Ark Building

[Floodnut]

How long did it take to build the ark, from the perspective that it did literally serve as a means of saving animals and the family of Noah during the world-wide flood, and that the dimensions are as described in the Bible. How many MAN-HOURS would be required to complete the job? May we assume from the text of Scripture that Noah had helpers other than his own family?
Open for discussion is whether he was warned of the flood perhaps 120 years before it occured. The Scripture states that his first son was born 100 years before it occured. Let us also assume that the basic design was given by God, miraculously, but that Noah was chosen because he had the genius and intelligence necessary to direct the completion of the job.
Let us assume no supernatural levitation or shaping of the parts, but that elbow grease completed the task.

WE will ask moderators to delete and disqualify posts which debate whether or not the flood occured, or whether the whole Ark concept is even possible.

 

[FallingWaters]

I was pretty surprised the first time I heard that people thought someone besides Noah built the ark. I always assumed that he built it by himself since God told him to build it.

How many man-hours?
Genesis 6:14-15
The ark was
300 cubits long-
50 cubits wide-
30 cubits high-

Firstly, there is dispute as to the size of the cubit. If it was approximately 18 inches, then the ark was:
450 ft long
75 ft wide
45 ft high

An ancient Egyptian cubit is 21.888 inches. If an "ancient" cubit was used, then the dimensions would have been:
547 feet long
91 ft 2 in wide
54 ft 8 in high

So I guess that's the first discussion.

 

[Brennan]

Stats on the construction of HMS Victory:

Keel laid down in 1759, timber left to 'season' for 3 years.

Work recommenced in 1763, vessel was launched in 1765.

That's 3 years sessoning, followed by 2 years construction - in British naval dockyards (a little more sophisticated than having Noah's family doing the work I suspect.)

She's a lot smaller though:

Length 227 ft
Beam 51 ft
Draught 28 ft

 

[Floodnut]

I was pretty surprised the first time I heard that people thought someone besides Noah built the ark. I always assumed that he built it by himself since God told him to build it. TRUNCATED

Did Noah build it alone? Did his sons help, and their wives and Noah's wife? How about Noah's godly father, Lamech, who died at a young age (777) just five years before the Flood?
I think that although God gave the revelation to Noah, and although Hebrews 11:7 states that Noah "prepared the ark for the saving of his family," nevertheless that does not preclude his employing help.
Moses received the revelation for the tabernacle in the wilderness (Acts 7:44), but other craftsmen were employed in carrying out the work. "Solomon built the temple" (Acts 7:47) but hundreds of craftsmen did the work. The language of I Peter 3:20 suggests a group of people did the actual building of the ark.

With regard to the revelation of the impending flood and the plans for the Ark: How was it given? In a dream or vision, or through a prophet, or did God send an angel, or did the pre-incarnate Christ appear? Before the Fall, God is said to have walked with Adam in the Garden at the cool of the day. Enoch is said to have walked with God, and perhaps God appeared in some visible form and walked with Noah, telling him of what He was about to do.
Was the revelation given all at once or in stages?
(See most of those who deny the flood are so busy denying it that they can't even think of such questions. They just say, "IT NEVER HAPPENED.")

 

[laptoppop]

The wood alone would have been a huge expense. I figure either Noah was already rich, or that the Lord blessed him so that he would have the resources to do what He had commanded. (Where the Lord guides, He provides!)

At first glance, I didn't have any problem with Noah hiring other folks around him to do some of the work -- and indeed, maybe he bought the wood all finished, for example. On the other hand, the other folks were desperately wicked and may not have been willing to help -- or maybe they were quite willing to play along with the crazy guy as long as he paid them.

One theory regarding the need for the flood is that Satan had corrupted the gene pool in an attempt to make mankind unredeemable, and to block the coming of the messiah. If so, then the other folks, while they may have been "giant" in size, may not have been willing to help.

Here's an article about if Noah and his sons could have built the ark:http://icr.org/article/765/

This assumes a crew of 4 -- forgetting about Lamash, and I've known lots of women who are way better than I am at woodworking! Noah could also have had daughters during this time as well -- as well as his sons having "kids" -- plenty of time to get into teen age years and beyond - full solid help.

 

[FallingWaters]

Did Noah build it alone? Did his sons help, and their wives and Noah's wife? How about Noah's godly father, Lamech, who died at a young age (777) just five years before the Flood?
I think that although God gave the revelation to Noah, and although Hebrews 11:7 states that Noah "prepared the ark for the saving of his family," nevertheless that does not preclude his employing help.
Moses received the revelation for the tabernacle in the wilderness (Acts 7:44), but other craftsmen were employed in carrying out the work. "Solomon built the temple" (Acts 7:47) but hundreds of craftsmen did the work. The language of I Peter 3:20 suggests a group of people did the actual building of the ark.

You know where I think I got the idea that nobody helped him is that I was taught that he was the only one who believed God, and that people ridiculed him for what he did, and so I guess I assumed if people thought he was a nut-case, why would they help him? I didn't think of him paying people to help him. Poor Noah. How could he stand being around all those ungodly people?

And I guess that's why I thought it took so long to build - because he did it by himself. Of course, I understand that lots of times these are preconceived ideas, not necessarily based in Biblical Truth. But even now as I'm thinking it through, I still have a hard time seeing how or why he would have unequally yoked himself with wicked people to do God's work. Yet I am open to being convinced otherwise.

I read the 1 Pet 3 passage and checked with Adam Clarke for a comment on the "being prepared" but I didn't get any help on that.

 

[FallingWaters]

The wood alone would have been a huge expense. I figure either Noah was already rich, or that the Lord blessed him so that he would have the resources to do what He had commanded. (Where the Lord guides, He provides!)

At first glance, I didn't have any problem with Noah hiring other folks around him to do some of the work -- and indeed, maybe he bought the wood all finished, for example. On the other hand, the other folks were desperately wicked and may not have been willing to help -- or maybe they were quite willing to play along with the crazy guy as long as he paid them.

One theory regarding the need for the flood is that Satan had corrupted the gene pool in an attempt to make mankind unredeemable, and to block the coming of the messiah. If so, then the other folks, while they may have been "giant" in size, may not have been willing to help.

Here's an article about if Noah and his sons could have built the ark:http://icr.org/article/765/

This assumes a crew of 4 -- forgetting about Lamash, and I've known lots of women who are way better than I am at woodworking! Noah could also have had daughters during this time as well -- as well as his sons having "kids" -- plenty of time to get into teen age years and beyond - full solid help.

Yesterday, the idea popped into my head that perhaps the trees of gopherwood that Noah needed were already on land that he owned.

I read the ICR article. Loved it! So Noah could conceivably have built the ark by himself.

As far as what the women were doing, if you think about it, regular life was still going on. They had to farm, cook, clean, trade, besides having to prepare all that they would need for a year on board the ark for themselves and the animals. They had their work cut out for them, too!

 

[laptoppop]

But even now as I'm thinking it through, I still have a hard time seeing how or why he would have unequally yoked himself with wicked people to do God's work.

Just one thought: to me being "unequally yoked" involves situations where both parties have decision making input and power (such as a marriage). Is it being unequally yoked to use someone as a supplier? For example, we record our church service on tape each week. Do we need to only buy those tapes from committed Christians? What about contractors? If our church needs some electrical work, do we only hire Christian contractors?

That being said, as long as pricing was reasonably similar and the same standards of excellence were maintained, we'd probably first go to someone in our own congregation, second go to someone who we knew was a Christian, third go to a business we didn't know of, but who claimed to be a Christian, and finally, go to someone responsible out in the World. I'd prefer to keep our funds "in the family" so to speak -- but I don't have a problem buying supplies or services from the World.

 

[FallingWaters]

point taken.

 

[Floodnut]

* * * *
Firstly, there is dispute as to the size of the cubit. If it was approximately 18 inches, then the ark was:
450 ft long
75 ft wide
45 ft high

An ancient Egyptian cubit is 21.888 inches. If an "ancient" cubit was used, then the dimensions would have been:
547 feet long
91 ft 2 in wide
54 ft 8 in high

So I guess that's the first discussion.

The larger cubit used for official buildings, not only in Egypt, but elsewhere in the ancient world. This is also the cubit of the altar of incense in the Bible. What is the history of this cubit? Could it be that it has its origins in the earlier world, the world out of which royal Egypt arose, that is the world before the flood.
The cubit is simply the length of a man's arm from elbow to the tip of the middle finger. Perhaps there was a time when men were generally larger in size, resulting in this larger cubit.
Ark researcher Tim Lovett favors the larger cubit as the measure used in the Ark, certainly an official building and royal in the sense that Noah was the leader of the world out of which Egypt and Sumer arose. See Lovett's research on this topic at http://worldwideflood.com/ark/noahs_cubit/cubit.htm

No matter the length, Noah had the time to complete the project with just the help of his immediate family. But there would be no problem with his using people of the world to help. If you drink milk, or water from a public source you are using something made from the world. The whole world is in the power of the Wicked one (I John 5:19), even the money we use is full of pagan symbols, but as Jesus said, we "render unto
Caesar what is Caesar's and unto God what is God's."

 

[FallingWaters]

Thank you for the link. But we still don't have a definitive answer... or did I miss it?

 

[Floodnut]

Thank you for the link. But we still don't have a definitive answer... or did I miss it?

I would say there is no definitive answer, but the evidence as I see it seems to favor a larger cubit.

Ark enthusiasts have used the SHORTER cubit in discusssions about the feasability of the Ark --doing so to make the ark as small as possible for the sake of arguement. Survival on a smaller ark by a very large cargo of animals is still something that could have been accomplished. Thousands of animals could have been managed in such crowded conditions, as is shown by John Woodmorappe.
On the other hand one could also examine the Ark based on the largest possible cubit to see how seaworthy such a gigantic vessel might be in a world-wide flood.

Aside from these two hypothetical approaches, I favor the conclusions of Lovett. The research of Tim Lovett is far too wordy to post here, but personally I have come to agree with his findings, favoring the larger 21.5 inch cubit.

The bottom line is that it was at least 450 feet in length, as you indicated, by 45 feet tall and 75 feet wide. The larger cubit would make it 550 x 55 x 90 (approximately).

For purposes of considering the hypothetical building of the ark it would be good to increase the level of difficulty, by making it the largest feasible. Even its largest size, it is still entirely reasonable to understand that the Ark could have been built by a small work force within the years between the warning from God and the time of the Flood.

 

[laptoppop]

Warning: pure conjecture
I wonder if the larger cubit could be related to the corruption of the gene pool? Just a crazy thought.

 

[mark kennedy]

Warning: pure conjecture
I wonder if the larger cubit could be related to the corruption of the gene pool? Just a crazy thought.

I'm not sure it's a crazy thought at all, in fact it might even be insightfull. Think about it, a yard was at one time measured from the nose to the thumb. Of course this would vary from one individule to another. When you take into consideration that humans lived longer lives before the flood it stands to reason that they were bigger does it not. Then after the flood people only lived about 120 years so it stands to reason that the genetic code was somehow degenerated making the cubit shorter.

It's an interesting thought since most animals before the flood much bigger. There is a famous fossil 'Turkana that was 5' 3" tall with a skull that is comparable to modern humans, just a tad smaller. The strange thing is that he was only about 9 years old. That is one big kid is it not?

 

[laptoppop]

Interesting -- I was actually speculating in the opposite direction -- that satanic corruption of the gene pool led to giants which was reflected in the larger cubit.

Gen 6 (NKJV)
4 There were giants on the earth in those days, and also afterward, when the sons of God came in to the daughters of men and they bore children to them. Those were the mighty men who were of old, men of renown.
5 Then *the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6 And the Lord was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart. 7 So the Lord said, "I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the earth, both man and beast, creeping thing and birds of the air, for I am sorry that I have made them." 8 But Noah found grace in the eyes of the Lord.

 

[FallingWaters]

For purposes of considering the hypothetical building of the ark it would be good to increase the level of difficulty, by making it the largest feasible. Even its largest size, it is still entirely reasonable to understand that the Ark could have been built by a small work force within the years between the warning from God and the time of the Flood.

I agree.

 

[FallingWaters]

Warning: pure conjecture
I wonder if the larger cubit could be related to the corruption of the gene pool? Just a crazy thought.

It's quite possible.

 

[Floodnut]

Warning: pure conjecture
I wonder if the larger cubit could be related to the corruption of the gene pool? Just a crazy thought.

Not at all crazy. Slightly larger people before the flood might suggest a slightly larger cubit. Entirely reasonable. Then since, it was the cubit used in the official building of the Ark, and then Noah became the absolute leader of the whole world, since he was the father of all the survivors, you now have the ROYAL CUBIT. Later people born after the flood were generally shorter, sicker, not as intelligent, as the effects of the curse continued to multiply, and as new harsher environment of the post-flood world began to take its toll. As people did their own measuring here and there, off the cuff, the cubit became shorter, but in official buildings, from Sumer to Egypt, the Old cubit of Noah, the Royal cubit was retained. Just conjecture.

 

[LoG]

Book of Jasher Chapter 5:34

34 In his five hundred and ninety-fifth year Noah commenced to make the ark, and he made the ark in five years, as the Lord had commanded.

 

[FallingWaters]

Book of Jasher Chapter 5:34

34 In his five hundred and ninety-fifth year Noah commenced to make the ark, and he made the ark in five years, as the Lord had commanded.

That's interesting, but I don't know what authority the book of Jasher has. There were counterfeit books written.

The Bible says Noah was in the 600th year of his life when the flood occured. Genesis 7:11

It's believed that he had a total of 120 years of time in which to accomplish his task. Genesis 6:3