atheist seekin truth

[truthseeka]

Hi everyone, im truthseeka and i am an atheist .I was ever so recently dealing with a struggle between aethism and christianity and when the dust settled I was atheist (much to the dismay of several of my family members).

they suggested that I go to one of these forums and try to get reconnected and such. seeing as I am a fair guy I gave it a shot and here I am. so you know, I am used to very rough and tumble political and thoelogical debate forums. I am well aware that I should tone it down while Im here. what I was saying is I am used to my personal theological beliefs being smacked around so don't be shy. I will defend as best I can within the ethical boundries of this board.

I am only 16 so you know, considered a foothold in most debates. but I do consider my decision well informed so dont go for the teenage rebel thing.

also, if you are an atheist as well plz dont just post in agreement with me, i get that all the time. This is mainly adressed to christians even though they are too snoody to allow me to post this in the christians only forums.

 

[dawiyd]

Surely this is a job for General Apologetics

 

[FlyerBoy]

So why did you choose to be Athiest? What do you not see in Christianity?

Just trying to see where you are and if I can help at all.

 

[DistillMyHeart]

Surely this is a job for General Apologetics

You need a 100 posts, before you can post there.

 

[truthseeka]

So why did you choose to be Athiest? What do you not see in Christianity?

Just trying to see where you are and if I can help at all.

acually it mostly started when I started to read the bible. It just struck me as pure nonsense. and mostly everything that happens that is said to be spiritual is just that persons personal belief but everything has a mundane explanation that comes from undisputed theories.

christianity is a leap of faith where as atheism is proof, evidence, and facts. nothing about atheism can be disputed by christians except their views on ceation. but, the atheist have bible contradictions, conspiracy theories and historical evidence vs. current doctrine to throw at christians. The christians are on the defensive 24/7 and I can't see that changing in the future. the atheist have no money to be made or power to be gained. as for the christians...

 

[DistillMyHeart]

Are you an Athiest based on Philosophical grounds or Scientific?

 

[TooCurious]

Are you a "strong atheist" (as in, "I assert that there are no gods) or a "weak atheist" (as in, "I do not profess a belief in any gods")?

 

[truthseeka]

philosophical mostly. I embrace everything as natural, as having a explanation outside of spiritual. and I guess, subsequently, I also embrace science as my philosophy is that science (nature) has an explanation for everything.

but turned atheist (from catholic) for philosophical reasons.

 

[truthseeka]

Are you a "strong atheist" (as in, "I assert that there are no gods) or a "weak atheist" (as in, "I do not profess a belief in any gods")?

Lets just say I have not shut out the possibility of a god existing, just the christian god. though I personally dont believe in any god, my idea of an all-powerful god, if one exists, would be one that does not care if you are atheist or christian or whatever. one that does not pine for worship, belief, and sacrafice. a much more humble and humane being than the one described in the bible.

but as far as jesus and that goes, Im sure he was a nice guy but so was gandhi but I dont worship him, nor would he be arrogant enough to want to be worshiped.

 

[arunma]

Hello Truthseeka. I'm glad to meet you. Let me see if I can address some of your concerns.

christianity is a leap of faith where as atheism is proof, evidence, and facts. nothing about atheism can be disputed by christians except their views on ceation.

I fear that this issue is often blown out of proportion by the media. While I happen to believe in Biblical creation, I could not care less about the creation/evolution debate. There are far more important theological issues than that.

but, the atheist have bible contradictions, conspiracy theories and historical evidence vs. current doctrine to throw at christians.

I think it's important to ask: do these issues really matter? For every supposed Bible contradiction, Christian apologists can provide an answer. My guess is that about half of the apologetic answers are half-baked nonsense, but then, so are half of the so-called contradictions. Ultimately, these apologetic debates tend to turn into shouting matches in which each side trade "you're wrong!" for "no we're not!" Whether you believe in God or not, surely you realize that God and religion have an extremely significant impact on the world. So I think that when discussing religion, there are more important issues than conspiracy theories and contradictions. Wouldn't you agree?

The christians are on the defensive 24/7 and I can't see that changing in the future. the atheist have no money to be made or power to be gained. as for the christians...

Certainly there is money to be made by the misuse of religion. Yet this is not characteristic of Christianity. Indeed most of the televangelists in America are crooks who make their living off the donations of unsuspecting followers. But in my home country of India, there are just as many Hindu gurus wandering around in saffron robes, claiming to be gods, and they too make money off the masses. This might be a good argument against religion in general, but it doesn't make the best case against Christianity.

As a Christian, I am not here to convince you to believe in a creator god. Apart from Jesus Christ, belief in God is meaningless. As such, it is Christ and his Gospel that I would prefer to communicate to you.

 

[DistillMyHeart]

Lets just say I have not shut out the possibility of a god existing, just the christian god. though I personally dont believe in any god, my idea of an all-powerful god, if one exists, would be one that does not care if you are atheist or christian or whatever. one that does not pine for worship, belief, and sacrafice. a much more humble and humane being than the one described in the bible.

To reclarify for me, you are here to hear Christanity's arguments for the justification of their faith? How they rationalize their concept of their 3 gods?

 

[numberprophet]

life isn't about great overarching truths. if that's what you want, and you seem to be of an inquisitive temperment, you will always be searching, and always be disappointed.

 

[Johnnz]

Hi,

You have a heap of assumptions, unexamined presuppositions, and have not become acquainted with good Christian material at the level you need.

The forum will not allow you to explore your thinking too deeply, as things usually deviate pretty quickly.

Feel free to PM me if you want some resources.

John
NZ

 

[richkim7]

I am from a medical science profession. I have never gotten hung up on the how God (notice the capital) created the world, but that God created the world. The more I work with the human body, the more I truly believe that it would take more faith to believe in happenstance than creation.

I gain nothing financially from my faith in Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. I gain peace and joy in all circumstances (even when that makes no sense). I can't prove it to you except that I believe it so much that I would never want to lose it. It is not my job to prove it to you, but to testify to the love I feel. Hope you find your way back.

 

[LittleLambofJesus]

acually it mostly started when I started to read the bible. It just struck me as pure nonsense. and mostly everything that happens that is said to be spiritual is just that persons personal belief but everything has a mundane explanation that comes from undisputed theories.

christianity is a leap of faith where as atheism is proof, evidence, and facts. nothing about atheism can be disputed by christians except their views on ceation. but, the atheist have bible contradictions, conspiracy theories and historical evidence vs. current doctrine to throw at christians. The christians are on the defensive 24/7 and I can't see that changing in the future. the atheist have no money to be made or power to be gained. as for the christians...

May I ask what lead you to read the Bible in the first place? Curiosity or some divine presence that moved you to read it?

Did you read it from the beginning of Genesis to the last verse in the book of Revelation?

The Bible is of course badly translated, the KJV being among the worst in my view and has itself brought about a lot of unscriptural views in mainstream christ-ianity.

Genesis 1:1 In [the]a beginning God created the heavens and the earth.

Revelation 21:1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth are passed away; and the sea is no more.

 

[Ronnee743]

Hi everyone, im truthseeka and i am an atheist .I was ever so recently dealing with a struggle between aethism and christianity and when the dust settled I was atheist (much to the dismay of several of my family members).

they suggested that I go to one of these forums and try to get reconnected and such. seeing as I am a fair guy I gave it a shot and here I am. so you know, I am used to very rough and tumble political and thoelogical debate forums. I am well aware that I should tone it down while Im here. what I was saying is I am used to my personal theological beliefs being smacked around so don't be shy. I will defend as best I can within the ethical boundries of this board.

I am only 16 so you know, considered a foothold in most debates. but I do consider my decision well informed so dont go for the teenage rebel thing.

also, if you are an atheist as well plz dont just post in agreement with me, i get that all the time. This is mainly adressed to christians even though they are too snoody to allow me to post this in the christians only forums.

Evolution goes along with atheism, so anyone who actually thinks and believes that something came out of nothing tells me volumes about the mind of an athiest.

No offense intended.

It is not even possible for something to suddenly appear for no apparent reason and this is what atheism actually is.

So I don't see how atheism even has an argument.

 

[sidhe]

*Pounds head against keyboard*

Evolution doesn't say something came from nothing. Evolution says how the something that was there changed. Abiogenesis says life came from inanimate objects. They aren't the same theory, and one need not accept one to accept the other.

And, of course, one doesn't have to be an atheist accept the SCIENTIFIC THEORY of evolution. Or the SCIENTIFIC THEORY of gravitation.

 

[truthseeka]

Evolution goes along with atheism, so anyone who actually thinks and believes that something came out of nothing tells me volumes about the mind of an athiest.

No offense intended.

It is not even possible for something to suddenly appear for no apparent reason and this is what atheism actually is.

So I don't see how atheism even has an argument.

atheism implies that the universe always was there. and even if it didn't, how are any of us to know if something can or can'tcome out of nothing. this is based on the humans unsurpassed and flawless understanding of the universe and its most complex workings.

besides isn't christianity saying that everything came out of nowhere, just that a divine being snapped his fingers and poofed everything into existence. logically, that makes much less sense.

 

[truthseeka]

Hello Truthseeka. I'm glad to meet you. Let me see if I can address some of your concerns.



I fear that this issue is often blown out of proportion by the media. While I happen to believe in Biblical creation, I could not care less about the creation/evolution debate. There are far more important theological issues than that.

creation is a very important to my converting to atheism, for I stopped reading the bible at genesis (that also answer another question in here some where) and just thought it was nonsense. after that everything I looked at, I looked at from a new angle, an atheist angle.

largely responsible for my atheist view is another forum site I started in (can give a link if you need). it has both christian and atheist member who constantly argue about current news event. the atheist arguement involved verbally kicked the crap out of christianity. and christianty just kept on saying god is great and you will burn as if they were just plugging their ears and saying that really loud.

I think it's important to ask: do these issues really matter? For every supposed Bible contradiction, Christian apologists can provide an answer. My guess is that about half of the apologetic answers are half-baked nonsense, but then, so are half of the so-called contradictions. Ultimately, these apologetic debates tend to turn into shouting matches in which each side trade "you're wrong!" for "no we're not!" Whether you believe in God or not, surely you realize that God and religion have an extremely significant impact on the world. So I think that when discussing religion, there are more important issues than conspiracy theories and contradictions. Wouldn't you agree?

acually, as far as the shouting matches go,it is taking a turn. with the da vinci code and holy blood holy grail and all that stuff people are taking quite an interest in shaking the very foundations of christianity, possibly in destroying it entirely. ask yourself, what if someone breaks the airtight seal of christianity with something that gets no answer from the vatican or anyone, what if someone found a fatal flaw with christianity?

as for "do these issues really matter". Even the most trivial little mistake means that either god screwed up (disproves omnipotence) or the bible is not inerrant and is written entirely by humans (disproves christianity!). so, I think that these issues are important, either way they are important to my leaving christianity so they will have to be addressed for me believe.

take this one for example,

joshua 10:12 "Then spake Joshua to
the Lord in the day when
the Lord delivered up the
Amorites before the
children of Israel, and he
said in the sight of
Israel, sun, stand thou
still upon Gibeon; and
thou, Moon, in the valley
of ajalon."

joshua 10:13 and the sun stood
still, and the moon
stayed, until the people
had avenged themselves
upon their enemies. Is not
this written in the book
of Jasher? So, the sun
stood still in the midst
of heaven, and hasted not
to go down about a whole
day.."

so, god held the sun still to so that joshua could have more daylight finish his battle. the sun is already still, it does not move, you would really think that the "creator of the cosmos" would know this sort of thing. so, if the book of joshua was "divinely inspired"then either god lied or he made an error. and if you say that this is not important then consider this. when copernicus concluded that the earth rotated around the sun and not the other way around he was labeled as a heretic because his claim contradicted these verses. so the church did not consider this a mere play on words, they took the verses literally. and they obviously didn't think it was not important.

 

[LordoftheLeftHand]

Evolution goes along with atheism, so anyone who actually thinks and believes that something came out of nothing tells me volumes about the mind of an athiest.

How many times does this have to be discredited?Evolution and atheism are not the same thing!

It is not even possible for something to suddenly appear for no apparent reason

Actually it is. See Casimir Effect.

LLH