Are We Sinners or Overcomers?

[Benjamin Müller]

I am well aware of 1 John 1:8-10. That if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves. But I realized one day that I have become uncomfortable with Christians calling themselves sinners: for example in the Hail Mary "Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen."

I read Real Magic by Dean Radin which goes into the power of words and affirmations. And it got to me that it seems like calling oneself a sinner is only continuing a sinful life. We should confess our sins, yes, but to make a broad statement of sins or being a sinner doesn't get to the root of your problems. We need to identify each sin and confess it. And so while, yes, we sin should we really be calling ourselves sinners or should we refer to ourselves as overcomers. To overcome does not deny that one has sins; it is not a form of deception, but it amplifies that we are working towards righteousness. 1 John 3:7 Claiming to be a sinner implies there is no goal to overcome; that one has become complacent in a hopeless sinful state. There is no effort to overcome whatever sin there is in them. 1 John 3:8

I don't want to be a sinner. Therefore I'd rather identify as an overcomer and that I am overcoming. I sin, but I am not going to remain in that state.

 

[bling]

I am well aware of 1 John 1:8-10. That if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves. But I realized one day that I have become uncomfortable with Christians calling themselves sinners: for example in the Hail Mary "Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen."

I read Real Magic by Dean Radin which goes into the power of words and affirmations. And it got to me that it seems like calling oneself a sinner is only continuing a sinful life. We should confess our sins, yes, but to make a broad statement of sins or being a sinner doesn't get to the root of your problems. We need to identify each sin and confess it. And so while, yes, we sin should we really be calling ourselves sinners or should we refer to ourselves as overcomers. To overcome does not deny that one has sins; it is not a form of deception, but it amplifies that we are working towards righteousness. 1 John 3:7 Claiming to be a sinner implies there is no goal to overcome; that one has become complacent in a hopeless sinful state. There is no effort to overcome whatever sin there is in them. 1 John 3:8

I don't want to be a sinner. Therefore I'd rather identify as an overcomer and that I am overcoming. I sin, but I am not going to remain in that state.

read further in John. 1 John 2: 1 My dear children, I write this to you so that you will not sin. But if anybody does sin, we have an advocate with the Father—Jesus Christ, the Righteous One. 2 He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

 

[NewLifeInChristJesus]

I am well aware of 1 John 1:8-10. That if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves. But I realized one day that I have become uncomfortable with Christians calling themselves sinners: for example in the Hail Mary "Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen."

I read Real Magic by Dean Radin which goes into the power of words and affirmations. And it got to me that it seems like calling oneself a sinner is only continuing a sinful life. We should confess our sins, yes, but to make a broad statement of sins or being a sinner doesn't get to the root of your problems. We need to identify each sin and confess it. And so while, yes, we sin should we really be calling ourselves sinners or should we refer to ourselves as overcomers. To overcome does not deny that one has sins; it is not a form of deception, but it amplifies that we are working towards righteousness. 1 John 3:7 Claiming to be a sinner implies there is no goal to overcome; that one has become complacent in a hopeless sinful state. There is no effort to overcome whatever sin there is in them. 1 John 3:8

I don't want to be a sinner. Therefore I'd rather identify as an overcomer and that I am overcoming. I sin, but I am not going to remain in that state.

Both. Those who are alive in Christ can also see the deadness they inherited from Adam (Rom 4:12-19) -- the flesh. Our closeness to it makes us feel miserable and wretched (Rom 7:21-24). But the grace of God that brought about our salvation is greater than our sins or sinfulness. We stand forgiven (Rom 7:25-8:1).

But we also can see the person we have become in Christ -- the new man (Eph 4:24). We can see that we are risen with Christ from the dead (Col 2:12), are joined to the Lord, and are one spirit with Him (1 Cor 6:17).

So it's not either/or it's both.

 

[fhansen]

I am well aware of 1 John 1:8-10. That if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves. But I realized one day that I have become uncomfortable with Christians calling themselves sinners: for example in the Hail Mary "Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen."

I read Real Magic by Dean Radin which goes into the power of words and affirmations. And it got to me that it seems like calling oneself a sinner is only continuing a sinful life. We should confess our sins, yes, but to make a broad statement of sins or being a sinner doesn't get to the root of your problems. We need to identify each sin and confess it. And so while, yes, we sin should we really be calling ourselves sinners or should we refer to ourselves as overcomers. To overcome does not deny that one has sins; it is not a form of deception, but it amplifies that we are working towards righteousness. 1 John 3:7 Claiming to be a sinner implies there is no goal to overcome; that one has become complacent in a hopeless sinful state. There is no effort to overcome whatever sin there is in them. 1 John 3:8

I don't want to be a sinner. Therefore I'd rather identify as an overcomer and that I am overcoming. I sin, but I am not going to remain in that state.

Yes, we’re meant to overcome, by the grace and power of the Holy Spirit. But to do so we must acknowledge that we’re sinners. And that tension, that back and forth dynamic or struggle is life-long as we, hopefully, grow in holiness, nearer and nearer to the image of God. Meanwhile some, ironically, seem almost proud to continue to beat their breast and proclaim their wickedness, as if we cannot and will not overcome in this life. That’s not of God, either.

And, in fact, John also tells us in 1 John 1 that if we confess our sins He'll purify us from all unrighteousness-so it's not as if remaining in our sins is somehow superior to God. And John affirms that later by telling us that sin can mean we're not even His.

 

[ViaCrucis]

I am well aware of 1 John 1:8-10. That if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves. But I realized one day that I have become uncomfortable with Christians calling themselves sinners: for example in the Hail Mary "Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen."

I read Real Magic by Dean Radin which goes into the power of words and affirmations. And it got to me that it seems like calling oneself a sinner is only continuing a sinful life. We should confess our sins, yes, but to make a broad statement of sins or being a sinner doesn't get to the root of your problems. We need to identify each sin and confess it. And so while, yes, we sin should we really be calling ourselves sinners or should we refer to ourselves as overcomers. To overcome does not deny that one has sins; it is not a form of deception, but it amplifies that we are working towards righteousness. 1 John 3:7 Claiming to be a sinner implies there is no goal to overcome; that one has become complacent in a hopeless sinful state. There is no effort to overcome whatever sin there is in them. 1 John 3:8

I don't want to be a sinner. Therefore I'd rather identify as an overcomer and that I am overcoming. I sin, but I am not going to remain in that state.

I would point out that St. Paul, of all people, not only called himself a sinner, but called himself the chief of sinners.

Scripture says we, who are being saved, are sinners and saints. So the word choice of Scripture is saint. The saint desires, believes, and hopes that--by the grace of God, the strength of the Holy Spirit, and the ultimate victory of God over the powers of this fallen world--he/she shall overcome. Not that we already have, but that we shall one day, at last, overcome. To our present condition, St. Paul writes of himself:

"Not that I have already obtained this or am already perfect, but I press on to make it my own, because Christ Jesus has made me his own. rothers, I do not consider that I have made it my own. But one thing I do: forgetting what lies behind and straining forward to what lies ahead, I press on toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus." - Philippians 3:12-14

So the "duality" of the Christian is that we are Simul iustus et peccator; both saints and sinners. As it pertains to what we are before the naked pronouncement of God's Law, sinners; as it pertains to who we are in Christ by the power of the Spirit, saints. There are, indeed those saints who have overcome--the saints who have gone before us who are with the Lord in His presence, in heaven and who pray for us day and night and who are now a great cloud of witnesses cheering us as we run the race and fight the good fight, pressing forward and toward the goal: Christ Jesus, the Author and Finisher of our faith.

 

[RandyPNW]

I am well aware of 1 John 1:8-10. That if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves. But I realized one day that I have become uncomfortable with Christians calling themselves sinners: for example in the Hail Mary "Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen."

I read Real Magic by Dean Radin which goes into the power of words and affirmations. And it got to me that it seems like calling oneself a sinner is only continuing a sinful life. We should confess our sins, yes, but to make a broad statement of sins or being a sinner doesn't get to the root of your problems. We need to identify each sin and confess it. And so while, yes, we sin should we really be calling ourselves sinners or should we refer to ourselves as overcomers. To overcome does not deny that one has sins; it is not a form of deception, but it amplifies that we are working towards righteousness. 1 John 3:7 Claiming to be a sinner implies there is no goal to overcome; that one has become complacent in a hopeless sinful state. There is no effort to overcome whatever sin there is in them. 1 John 3:8

I don't want to be a sinner. Therefore I'd rather identify as an overcomer and that I am overcoming. I sin, but I am not going to remain in that state.

So well said! If in the OT we were a pagan standing outside of the camps of Israel, and utterly rejecting the need to enter into the courtyard of the tabernacle we remain a "sinner." But if via the priest we offer the sacrifice for our sin, wash at the laver, and enter into the tent with God, we see the light of Christ's righteousness and partake of his body as bread. We then yield up the incense of praise to God, which He accepts as legitimate worship. We are a forgiven sinner and we produce the righteousness of Christ, which alone is acceptable to God for Eternal Life.

 

[Always in His Presence]

I am well aware of 1 John 1:8-10. That if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves. But I realized one day that I have become uncomfortable with Christians calling themselves sinners: for example in the Hail Mary "Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen."

The prayer is not Holy Scripture.

Saying I am a Christian and a sinner at the same time is like saying I am a married bachelor.

 

[RandyPNW]

The prayer is not Holy Scripture.

Saying I am a Christian and a sinner at the same time is like saying I am a married bachelor.

I agree that the prayer is not Holy Scripture. Otherwise, I think it was pretty well explained. It's not enough to be forgiven. One must show the fruit of repentance, which is good works.

 

[Hawkins]

We are sinners relative to Law, we are righteous relative to Covenant. We need to call ourselves sinners because we do sin and God is never sin-compatible. We call ourselves righteous simply because God accepts that we are righteous due to our Faith (the kind of faith specified in the Covenant).

To God, our sin is a pain in the neck. We promised Noah to bear with us till but not beyond the Final Judgment. God not only atones for our sin but also bears with it along humanity. We take for granted to enjoy calling ourselves righteous, we are but sinners.

 

[Linda426]

I am well aware of 1 John 1:8-10. That if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves. But I realized one day that I have become uncomfortable with Christians calling themselves sinners: for example in the Hail Mary "Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen."

I read Real Magic by Dean Radin which goes into the power of words and affirmations. And it got to me that it seems like calling oneself a sinner is only continuing a sinful life. We should confess our sins, yes, but to make a broad statement of sins or being a sinner doesn't get to the root of your problems. We need to identify each sin and confess it. And so while, yes, we sin should we really be calling ourselves sinners or should we refer to ourselves as overcomers. To overcome does not deny that one has sins; it is not a form of deception, but it amplifies that we are working towards righteousness. 1 John 3:7 Claiming to be a sinner implies there is no goal to overcome; that one has become complacent in a hopeless sinful state. There is no effort to overcome whatever sin there is in them. 1 John 3:8

I don't want to be a sinner. Therefore I'd rather identify as an overcomer and that I am overcoming. I sin, but I am not going to remain in that state.

Thats very true and rational to help build up
Our own Souls, and being honest at the same time when in need of affirmations in our mindset, but at the same time we dont need
To express our growth as to brag, since that might just be taken in the wrong way, when
In fact, though we have sinned is not a permanent place that we must accept being
Human leads us into, either, after all, every
Christian who lives in Christ knows that God
Already tells us to be perfect as our heavenly Father, meaning, we have Gods vote of confidence to remind us, we can be perfect
In his eyes if we truly make the choice to
Do so.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Saying I am a Christian and a sinner at the same time is like saying I am a married bachelor.

There's actually a word for when a person is promised for marriage but not yet married. Betrothed. The marriage has not yet commenced, but the exchange, the promises, are all made--and the betrothed belong to one another even though they are not yet married.

Saying I am a Christian and a sinner at the same time is saying that we are betrothed. Which we are. The dowry has been paid, but the feast has not yet taken place.

So you are half-way there, but reached the precisely wrong conclusion.

 

[Minister Monardo]

I am well aware of 1 John 1:8-10. That if we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves. But I realized one day that I have become uncomfortable with Christians calling themselves sinners: for example in the Hail Mary "Hail Mary, full of grace, the Lord is with thee. Blessed art thou among women, and blessed is the fruit of thy womb, Jesus. Holy Mary, Mother of God, pray for us sinners, now and at the hour of our death. Amen."

I read Real Magic by Dean Radin which goes into the power of words and affirmations. And it got to me that it seems like calling oneself a sinner is only continuing a sinful life. We should confess our sins, yes, but to make a broad statement of sins or being a sinner doesn't get to the root of your problems. We need to identify each sin and confess it. And so while, yes, we sin should we really be calling ourselves sinners or should we refer to ourselves as overcomers. To overcome does not deny that one has sins; it is not a form of deception, but it amplifies that we are working towards righteousness. 1 John 3:7 Claiming to be a sinner implies there is no goal to overcome; that one has become complacent in a hopeless sinful state. There is no effort to overcome whatever sin there is in them. 1 John 3:8

I don't want to be a sinner. Therefore I'd rather identify as an overcomer and that I am overcoming. I sin, but I am not going to remain in that state.

You have to overcome to be an overcomer. This is the Lord's accomplishment. Believers are addressed as Saints, the Faithful, slaves of righteousness, the Elect/ion= the Chosen, bondservants of Christ.
Revelation 17:14 “These will make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them, for He is Lord of lords and King of kings; and those who are with Him are called, chosen, and faithful.”
Those who accept Christ are "the called" Romans 1:6
Those who accept a specific stewardship are chosen, elect, stewards
Those who are faithful will also be the overcomers.
Revelation 2:
10 Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer.
Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison,
that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days.
Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.
11 “He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.
He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death.” ’

 

[Linda426]

There's actually a word for when a person is promised for marriage but not yet married. Betrothed. The marriage has not yet commenced, but the exchange, the promises, are all made--and the betrothed belong to one another even though they are not yet married.

Saying I am a Christian and a sinner at the same time is saying that we are betrothed. Which we are. The dowry has been paid, but the feast has not yet taken place.

So you are half-way there, but reached the precisely wrong conclusion.

Thats a great quote atop of your post
That i wish Christian Pastors all over the
Country could read, because its the simple
Truth of what God says as well, however man
Made concepts have turned that around to
Saying something entirely different and it
Is surprising to hear.

They dont teach this genuine quote in this
Analogy for one main reason, which imho, is because, man has too often heard “ we are
Human and not perfect”, as well as the
Scripture that says, “ all have sinned and fallen short of Gods perfection”, and for some reason
It seems noone reads that scripture correctly through Christian eyes, meaning all have sinned, but when we live in Christ we supposed turned from sin, thats the major difference, as in not all still sin, yet still, it is taught in churches that we have a God who forgives our sins when we fall, and this is not Gods Words,
These are mans words.

Nothing in Gods Word says we can still sin,
And on the contrary God tells us to be perfect
Like our heavenly Father, now look at the
Disparity of these two concepts, man talks we are human we will sin, God says be perfect
Like our Father in heaven, also the scripture
All have sinned and fallen short of the Mercy of God, doesnt say anything of we can still sin, actually it tells us, all have fallen short
But there is no addendum that causes us to
Believe we can continue to sin like man made
Ideas drill into our minds, especially when in
Hebrews 10:26 i believe, warns us there is
No further sacrifice for our sins, yes, please
Read this and please pass it on, since mans idea has tried to overruled Gods warning, which says no further sacrifice From Christ,
Because He died Once and that death and
Resurrection signified we can come to him
In full contrition and Repent of past sins,
As a new person in Christ, not one that conforms to the we are human and will continue to sin, yet many bible teachers
And preachers still tell their congregations
That if we backslide we have a merciful God
Each time we sin will forgive us.

Lastly, we know we are not perfect, anyone who thinks they are truly must be before God,
But this message is meant to emphasize the
Connotations of the above, why, because
We find it more palatable to think we can just
Keep asking for forgiveness, backed by
Bible teachers and preachers from that
Very same connotation supplanted in our brains, and unlike your quote that said the real truth in an easy to understand analogy, except
For those pushers of man made ideas to drill
Into us its ok if we sin, we must repent right away, as when we see God is not pleased
To see His Words of telling us to be perfect
As our heavenly Father in how its imputing
To our minds God says we can be perfect,
Which means we dont say yes to sin, and
Sin is anything and everything God tellls
Us He hates, so man can give us the opposite
Impression so we find ways to allow ourselves
If we want, thats the whole point of this
Post.

Reading that quote you wrote above noone can twist yet its exactly the opposite of what
Preachers and teachers of the bible still
Condone so that they find ways to put a square peg in a round hole, Your quote speaks directly
To what Gods word denotes, and once we read
It we see why Christians allow for repenting
As if its another meal another day, and fitting
It into their false belief from todays brain
Washing God fearing bible preachers????

 

[Minister Monardo]

There's actually a word for when a person is promised for marriage but not yet married. Betrothed. The marriage has not yet commenced, but the exchange, the promises, are all made--and the betrothed belong to one another even though they are not yet married.

Saying I am a Christian and a sinner at the same time is saying that we are betrothed. Which we are. The dowry has been paid, but the feast has not yet taken place.

So you are half-way there, but reached the precisely wrong conclusion.

When is the last time you thought of yourself as becoming a chaste virgin?
2 Co 11:2 For I am jealous for you with godly jealousy.
For I have betrothed you to one husband,
that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ.
Overcoming the sin nature is to become pure, without spot.
Ephesians 5:27 that He might present her to Himself a glorious church,
not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that she should be holy and without blemish.

 

[Linda426]

You have to overcome to be an overcomer. This is the Lord's accomplishment. Believers are addressed as Saints, the Faithful, slaves of righteousness, the Elect/ion= the Chosen, bondservants of Christ.
Revelation 17:14 “These will make war with the Lamb, and the Lamb will overcome them, for He is Lord of lords and King of kings; and those who are with Him are called, chosen, and faithful.”
Those who accept Christ are "the called" Romans 1:6
Those who accept a specific stewardship are chosen, elect, stewards
Those who are faithful will also be the overcomers.
Revelation 2:
10 Do not fear any of those things which you are about to suffer.
Indeed, the devil is about to throw some of you into prison,
that you may be tested, and you will have tribulation ten days.
Be faithful until death, and I will give you the crown of life.
11 “He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches.
He who overcomes shall not be hurt by the second death.” ’

When you say we must identify each sin
Are you speaking about ones initial repentance?
Or are you saying each day ( hope not)

Paul said he crucifies his flesh daily and
Alot of people dont understand the real
Meaning, rather, they think he has to
Crucify his flesh from sinning daily, when
No the real meaning is hes bringing his
Members of his body under submission
To remaining crucified, since it is our members
That sin, which is why God made the point of saying, “ if your eyes cause you to sin Gauge
Them out, since its better to enter into
Heaven maimed then be in Hell for all eternity,
Same for your hands if they cause you to
Sin, cut them off, so we can easily see Gods
Interest is our Soul, not our body, and He backed it up by saying, dont be afraid of those who kill the body, be afraid who has the power
To kill body and Soul, which is Huge as we
Study the mind of God.

Humans put all emphasis on themselves
We all do, as if we do this it protects our soul,
When in fact, what we think we are protecting
Is a one way ticket to hell, with the human
Heart being deceitfully wicked God says,
Meaning, if we are not fully focused on things
From above for all Eternity, our members
Can only be interested in what gratifies them
From moment to moment, unlike our full attention on things from above changes our
Perspective day after day, as well as keeping our mind on being new, the old ways are gone.

 

[Minister Monardo]

When you say we must identify each sin
Are you speaking about ones initial repentance?
Or are you saying each day ( hope not)

Not my quote.

 

[Linda426]

Not my quote.

Excuse me i thought it was