Are There Few Who Are Saved?

[Mr. M]

Luke 13:
23 Then one said to Him, Lord, are there few who are saved? And He said to them,
24 Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter
and will not be able.
25 When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to
stand outside and knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open for us, and He will answer
and say to you, I do not know you, where you are from,’
26 then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets.’
27 But He will say, I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me,
all you workers of iniquity.
28 There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac
and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, and yourselves thrust out.
29 They will come from the east and the west, from the north and the south, and sit down
in the kingdom of God.
30 And indeed there are last who will be first, and there are first who will be last.

 

[Guojing]

Luke 13:
23 Then one said to Him, Lord, are there few who are saved? And He said to them,
24 Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter
and will not be able.
25 When once the Master of the house has risen up and shut the door, and you begin to
stand outside and knock at the door, saying, Lord, Lord, open for us, and He will answer
and say to you, I do not know you, where you are from,’
26 then you will begin to say, ‘We ate and drank in Your presence, and You taught in our streets.’
27 But He will say, I tell you I do not know you, where you are from. Depart from Me,
all you workers of iniquity.
28 There will be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when you see Abraham and Isaac
and Jacob and all the prophets in the kingdom of God, and yourselves thrust out.
29 They will come from the east and the west, from the north and the south, and sit down
in the kingdom of God.
30 And indeed there are last who will be first, and there are first who will be last.

Peter said the same thing to Israel in 1 Peter 4

12 Beloved, think it not strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened unto you:

13 But rejoice, inasmuch as ye are partakers of Christ's sufferings; that, when his glory shall be revealed, ye may be glad also with exceeding joy.

14 If ye be reproached for the name of Christ, happy are ye; for the spirit of glory and of God resteth upon you: on their part he is evil spoken of, but on your part he is glorified.

15 But let none of you suffer as a murderer, or as a thief, or as an evildoer, or as a busybody in other men's matters.

16 Yet if any man suffer as a Christian, let him not be ashamed; but let him glorify God on this behalf.

17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?

18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

The nation Israel would have to undergo a fiery Trial, by the Antichrist during the Tribulation.

They can expect to "scarcely be saved" at the end of that Trial. When Jesus returns for them in his 2nd coming, only then will they know whether they are saved or not.

 

[ewq1938]

 

[5thKingdom]

The nation Israel would have to undergo a fiery Trial, by the Antichrist during the Tribulation.

The Great Tribulation is NOT against Israel...
it is against the last "wheat and tares" of the Christistian
Kingdom as they "went forth" following the Antichrist. These
Last "wheat and tares" are called TEN VIRGINS. [Mat 25:1-13]
and the "wise virgins" are taken into the "marriage" during the
Final Harvest [v10]


This is the END of the Jewish Kingdom:


Mat 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The Kingdom of God
shall be TAKEN FROM YOU [Jews], and GIVEN to a nation
bringing forth the fruits thereof [the Christians].


Mat 21:45 And when the chief priests and Pharisees
had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them.


This is the END of the Jewish Kingdom:


Joh_4:35 Say not ye, There are yet four months, and then cometh harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest



This is the END of the Jewish Kingdom:


Mat 22:2 The Kingdom of Heaven is like unto a certain king,
which made a marriage for his son, 3 And sent forth his servants
to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not
come. 4 Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which
are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my
fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage.
5 But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm,
another to his merchandise: 6 And the remnant took his servants,
and entreated them spitefully, and slew them. 7 But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.



And this is the BEGINNING of the Christian Kingdom:


Mat 22:8 Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy. 9 Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage. 10 So
those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all
as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was
furnished with guests. 11 And when the king came in to see the
guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment:
12 And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not
having a wedding garment? And he was speechless. 13 Then said
the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away,
and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 14 For many are called, but few are chosen.


.

 

[Guojing]

The Great Tribulation is NOT against Israel...
it is against the last "wheat and tares" of the Christistian
Kingdom as they "went forth" following the Antichrist. These
Last "wheat and tares" are called TEN VIRGINS. [Mat 25:1-13]
and the "wise virgins" are taken into the "marriage" during the
Final Harvest [v10]


This is the END of the Jewish Kingdom:


Mat 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The Kingdom of God
shall be TAKEN FROM YOU [Jews], and GIVEN to a nation
bringing forth the fruits thereof [the Christians].


Mat 21:45 And when the chief priests and Pharisees
had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them.


This is the END of the Jewish Kingdom:


Joh_4:35 Say not ye, There are yet four months, and then cometh harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest



This is the END of the Jewish Kingdom:


Mat 22:2 The Kingdom of Heaven is like unto a certain king,
which made a marriage for his son, 3 And sent forth his servants
to call them that were bidden to the wedding: and they would not
come. 4 Again, he sent forth other servants, saying, Tell them which
are bidden, Behold, I have prepared my dinner: my oxen and my
fatlings are killed, and all things are ready: come unto the marriage.
5 But they made light of it, and went their ways, one to his farm,
another to his merchandise: 6 And the remnant took his servants,
and entreated them spitefully, and slew them. 7 But when the king heard thereof, he was wroth: and he sent forth his armies, and destroyed those murderers, and burned up their city.



And this is the BEGINNING of the Christian Kingdom:


Mat 22:8 Then saith he to his servants, The wedding is ready, but they which were bidden were not worthy. 9 Go ye therefore into the highways, and as many as ye shall find, bid to the marriage. 10 So
those servants went out into the highways, and gathered together all
as many as they found, both bad and good: and the wedding was
furnished with guests. 11 And when the king came in to see the
guests, he saw there a man which had not on a wedding garment:
12 And he saith unto him, Friend, how camest thou in hither not
having a wedding garment? And he was speechless. 13 Then said
the king to the servants, Bind him hand and foot, and take him away,
and cast him into outer darkness; there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth. 14 For many are called, but few are chosen.


.

I did not say its against Israel. I said its a fiery trial designed as a final test for the nation Israel, described in 1 Peter and James.

 

[5thKingdom]

I did not say its against Israel. I said its a fiery trial designed as a final test for the nation Israel, described in 1 Peter and James.

And I showed you a couple of reasons (from Scripture)
whey you are wrong. Israel is NOT part of the Great Tribulation
they were abandoned by God a LONG time ago.

Israel (as a nation) REJECTS Christ... they have NO SAVIOR
and never will.

To state the obvious


Jim

 

[5thKingdom]

I did not say its against Israel. I said its a fiery trial designed as a final test for the nation Israel, described in 1 Peter and James.

BTW... if you want to present a case for Israel being part
of the Great Tribulation then use SCRIPTURE... your "opinions"
mean nothing (and be sure to understand the CONTEXT of the
Scriptures)

Jim

 

[Guojing]

BTW... if you want to present a case for Israel being part
of the Great Tribulation then use SCRIPTURE... your "opinions"
mean nothing (and be sure to understand the CONTEXT of the
Scriptures)

Jim

Didn’t I quote 1 peter 4 already? Who do you think he was addressing that to?

 

[Mr. M]

17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?

18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?

ATQ
"the righteous scarcely be saved" is not the same as "few will be saved". few denotes number,
and is not the same as:
Acts 14:22. strengthening the souls of the disciples, exhorting them to continue in the faith, and saying,
We must through many tribulations enter the kingdom of God.
This speaks to difficulty, as in 'scarcely be saved'.
Yeshua does answer the question, but not necessarily to anyone's satisfaction.
Generally speaking, the opposite of few is many. The question is are there few?
Yeshua's answer: "for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able."
Are you satisfied with that answer?
Matthew 7:14. Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leads unto life, and
few there be that find it.
This is Soteriology Forum, not end times/eschatology, so I would respectfully request that you and
5th not get too carried away with tribulation/rapture scenarios, Israel/not Israel and discuss salvation.
Do you believe that the church of this generation is bringing in an "end time harvest" with current
church growth evangelistic methods? Or is there more to it than the sinners prayer, and 'you are saved'.
Revelation 2:7. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes....
I will acknowledge that great tribulation plays a role and will inevitably enter the discussion.
"So he said to me, These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes
and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Revelation 7
This is more to the point of the topic for this forum:
Woe to you, hypocrites! For you travel land and sea to win one proselyte, and when he is won,
you make him twice as much a son of hell as yourselves.
Woe to you, hypocrites! For you shut up the kingdom of heaven against men; for you neither go in yourselves, nor do you allow those who are entering to go in. [many will seek]
Matthew 23

 

[Guojing]

ATQ
"the righteous scarcely be saved" is not the same as "few will be saved". few denotes number,
and is not the same as:
Acts 14:22. strengthening the souls of the disciples, exhorting them to continue in the faith, and saying,
We must through many tribulations enter the kingdom of God.
This speaks to difficulty, as in 'scarcely be saved'.
Yeshua does answer the question, but not necessarily to anyone's satisfaction.
Generally speaking, the opposite of few is many. The question is are there few?
Yeshua's answer: "for many, I say to you, will seek to enter and will not be able."
Are you satisfied with that answer?
Matthew 7:14. Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leads unto life, and
few there be that find it.
This is Soteriology Forum, not end times/eschatology, so I would respectfully request that you and
5th not get too carried away with tribulation/rapture scenarios, Israel/not Israel and discuss salvation.
Do you believe that the church of this generation is bringing in an "end time harvest" with current
church growth evangelistic methods? Or is there more to it than the sinners prayer, and 'you are saved'.
Revelation 2:7. He who has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says to the churches. To him who overcomes....
I will acknowledge that great tribulation plays a role and will inevitably enter the discussion.
"So he said to me, These are the ones who come out of the great tribulation, and washed their robes
and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Revelation 7
This is more to the point of the topic for this forum:
Woe to you, hypocrites! For you travel land and sea to win one proselyte, and when he is won,
you make him twice as much a son of hell as yourselves.
Woe to you, hypocrites! For you shut up the kingdom of heaven against men; for you neither go in yourselves, nor do you allow those who are entering to go in. [many will seek]
Matthew 23

God has but one commandment for unbelievers to obey during this age of grace, be reconciled with him because Christ has already died for sins on the cross, 2 Cor 5

17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

 

[Mr. M]

God has but one commandment for unbelievers to obey during this age of grace, be reconciled with him because Christ has already died for sins on the cross, 2 Cor 5

20 Now then we are ambassadors for Christ, as though God did beseech you by us: we pray you in Christ's stead, be ye reconciled to God.

Is the Great Commission a commandment? Is making and maintaining disciples and passing on
The Memorials of God's Word a commandment? You still have not come close to answering the question.
Being ambassadors for Christ alone, not to mention the rest of the Gospel message, shows that there
is more to being reconciled by grace. That is where your walk begins. Grace extends out into stewardship. Do you only look to yourself?
Matthew 24:
13 But he who endures to the end shall be saved.
14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations,
and then the end will come.

 

[Jesse Dornfeld]

Yes, I think few will be saved.

 

[Guojing]

Is the Great Commission a commandment? Is making and maintaining disciples and passing on
The Memorials of God's Word a commandment? You still have not come close to answering the question.
Being ambassadors for Christ alone, not to mention the rest of the Gospel message, shows that there
is more to being reconciled by grace. That is where your walk begins. Grace extends out into stewardship. Do you only look to yourself?
Matthew 24:
13 But he who endures to the end shall be saved.
14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in all the world as a witness to all the nations,
and then the end will come.

If you want to follow the exact instructions of the GC found in Matt 28, you have to teach others to obey EVERYTHING Jesus commanded them.

Do you know the various commands Jesus gave in Matthew alone? No one follows all of them now.

 

[5thKingdom]

Didn’t I quote 1 peter 4 already? Who do you think he was addressing that to?

I don't know if you quoted 1Pet 1:4 before...

I think it was addressed to.... CHRISTIANS

1Pe 1:1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

Now, you can read the entire chapter and argue it addressed
both the jewish and Gentile "Christians"... but you cannot argue
it addresses national Israel which was REJECTED by God long before
Peter's letter.

Mat 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God
SHALL BE TAKEN FROM YOU, and given to a nation bringing
forth the fruits thereof.

All the last Jewish Saints were "harvested" into the Christian
"Kingdom of Heaven" while Jesus and the Apostles taught...
Jews today are just as forsaken as Moslems.

Joh_4:35 Say not ye, There are yet four months, and then cometh harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest.


Jim

 

[Mr. M]

I don't know if you quoted 1Pet 1:4 before...

I think it was addressed to.... CHRISTIANS

1Pe 1:1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the strangers scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

Now, you can read the entire chapter and argue it addressed
both the jewish and Gentile "Christians"... but you cannot argue
it addresses national Israel which was REJECTED by God long before
Peter's letter.

Mat 21:43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God
SHALL BE TAKEN FROM YOU, and given to a nation bringing
forth the fruits thereof.

All the last Jewish Saints were "harvested" into the Christian
"Kingdom of Heaven" while Jesus and the Apostles taught...
Jews today are just as forsaken as Moslems.

Joh_4:35 Say not ye, There are yet four months, and then cometh harvest? behold, I say unto you, Lift up your eyes, and look on the fields; for they are white already to harvest.


Jim

Okay, Jim. That's fine. Can we please stay on topic? [post#9]
There is a poll question, in response to:
Are There Few Who Are Saved?
Luke 13:
23 Then one said to Him, Lord, are there few who are saved? And He said to them,
24 Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter
and will not be able.

 

[5thKingdom]

If you want to follow the exact instructions of the GC found in Matt 28, you have to teach others to obey EVERYTHING Jesus commanded them.

Do you know the various commands Jesus gave in Matthew alone? No one follows all of them now.

Beside that... the Great Commission has a TIME FRAME attached.
That is to the "end of the age" [v28:20]


Moreover... we SEE that "end of the age" fulfilled in Scripture,
as the Great Tribulation begins:


Rev 11:7 And when they shall have finished their testimony,
the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.


The two candlesticks and two olive trees represent the NT church
and they "testify" until the LAST SAINT is saved/sealed [Rev 7:1-3]
and the Holy Spirit is "taken out of the way" [2Th 2:6-9] so that
Satan can be "loosened" from the Bottomless Pit [Rev 9:1-2] to
RULE over the Last Saints ("ten virgins") during his "Little Season".
Shown as the Great Tribulation and the Revelation Beast.


If you want to find Biblical Truth you must first HARMONIZE
all RELATED Scriptures.

Jim

 

[5thKingdom]

Okay, Jim. That's fine. Can we please stay on topic? There is a poll question, in response to:
Are There Few Who Are Saved?
Luke 13:
23 Then one said to Him, Lord, are there few who are saved? And He said to them,
24 Strive to enter through the narrow gate, for many, I say to you, will seek to enter
and will not be able.

First... I was only RESPONDING to a comment from another.


Second, What is the question? That is not a question at all.
The Lord answered that question in Mat 7 and Luke 13 and
Mat 25:1-13.


Moreover we have a general principle to guide us:
MANY are called [called by the Gospel]
FEW are chosen [chosen to be saved]


The Lord explained that MANY (Christians) follow a false gospel
which is the BROAD WAY to destruction (a synergistic gospel)


And FEW (Christians) find the narrow way into eternal life
through the monergistic gospel.


And finally, if you can receive it: The Bible says that when Christ
returns the saved are so few "a child could write them" [Isa 10]
and Jesus asks the rhetorical question of whether He will even
find faith on earth when He Returns [Luke 18]


Not only is this Christian Theology 101...
it is confirmed in HISTORY (reality). MOST Christians
trust that THEY have initiated/helped in the salvation process.
The synergistic heresy.


FEW Christians actually DEPEND on God to have mercy on them
and know there is NOTHING they can do to "help" God save them.
The monergistic Gospel of the Bible.


Jim

 

[Mr. M]

First... I was only RESPONDING to a comment from another.

I know what you did. His post was off topic and inaccurate, as you were quick to pick up on.
You also chose to ignore the topic.

Second, What is the question? That is not a question at all.

The question in the title is taken from the verse, so it is a question. The topic: was the question answered. The rest of your post is very informative. Whether or not it is Christian Theology 101
depends on what "school of thought" any one respondent has adhered.
Maybe this discussion will clear up some 'shady ideas' about salvation, now that we are on topic.
Thanks for your patience.

 

[5thKingdom]

I know what you did. His post was off topic and inaccurate, as you were quick to pick up on. You also chose to ignore the topic.

As I said... I was only responding to a comment I say.
In fact I did not even KNOW you were taking a survey.
I AM NOT a liar.... and you have no right to pretend otherwise.

The question in the title is taken from the verse, so it is a question.

As I said, I did not even know what the OP was, or the topic,
I was only responding to a post I saw at the END of the thread.

The topic: was the question answered. The rest of your post is very informative. Whether or not it is Christian Theology 101
depends on what "school of thought" any one respondent has adhered.

That is true. There are MANY apostate churches out there.
By Theology 101 I mean what the BIBLE teaches and not
a particular denomination.

Maybe this discussion will clear up some 'shady ideas' about salvation, now that we are on topic. Thanks for your patience.

Unfortunately, the Bible teaches Christianity becomes
LESS FAITHFUL in the end-times and not MORE FAITHFUL.
While I could still find churches that were basically faithful
to Scripture in the 1970's, by the late 1980's I was forced
to drive almost two hours (each way) to find a faithful church.
Today I doubt any exist.


Now, do not get me wrong, there are still many churches
and a few denominations that SAY they teach a monergistic
Gospel of a Sovereign God. But in reality (the ones I see)
teach a synergistic (false) gospel where MEN decide they
are elect by doing some "work".


As I said, this was all foretold in the Bible.


Jim

 

[Guojing]

Beside that... the Great Commission has a TIME FRAME attached.
That is to the "end of the age" [v28:20]


Moreover... we SEE that "end of the age" fulfilled in Scripture,
as the Great Tribulation begins:


Rev 11:7 And when they shall have finished their testimony,
the beast that ascendeth out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.


The two candlesticks and two olive trees represent the NT church
and they "testify" until the LAST SAINT is saved/sealed [Rev 7:1-3]
and the Holy Spirit is "taken out of the way" [2Th 2:6-9] so that
Satan can be "loosened" from the Bottomless Pit [Rev 9:1-2] to
RULE over the Last Saints ("ten virgins") during his "Little Season".
Shown as the Great Tribulation and the Revelation Beast.


If you want to find Biblical Truth you must first HARMONIZE
all RELATED Scriptures.

Jim

Oh you believe that the Tribulation has passed, and we are living in the millennium now?