Attn: All Pro-Lifers!

[chris4243]

A zygote is alive.

Each of the cells in my body is also alive. If someone kills me, they will be charged with the murder of one person, no more and no less.

No one needs to know how many potential lives are ended.

And no one cares about potential lives, especially not Christians. In fact, every Christian I've ever questioned has been adamantly opposed to giving any significant value to potential lives. Have I finally found an exception to this, someone who greatly values potential lives?

What is your definition of a person? Then, what is God's definition of a person? Ours doesn't matter does it? And then, isn't the innocent one, the one in the womb?

Simple, God never gave us the definition of a person. If he had, there would be no argument. Does not life start before the creation of the world?

 

[SullivanZ]

Is this another thing which you believe and decided that it covers all?

Did the laws just pop out of thin air or were they put in place by people who care? Morality is not something that is confined to Christianity. It is found in every society. Even atheists understand right and wrong.

The God of the Old and New Testaments.

Don't you believe that Jesus is eternal and present in the OT?

The contradictions are caused from judgment by the law or judgment by faith. It cannot be both.

There are many apparent contradictions between Jesus' teachings of love and grace and the harsh, punitive, cruelty found in the Old Testament.

Even a rudimentary reading of the Bible for a non-believer proves this much, I'm afraid.

What is most amusing (and sometimes disturbing) is seeing how Christians twist, and wrestle with the scriptures to try and make them say whatever they want, which is a complete cohesion between Jesus' teachings and morality, and the stark contrast of His teachings with those of the Old Testament.

 

[Walter Kovacs]

What's interesting is the underlying themes of mercy, love and justice that begin in the OT that are eventually revealed in such a dramatic way with Christ in the NT. If you read the OT from an ANE point of view these things really pop out at you.

 

[SullivanZ]

What's interesting is the underlying themes of mercy, love and justice that begin in the OT that are eventually revealed in such a dramatic way with Christ in the NT. If you read the OT from an ANE point of view these things really pop out at you.

Yeah but if you read it from them point of view of being the fundamental, literal word of God, then you run into all manner of problems though.

 

[Walter Kovacs]

Which is why you aren't supposed to read any of the Bible in a flat, literal-or-not-literal, fundamentalist way. The Bible isn't a flat book of one genre.

 

[Yarddog]

Each of the cells in my body is also alive. If someone kills me, they will be charged with the murder of one person, no more and no less.

Has anyone said anything different?

And no one cares about potential lives, especially not Christians. In fact, every Christian I've ever questioned has been adamantly opposed to giving any significant value to potential lives.

Most Christians that I know care about all life but calling oneself a Christian doesn't mean that they really are.

Have I finally found an exception to this, someone who greatly values potential lives?

If you mean me, I value life, but I am also human, capable of failure.

Simple, God never gave us the definition of a person. If he had, there would be no argument. Does not life start before the creation of the world?

Sure, God is life.

 

[Yarddog]

There are many apparent contradictions between Jesus' teachings of love and grace and the harsh, punitive, cruelty found in the Old Testament.

I understand that. All of God's laws represent judgment in some form but do you understood that much of the OT is revelation about Jesus Christ.

The Garden of Eden is a shadow of righteousness, where man lives through faith and there is no judgment because Jesus fulfilled it. The Tree of Life represents Jesus. The righteous man is free to eat from the tree and live forever.

The Tree of Knowledge represents the Law. Mankind which rejects Jesus is judged by the Law. The Tower of Babylon represents all people who try to reach heaven through their own efforts. Abraham represents all people of faith. God asking him to sacrifice "his son" was a shadow of the sacrifice of Jesus, the "Son of God".

There are many many of these in the OT.

Even a rudimentary reading of the Bible for a non-believer proves this much, I'm afraid.

I used to think that it was a dark section of the Bible until God told me to read it and he began to reveal the wonders it held.

What is most amusing (and sometimes disturbing) is seeing how Christians twist, and wrestle with the scriptures to try and make them say whatever they want, which is a complete cohesion between Jesus' teachings and morality, and the stark contrast of His teachings with those of the Old Testament.

You are the one twisting scripture into something which it isn't. This occurs when scripture is read with the mind and not the spirit.

 

[chris4243]

Each of the cells in my body is also alive. If someone kills me, they will be charged with the murder of one person, no more and no less.

Has anyone said anything different?

Why not charge them with a trillion murders, one for each cell in my body, since each of those cells is alive? And if not, why bother mentioning that a zygote is alive, as if that mattered?

And no one cares about potential lives, especially not Christians. In fact, every Christian I've ever questioned has been adamantly opposed to giving any significant value to potential lives.

Most Christians that I know care about all life but calling oneself a Christian doesn't mean that they really are.

Have I finally found an exception to this, someone who greatly values potential lives?

If you mean me, I value life, but I am also human, capable of failure.

OK then, take it one step further. If you value potential lives, do you also think women should get married (or at least start having sex) as soon as they start their menstrual cycle and never use contraception? Think of all the potential lives that would save, all those potential people who would otherwise never be born.

Simple, God never gave us the definition of a person. If he had, there would be no argument. Does not life start before the creation of the world?

Sure, God is life.

Take this to its natural conclusion then. Why all the fuss about zygotes if your life started before your parents even got married? And can man thwart God's plan? Those God wanted born will be born.

 

[Yarddog]

Why not charge them with a trillion murders, one for each cell in my body, since each of those cells is alive? And if not, why bother mentioning that a zygote is alive, as if that mattered?

Each cell of your body is part of your body and not separate. Your cells are constantly dying yet you are not adversely affected. A zygote is created when the male and female eggs combine. It is not the woman's body any longer but a new creation.

OK then, take it one step further. If you value potential lives, do you also think women should get married (or at least start having sex) as soon as they start their menstrual cycle and never use contraception? Think of all the potential lives that would save, all those potential people who would otherwise never be born.

So, in order for "me" to value potential lives, I have to agree to "your standards"? There are potentially 400,000 eggs in a female, of which less than 500 will be released with the possibility to be fertilized. Do you really want to squabble over things that petty?

Take this to its natural conclusion then. Why all the fuss about zygotes if your life started before your parents even got married? And can man thwart God's plan? Those God wanted born will be born.

So you are making decisions for God now?