotence and omnipresence of God, you strip Christ of His Divinity, and you deny Scripture all in one sentence.

1) omnipotence -- God is capable of working any kind of miracle he wants. The laws of physics to which we are accustomed do not circumscribe God. Physics exists inside of God. You rob God of his power when you suggest that God cannot apply the benefits of Christ's work on Cross backwards in time.

2) omnipresence -- omnipresence applies to both space AND time. God is everywhere and God is everytime. The Crucifixion of Christ was a real historical event, but in God's time, the Lamb was slain before the foundations of the Earth were laid. (Rev 13:8) From our persepctive, the Cross is a single moment; from God's perspective, it is eternal (as is the Resurrection). You suggest here that God is LIMITED to a specific moment in time.

3) Divinity of Christ -- Since the attributes of God the father are also true of God the Son, you strip Christ of His Divinity when you suggest that someone Baptized before the Resurrection was not baptized into Christ.

4) Denial of Scripture -- Paul says explicitly that the Jews wandering in Sinai drank the SAME spiritual drink that we drink, and that the Rock from which they drank was Christ. So, apparently, God is indeed capable of supplying Christ's benefits backward in time a few hundred years...

ALL of the benefits that Christ won on the Cross are applied in Baptism (Christ's baptism, not John's)...whether or not a person was Baptized before or after the Cross. God is not limited by time; he can apply the benefits in any spatial or temporal direction He wishes.

The real truth that the water baptism that Christ was administering in Aenon near to Salim (Jn.3:22-23), was later to be coined the Baptism of the Great Commission, is found in Acts 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, "Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins,...

"Baptism of the Great Commission"...??? please cite the Scripture that uses such a phrase.

TEXT TEXT TEXT TEXT

This verse teaches that everyone who was a disciple of John the Baptist was commanded to become a disciple of Jesus Christ and be re-baptized, this time in His name. That everyone who was a disciple of the Pharisees was commanded to become a disciple of Jesus Christ and be baptized in His name.

Although what you say is technically true, this verse most definitely does NOT "teach" it. Peter was preaching to non-believing Jews. (When I say "non-believing, I mean non-believing in Christ). The text says nothing about whether anyone in the crowd had previously been baptized by John or not.

TEXT TEXT TEXT TEXT

Later on, it is recorded that every time a disciple of John the Baptist was found, they were re-baptized, this time in the name of Jesus Christ. (Acts 18:25, 19:1-5)

Correct.

Therefore, the water baptism of Mt.28:19 (Great Commission) was first administered by Christ near the end of John the Baptist's mission:

Umm, do you know what the word "therefore" means? It means you are drawing a conclusion from two or more previously asserted facts, or "premises". So, either you did not clearly elucidate the premises from which you are trying to draw a conclusion....or, you just don't know what "therefore" means. I'm not sure which.

At any rate, I suppose I agree with this...the first "Christian" (i.e., Trinitarian, through which the Holy Spirit works to create, enrich and nourish faith in the hearts of the believers) baptisms are those in John.

So, let me see if I have gleaned your basic argument:
1) The Baptism of Acts 2:38 is the same as the Baptisms of John 3.
2) The Baptisms of John 3 occurred before the Crucifixion.
3) Since the Crucifixion had not yet happened, the benefits of Christ's death (i.e., forgiveness, etc.) could NOT have been conveyed through those Baptisms.
4) And thus, the Baptisms in Acts 2:38 (which we have already established are the same as John 3) also cannot convey the benefits.

Is that the argument?

Poor little Jesus is constrained by space and time....?

My friend, your God is too small.

Peace,

Kepler

 

[Stinker]

Thank you for responding KEPLER.


The conclusion then is that one is in a logical dilemma if they wish to stay with the teaching that the Spiritual blessings of heaven (Eph.1:3) are not bestowed to one till they are water baptized in the name of Christ.

I think now maybe the picture is more clear that the logic of the scripture demands not a physical water baptism into the Spiritual body of Christ, but a spiritual baptism of one's soul via the Holy Spirit. (1Cor.12:13)

 

[Loukuss]

I'm going to start off by saying to you, Kepler, that your arrogant teaching style is not welcomed in this discussion. I understand that you feel you are right and you need to prove it to everyone here, but your way of doing that falls so short of glorifying God its not even funny. With that said, I'll respond to you comments.

You see, this is where the "warm-n-fuzzy" "personal realtionship" "walks in the garden with me" Jesus and the Jesus of the Bible collide into a vast cosmic explosion.

You and I see our Lord a lot differently. My relationship with my Lord is what it is and you are in no place to really say what IT is.

Lucas (hold your breath, what I'm about to say is REALLY going to upset you!): JESUS. IS. NOT. YOUR. GIRLFRIEND.

*gasp* NOOOOO WAAAAY!! *sarcasm over*

He is the Ancient of Days. He is One with the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob. He is God in the Flesh.

Thanks for the history lesson.

Using an analogy about a "personal relationship" as the baseline for how we relate to God in Christ takes away significantly from the actual relationship.

That is your opinion and your free to have it. I have a personal relationship with my Father and I know how I relate with Him.

Jesus is the Mighty Warrior: we are the helplesss victims snatched from the jaws of death.

Jesus is my bestfriend. I talk with Him when I'm having difficulties in this world, and He helps me sort things out. yes, I am pretty helpless when I do things on my own, but with Him I can do many things.

We don't relate (primarily) to Jesus like our "best buddy"

'We'? I know you're not talking for me.

...our primary relationship to Jesus is more like our relationship to our Cardiologist after a massive myocardial infarction: AWE. UNEXPRESSABLE GRATITUDE. ABSOLUTE UNBELIEF AT HOW CLOSE WE CAME TO DEATH. But we do not say to cardiologist, "Hey! Let's go get a chocolate Sundae!" Aside fromlecturing us about the cholesterol in Ice Cream, he's got more work to do, more lives to save. And he has to continue monitoring us, cuz we still may slip away at any second.

It seems that you only see one way of having a relationship with God. I dont share your views, as I find them very narrowminded and far from the truth. You go ahead and treat God like your cardiologist and hopefully that works for you. Myself, I'll treat Him like my loving Father who wants to have a beautiful relationship with me.

Sure, my relationship with my cardiologist "takes two": me, at death's door, and the doctor, the only one who can save my life.

That's nice.

The only thing we "contribute" to our relationship with God is sin, death, disease, anger and hatred.

You couldn't be further from the truth. To each their own.

And He loves us anyway.

Agreed.

He gives us a gift in baptism. How stupid would we be not to receive it?

We would be only hurting ourselves not to partake in baptism.
Do you tell people that they are stupid if they dont partake in baptism? Good teaching method.

Kepler, before you respond, can you please leave the arrogance and pride at the front door? Maybe people would listen to you more if you acted a lot more Christ-like...

 

[KEPLER]

Thank you for responding KEPLER.

The conclusion then is that one is in a logical dilemma if they wish to stay with the teaching that the Spiritual blessings of heaven (Eph.1:3) are not bestowed to one till they are water baptized in the name of Christ.

One is also in a "logical dilemma" if he wishes to believe that a dead guy came back to life.

I don't give a rat's @$$ about logical dilemmas. The Scriptures are full of mysteries which we cannot comprehend: we see through a glass but darkly, as Paul says.

I think now maybe the picture is more clear that the logic of the scripture demands not a physical water baptism into the Spiritual body of Christ, but a spiritual baptism of one's soul via the Holy Spirit. (1Cor.12:13)

Feel free to prattle on about the "logic of Scriputre" (whatever that means) all you want. As for me, I will deal with the TEXT.

BTW, Stinker, I suspect that you think that I am arguing that Baptism is the EXCLUSIVE way which God bestows the benefits of Christ's sacrifice. I am not arguing this, nor has anything I have said even remotely implied it. If you THINK that what I am saying implies this, that's because you are stuck on the idea that Baptism is OUR action. Get over it. Baptism is God's action; God is the active party. God is the ONLY active party. Baptism is a gift given to us so that we KNOW that God has "gotten to us". Now, God (acting in his omnipotent majersty) can certainly get to us any old way He chooses - as He apparently did with the thief on the Cross. We, however, don't get the option of making the exception (the thief) the norm. Why would we? Why would we doubt what God has promised?

I'll ask you the same question which Lionlamb was unwilling/unable to answer: WHY -- in Ephesians 5:25-7 -- does Paul even mention "WATER" if he is NOT talking about water baptism?

Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish.

What does "water with the Word" mean?

DEAL. WITH. THE. TEXT.

Kepler

 

[Stinker]

I'll ask you the same question which Lionlamb was unwilling/unable to answer: WHY -- in Ephesians 5:25-7 -- does Paul even mention "WATER" if he is NOT talking about water baptism? [KEPLER]

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Ezekiel 16:8-10 (New International Version)




8 " 'Later I passed by, and when I looked at you and saw that you were old enough for love, I spread the corner of my garment over you and covered your nakedness. I gave you my solemn oath and entered into a covenant with you, declares the Sovereign LORD, and you became mine. 9 " 'I bathed [a] you with water and washed the blood from you and put ointments on you. 10 I clothed you with an embroidered dress and put leather sandals on you. I dressed you in fine linen and covered you with costly garments.

Even though this is a symbolic passage, it teaches that God first enters into covenant with, then symbolically washes and dresses His people.


I know of no Bible scholars that maintain that (Eph.5:26) is referring to anything other than water baptism. Even when I was in the CofC I understood that the water had no power and that it was a symbolic burial. We in the CofC never taught that this burial in water was actual bathing or washing. We taught that the water symbolized the earth that we are buried in just like Christ was. We never taught that a person should bathe or wash themselves in the baptistry. Nor can I think of any other church that does.

"....with the washing of water by the word." (Eph.5:26)
It is the word that has done the cleansing, not the water: "Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you." (Jn.15:3)
"Sanctify them through Thy truth: Thy word is truth." (Jn.17:17)

Therefore, the water of baptism is ceremonial and symbolic and is not the essential necessary to salvation.

 

[FOG]

I think this whole "argument" is sorta pointless. I agree that people should be baptized. Why not? Why does everyone make such a big deal to try to make an excuse to not be baptized? Jesus was baptized (and Jesus is supposed to be who we try to be like, follow His example) , and water baptism was mentioned and commanded in the bible multiple times. Although there may be places that aren't talking about water baptism, you can't use that as an excuse to ignore the parts that are talking about water baptism.

I dont want to get in a big argument.. But its commanded in the bible. Why try to "get around" being baptized?

 

[angie01]

How necessary is baptism to our salvation as christians? Is it a requirement or just a sacrament that gives us grace from God?

God bless,

Lucas

lucas,
Happy Birthday, What a great time to be baptised. You will not be new to the Christian family but it is the first step of obediance, Jesus didn't start his public ministry until he was baptised and he didn't have to do it to go to heaven but God was pleased. Hope this helps.

 

[Iollain]

Don't mind Kepler, Lucas, i think he is a reincarnated Luther, he is as harsh as him lol hehehe

 

[Loukuss]

Don't mind Kepler, Lucas, i think he is a reincarnated Luther, he is as harsh as him lol hehehe

I'm not so sure Luther was as arrogant as Kepler is. Kepler needs a large dose of humility.

 

[Loukuss]

lucas,
Happy Birthday, What a great time to be baptised. You will not be new to the Christian family but it is the first step of obediance, Jesus didn't start his public ministry until he was baptised and he didn't have to do it to go to heaven but God was pleased. Hope this helps.

Thanks for the birthday wishes, Angie.
By the way, I've already been baptized, about 7 yrs ago now. Though, I am considering getting rebaptized because I didnt quite understand it back then.
I agree that baptizism is being obedient to God and thats very important.

God bless,

Lucas