Are OCDers Eternally Condemned to Hell? Did Pharaoh Have OCD?

[racough]

In my decades of suffering with OCD (read my other posts) one of the things I had mostly suffered with was/is scrupulosity although I had other OCD symptoms before this developed.

Like most suffers of scrupulosity I had struggled tremendously to keep my faith and to keep from blaspheming (if I did) and sweating it out with my stomach dropped to the floor, just knowing I committed the unpardonable sin.

I loathed myself for having such thoughts and lived under a cloud of self blame.

When I was around 40, I discovered that what I experienced was a medically recognized disorder; it even had a name. And to my utter astonishment, I found out that there was at least one other person in the whole world (perhaps in China) that had what I had. Shortly after I found out it was biologically induced.

After 40 years (although it took several years to actually believe there REALLY was someone else who actually had what I did) I wanted to run down the street and shout: “It’s not me, it’s the disease! Hey look, there are others beside me!” And even more emphatically: “It’s not my fault, it’s not my fault, it’s not my fault! For all you who condemned my “laziness” in not progressing with my life; look you idiots, it’s not my fault!”

And wow! I thought now I can stop this self loathing.

But later this revelation brought sadness. I used to deceive myself that after the finishing some ritual I would start anew and begin a better life—like an alcoholic who says “Give me one more drink and Monday morning I will quit and get a job.” Of course those Monday mornings never came, but I could decieve myself. By now the reality set in that I was stuck with this disease.

But a real change came in how I felt about God. I became so, so angry with God. “Here I am hating myself for having these thoughts and you made me this way!” The Bible says I am “wonderfully and fearfully made.” Yeah! Sure! I wonder if prolife people would be so much against abortion if they had suffered OCD.

I found myself pouring out anger against God, far more in situations where little or trivial things go wrong. Like when I forget something or can not find something—especially if it screws up some ritual. Then I want, and start, to blaspheme and pour out more venom than any Satanist does.

I know now I really have committed the unpardonable sin for “It is impossible for those who were enlightened, who have tasted the heavenly gift […] if they fall away to be brought back to repentance.” Before I might have claimed blaspheming in ignorance but can I claim that now?

The irony is that when I did not know that I had an OCD (though I always knew something was wrong, that I was different from others) I directed my hate towards myself. But after finding out about OCD I directed my bitter anger toward Him.

I wonder when God speaks of:

Consider it pure joy, my brothers, whenever you face trials of many kinds, (as you most certainly will with OCD) because you know that the testing of your faith develops perseverance [When has an OCD person ever developed perseverance?]. […] If any of you lacks wisdom, he should ask God, who gives generously to [those with normal brains] all without finding fault, and it will be given to him.

But when he asks, he must believe and not doubt, because he who doubts is like a wave of the sea, blown and tossed by the wind. That man should not think he will receive anything from the Lord; he is a double-minded man, unstable in all he does. [An OCDer not doubting??? Come on. Well that means an OCDer will never receive anything from the Lord.]

The French call OCD the Doubting Disease. Why if an OCDer has to recheck the stove to see if he turned it off a hundred times, or recheck a hundred time or continue to doubt if a hundred doctors and medical doctores tell him he does not have cancer, how can God expect an OCDer to doubt when he is walking on water or something like that?

Even people with normal brains have trouble with believing things like God still loves me and will come through these difficult times—but surely He does not think an OCDer is going to have faith like that without doubting —what do you expect with OCD?

Every time I start to read the Bible something horrible out of the blue happens to me. I am deathly afraid of even opening it now. Why does not God protect me—at least once in a while?

I believe I am like Pharaoh of whom God says:

“I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.” It does not, therefore, depend on man’s desire or effort, but on God’s mercy. For the Scripture says to Pharaoh: “I raised you up for this very purpose [given you OCD?], that I might display my power in you […]”

Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens [messes up the Sertonin receptors in their basia ganglia—gives them OCD] whom he wants to harden.

You know God “hardened Pharaoh’s heart.” The word “heart” corresponds to the modern usage of the word “mind.” I think God gave Pharaoh OCD, as he hardened my brain.

Did I ever have a chance to be saved? You know I earnestly read my Bible, prayed as much as I could before the OCD interfered with my concentration, went to church—still do regularly, and really desired to live a Godly life. I did not want to be a nonbeliever and a sinner.

I know there are non-believers who are not saved, but they are not troubled by it. Pastors talk about sinners enjoying a season of pleasure. While maybe a sinner is what I should be. I never even got a season of pleasure. If God did prepare me in advance for destruction why did not he keep me in ignorance? Now I cannot even enjoy a season of sin.

Oh when I see others being Spirit-filled and enjoying communion with God, oh how I envy them. I only wish there is a God whom Christians talk about who would love ME and assure ME I have eternal life. These things that the Bible promises for others (that have normal brains) I so much desire if only “God, choosing to show his wrath and make his power known, bore with great patience the objects of his wrath—[did not] prepared [me] for destruction.”

I deeply and earnestly desire that if there is a God who loves people the way it is claimed in the Bible and by Christians would love me, He will totally assure me I am not beyond forgiveness, that He most certainly will forgive ALL of my sins, (that I have not committed the unpardonable sin) and will come down here and make His self be known to me.

I care the least about “argument from intelligent design”; or creation science and whether the world was created in six literal days or if six days was figurative; or the Divinci Code; or who the Antichrist will be; or some speculative argument about end times prophecy.

I just want to know this! I am hurting. I have worldly needs. I am suffering. I am alone.Why cannot this God come down and help me???

I am tired of waiting. I am not young anymore. If I did get to heaven I wonder if I would hear: “Well, just be patient, what’s a billion years in relation to eternity? Then a trillion years come and I hear “what’s a few trillion years.”

I want to feel (or know, or experience) God now!

The peace of God, “which passeth all understanding” always passes me by,

You who claim to know Him, can you ask Him in my behalf? And do not lie to me if you think I really committed the unpardonable sin just because it might be politically incorrect or what not what the public wants to hear. I want to know the absolute truth. Remember I blasphemed after I knew God.

Oh God, help me!!!

 

[RachelZ]

Oh Racough I am so sorry you are in so much pain! As I read through your post and the scriptures you were quoting there were several times when I could just so relate to the way you are describing how you feel and the way you question God's love. I know the torment and the pain of wondering why it is that other Christians seem to have access to a peace that, as you say, so often passes us by. I don't know that I have a lot of wisdom if any to offer but I firstly wanted you to know that at least one other person out there understands at least something of what you are going through. Secondly, I think when God says about people who doubt not receiving anything He's talking about normal doubting not a disorder. It would be like saying that Jesus commanded people to go and make disciples but if someone is in a wheelchair how can they physically go? Sorry that's not the best analogy...hopefully someone else will come up with a better one. I think He takes us where and how we are at and actually chooses to do great things often through the weaker vessels. Thirdly, I'm sure I once heard that if you are worried you may have commited the unforgivable sin then you haven't...cos if you had you wouldn't be worried. But I know that with an OCD worry no amount of reassurance will totally convince you...but all I can say is I highly doubt you have done this. You may be angry with God...read the pslams and see how mad David got with Him. And yet David was described by God as a man after His own heart!! I've been really angry with God before now and even now I harbour feelings towards Him I'm not proud of. But if someone asked me now to give it all up or turn away I know I couldn't. All I can say is please don't give up hope...I will pray right now that God will show you at least a glimpse of His love even today...and that you will be aware of His hand grabbing hold of you even when your hold on Him feels weak!

I hope I haven't made you feel worse...I feel for you so much with these struggles and I know there are no easy answers...and platitudes end up sticking in my throat so I don't feel comfortable offering them! All I know is Jesus pleaded with God to take away his burden and God never got mad at Him for wishing things were different even when He knew they were the will of God...so doesn't that lead you to believe He may be more merciful than we give Him credit for when we suffer not because it's necessarily His will for us to suffer but because we live in a broken, spoiled world. I know even that can be hard to take cos I end up thinking well if He knew we were going to suffer why create us in the first place...but since becoming a Mum I know for me personally that's not a fair judgement to make of God...cos I know my son has and will suffer in this world...but I wouldn't have not had him to spare him that. I will do my best to prepare him to face difficulties and be there as much as I can to help him through them...but I had a choice...have a baby and know he'll experience some horrible things or not have one and spare him those difficulties. But in sparing him the difficulties I'd have also been denying him the joy and potential of life...and the hope that one day he'll meet God face to face.

Sorry...I'm rambling now...take care and I will pray again...Rachel

 

[racough]

RachelZ

It was so comforting to hear from year. I am going to take time and read throughly your answer. I would love to hear more from you.

Thanks so much for posting a reply!

racough

 

[babegirl111]

Hey

 

[babegirl111]

Racough, Your post brought tears to my eyes because I know exacty what your going through. OCD is like a roller coaster, there are so many turns. Times where I felt that there was no way out that I would be like this forever. I remember last year around October. That was the very first time I read that verse about the unpardonable sin. Before then I never knew there was an unpardonable sin, I thought GOD had forgivin me for those thought I could not control. But when I read it, I completely broke down. I thought I was going to die. I think at that moment I didn't want to live. I was afraid of living but even more afraid of dying. I could not stop myself from crying. I knew then that I was having a panic attack. I started shaking and layed on the floor. I looked like a mad woman. But then I talked to my dad (he's a pastor) and asked him what Blasphemy was. He told me that Blashemy was a person who refused to believe, basically a person who rejects Jesus and refuses to be saved. For a while was I still terrified, but after a few months I just let go. I knew I needed help and so I went out and got some. Even my therapist old me that GOD has a plan for my life, I might not know it now but I do have one. My mom told me the same thing also. She told me that maybe one day my recovering and dealing with this disorder could indeed help someone else. I had to stay strong and I had to know that GOD wouldn't leave me over a disease that wasn't my fault. I stand tall knowing today that I have HIM on my side no matter how bad my OCD gets at times, and you have HM too.

Just remember that GOD LOVES YOU! I see there is desire there and that you love HIM too. Don't be discouraged just believe and know that he will be there with you through this time. I seriously doubt you have commited the unpardonable sin. You have to realize the unardonable sin is completely rejecting Jesus who is ALL HOLY.

Don't give up, I will be praying for you! GOD BLESS YOU!

Please check out this website. It is amazing and really helps!!

http://net-burst.net/guilty/scrupulosity.htm

 

[BeccaLynn]

Racough,

I also understand what you're saying. You are far from alone. I have been there. I felt as if I was the only person in the world who couldn't be saved, no matter what anyone else told me, and then I found this website. For a long time, I never thought I could live any kind of joyful life. How could I thinking that I was going to spend eternity in Hell? The hardening of Pharaoh's heart is also something I would wonder about. I felt God had hardened my heart towards him, wondered why I was even born if I was going to be condemned, etc. Your statements sound so familiar to my thoughts. I even told God at one point that I hated Him out of anger and frustration. I felt rejected by Him and hopeless. I'm going to tell you something completely true . . . ocd takes what's truth and twists it around to where it's something ugly. God's beautiful and unconditional love for me gets twisted and I think that it's for everyone else, me being the only one it's not for , His forgiveness, in my mind, is only extended to everyone else, me excluded again, faith, hope, trust, etc. You name it, I felt it was all for everyone else. Ocd really does twist the truth. And when we feel rejected and so left out, that's how we respond. It's hard to love a God we feel has jipped us. But, that's not truth, it really is the ocd that FEELS so real that it must be. It lies. Have you sought any psychological help? I resisted this for so long because I knew it was only masking the real problem, of course which I thought was my heart, and I lived in a state of hell on earth for too long. God is not like what ocd wants to tell us. I am not the same person I was when I believed I was hopeless. Just because a child felt he hated his parent doesn't mean the parent stopped loving him. Ocd causes us to have so many misconceptions. Please believe me that God is not the harsh task-master ocd tells us He is. I have and will be praying for you. We love you here and God absolutely does as well, whether you feel like it or not. Feelings do not change the truth. For so long, I cried out of a lack of peace. There never seemed hope for me. I'm not that person anymore. If there's hope for me, there is hope for anyone. Please comment about seeing a therapist. I'm seeing a trusted minister friend whom God provided for me to counsel with many years ago, it just took me a very long time to get to the point to where I was willing to trust what he was telling me. I heard a message that included a comment like, "If you want things to change, you can't go about them the same way and expect different results". Well, I desperately needed a change, and I've had to trust godly advice, which is very hard for ocders to do, to get there. God's not abandoned you. That you even found this website shows His hand is involved. Years ago, people didn't even know about scrupulosity. Now, there's help for us. Well, I keep going on and on, but I know what you're experiencing and I so want you to see that you can have hope. God's not left you out. You can PM me any time you need to, as I'm sure many others here would tell you as well.

God Bless You!
Rebecca

 

[kaykay9.0]

A lot of good things have already been said. I would just add that I think God only hardens the heart of those who are already going in that direction if that makes any sense. I would just remind you that we have to counter balance such scriptures with the fact that the scripture ALSO clearly says that God desires all men to be saved and come to a knowledge of the truth. (1Timothy 2:4 NASB)

Prayers for you in your struggle. We all know it's not easy.

 

[jc9992]

God didnt harden your heart. You can be saved.My only piece of advice, forget about everything else and just go to God. What have you got to lose?

 

[Lisa0315]

I have Religous OCD, not confirmed yet, but I know it is so. Someone gave me a wonderful site regarding Christians with OCD that I will share with you. You are not alone, and your symptoms are severe but they are NOT unforgivable. The first step is understanding your disease and understanding how God feels about it. God does not condemn you. Does God condemn the person with Tourette's? They blaspheme all the time and have no control over it. They continue to do it after they are diagnosed as well.

In some ways, we are making God too small. OUR sin is so great that OUR God is too small to forgive it. That is arrogance and pride, my friend. I am guilty of it. That belief of being unforgivable IS Religious OCD.

You are not going to like the treatment of Religious OCD, but if you want to be free of it, and if you want to serve God without guilt, then, you have been given the opportunity. I actually feel that if I do not get treatment for this, then, I am rejecting grace.

My blasphemy symptoms are so bad that I can not share them on a PG-13 site. They are sexual in nature. Okay?

I am going to go get the site for you now...I will be back. YOU ARE NOT ALONE! GOD LOVES YOU!

Lisa

 

[Lisa0315]

http://net-burst.net/guilty/scrupulosity.htm

 

[racough]

I want to send a private message to you (RachaelZ, Rebecca and babegirl) but how do I? Thanks!

 

[racough]

It there a way on this forum to post email replies? I am new so I do not understand.


Thanks!

 

[racough]

To RachelZ, Babegirl, Rebecca and others who have been so kind to reply to my posts.
​

​

I have some questions pertaining to my post. I have always been ashamed of telling this but I am desperate.​

​

There is something that has reinforced this feeling of abandonment from God. Please read thoroughly and do not make any judgments until you finished. After years of keeping these things secret it is hard to me to now publically, or even privately, proclaim my thoughts.​

I noticed that so many people who answer my posts are married women. I am baffled how someone with OCD, unless they got it later in life, can ever get married. Perhaps it is different for a woman. I read a study that up to 72% of males who had OCD since adolescence have LIFETIME celibacy rates.

I am assuming that most of these males were non-Christian. If a male has no sex, could you imagine what the marriage or relationship ratio is? Mind you I do not care about any engaging in any illicit sex, only entering a Godly lifetime faithful relationship with only one woman>

One of the reasons I do not want to take SSRIs is that they inhibit a man's ability to have sex.

One of the tortures of having OCD is being so alone. I cannot explain my OCD struggles and torments to my best friends, my pastor or even secular and Christian counselors what I have to go through. That makes having a mate that I can come home to and know that at least one person in the world understands me is so important.

Other groups, like racial groups, who have difficulty with the world came come to their group and know that there are others that understand what they go through.

Being single has caused problems both in the secular world and in the Christian.

First the secular world. Before I was a Christian, yes I certainly lusted after many girls, but I never had sex because even before I was a Christian, and was not raised in a religious family, I intuitively knew that it was wrong. Form when I first got interested in girls I always planned on eventually being married and being always faithful to my wife.

Well as a young man I was teased by my peers and even adults about my "not having the guts to make it with a girl." Well I understand you have to expect that from non-Christians but when I became a Christian (if God did save me, read my new post on Scrupulosity and Pharaoh) I was too ashamed to tell anyone I was a Christian. You see I struggled with blasphemous thoughts and I thought the best favor I could do for God was not tell anyone.

After all they would say, "Well if you are a Christian, why aren't you living a Christian life?" You see one of the horrible things I suffered as part of my OCD (as I mentioned in my post) was that I could not hold a job down. People would say, "If you are a Christian, why are you always broke? Why do you need a ride? Don't you have a car?" I would tell them I cannot afford one and they would wonder "Don't you work?" I was so, so, so ashamed and humiliated of not being employable.

This is one of the reasons I had in developing a relationship with the opposite sex. I know in certain circles, such as in biker gangs, counterculture hippie-artist groups, inner-city ghettos, this is not so much a stigma, but developing relation with a Christian girl in an Evangelical church requires that you have the means to support your wife.

I was often taunted of being a sissy or a [wash my mouth][wash my mouth][wash my mouth] (perhaps they did not mean it literacy and I am not effeminate) but it hurt.

During my visits to several counselors, once they found out I never had a girlfriend, I could forget about ever even getting to my OCD problems. They already had the problem figured out. I had sexual "hang-ups," and the more I tried to divert the conversation to other areas the more they focused on sex. Oh how Freud cause so many problems for OCDers.

I always told I was not normal and almost sub-human because I was celibate. When I tried meekly to tell them it was against my religious beliefs I was told that I was using religion as a crutch.

I find it now so appalling that the very some of the same people say I must go on meds which would prevent my having sex say that in so many words I am sick and now even a marital relationship is not important.

(Let me put a disclaimer here. This conversation is not about mainly on sex, it is about having a Christian relationship with a partner only according to Biblical standards, of which sex in a part, perhaps not the most important part, but part of God's plan for the human race.)

I see the push to pour money into AIDs research. There is already prevention for AIDs, like smallpox which has no cure; just live celibate. However, the money spent on AIDs which could go for OCD, and other diseases where people do not have a choice, is so gays can have prevention from AIDs and have sex.

The same goes for contraceptives for teens and abortion. There is obviously prevention for pregnancy, but that would require asking someone to give up at least some sex, or delay it, but heavens no!

I, who have been celibate for 50 years, only want a companion to help share my struggles (and I would share) are being told that I must take meds. I guess I am outside the human race!

Are you really going to tell me that God loves me, that is Rex?

From Christians I was obviously not derided for not having illicit sex but they were suspicious of me because I did not express interest in woman. Several people (including elders and a pastor) told me explicitly that he often wondered what single guys did with their sex drive and it made them suspicious.

Was I gay? A child molester? Or some kind of pervert? Me, who has been celibate for all my life? That hurts coming from God's people. When I saw Christian counselors, while they did not encourage me to have illicit sex, they would never deviate from wondering why I did not seek a relationship with a woman.

When I mentioned my employment problem I was told by one that I deliberately did not hold jobs down as a mechanism to prevent me from seeking relationships. Oh does that hurt so much!

You say God loves me?

I did not mean to be salacious in any way in this email. But I find that everyone who post replies to me are married women. And the few men who replied are from what I know are married also. I am baffled as how that managed to survive with the normal (non-OCD) world that they could get someone to love them and enter into a marriage.

I guess I am now an outcast even among OCDers!

I will tell you, that from even before I was a Christian, I had absolutely no interest in atheism, Marxism or socialism, other religions, new age or the occult (I was afraid of the occult) secular humanism or any other "ism."

I really never cared of whether science can support the Bible or whether the earth was created in six literal or figurative days. I never sweat over whether a new archeological find seems to disprove or confirm the Bible.

I always believed in a judgment day, hell, eternal damnation and other the scary things in the Bible.

I had never any problems with the fact that God loves others, touched them, makes Himself known to them and gives them “peace that passes human understanding. “

But I cannot believe God loves ME! Why does not he come to me and reassure me? Just have faith and "do not doubt," what does he think I am? An OCDer who does not doubt? The French call OCD the doubting disease. I guess I am condemned (read my new post).

Pastors have mentioned that sinners have a season of pleasure but after that they will face judgment. A "season of pleasure? That’s more than I have. It looks He let my bypassed that phase and sent me directly into hell.

Once again, I have no problem in believing the Bible: God parted the Red Sea; Jesus died and rose on the third day; Jesus performed all the miracles in the Bible. But there is one promise in the Bible I can never seem to grasp.

Does God's promises in the Bible apply to me, that is me, Rex? Are you really sure He loves me or you just saying it because it's not politically correct to condemn anyone to hell in this society?

If you really have communion with God as you say you do, could you ask a favor from Him in my behalf. Ask if I had not committed the unpardonable sin. Remember I blasphemed after I was saved. Ask Him if He loves me and cares for me. And also ask Him to come into my heart and ASSURE me that this is true.

If you do this I will be so thankful.

Rex

 

[kaykay9.0]

You didn't specifically ask me, but I have some thoughts on your last post I'd like to share too. Rex, first of all, I am personally quite sure that you have not blasphemed the Holy Spirit, but I know my "assurance" won't convince you. I will pray that the Lord give you assurance since you asked.

But, the real problem with assurance (and I speak this as someone who also struggles with religious OCD) is there will never be ENOUGH assurance for someone with OCD. You think there will but there won't. The answer, is in the healing from OCD, not the assurance. I 've said before, an angel from heaven could come down and assure you that you were right with God, but soon that would even be enough... Am I making any sense?

I don't know if you have read the website that I and others have frequently posted, but it's a good one. If you haven't, I would really recommend it. www.net-burst.net/guilty/scrupulosity.htm.

Lastly, yes, SSRI's often do cause sexual side effects. Regarding this, I would suggest discussing different ones, dosages, with a competent psychiatrist. However, not everyone who treats OCD believes that drugs are the best/only answer. Others believe that training/counseling is a better treatment route. The author of Brain Lock, for example, isn't against drug therapy for OCD but sees it best used only as temporary "water wings" for those fighting OCD. You might want to pick up a copy of that book and see what he has to say. (It is available from www.amazon.com)

Hopefully, some of the other ladies will have some more to say, but this is kaykay's .02.

 

[Lisa0315]

Well, I am not even officially diagnosed yet. For all I know, the counselor may come back with GAD with perhaps a tendency for OCD. Anyway, I am no expert at this. I have learned about this over the last week.

I have been married for 22 years. It has not been easy. I don't mean the "its alot of hard work". I mean with my problems and my husband's problems, (He is a rapid cycling bipolar) we have both been very unhappy and have dealt with the unhappiness in different ways. So, no, I am not an OCD'r with a sucessful relationship. In fact, I would say that I have pretty much failed at every relationship that I have ever had with family and friends. I do not have close friends. I have acquaintences which I never socialize with. Social anxiety is just one more problem that I have.

Anyway, I have learned that avoidance is a big symptom of this disease. So, first, I would find a different counselor and tell them up front that one of the problems you have is intimacy. Tell them in no uncertain terms that having sex outside of marriage is OUT for you, and it simply may be the last area in which you will deal with. I think you will have to deal with the other aspects of the disease, and as you build confidence, then, you can start working on the other aspects.

You know what would be really cool? If you were to meet a girl in an OCD support group. I bet alot of your problem is the fear that the girl will reject you because of your illness. But, if you met someone who was going through the same thing, well, it might even be something you could laugh about together and support each other through.

BTW, I really respect your commitment to be pure. It is a very rare and special quality.

Lisa

 

[racough]

Lisa

You know I often thought that if I did find a person at a OCD support group it might be both good and bad. If might be good for the obvious reasons. But it might be bad because I am afraid of seeing myself and the negative things that others had dumped on me in a reflection.

However, it could work out.

But I usually think of a normal person, of a person who has a problem in a different area that has great compassion. Perhaps it would be showing me that my present could be palatable and acceptable in a larger world that the OCD world.

I do so much appreciate your kind thoughts, I will post more later but I want to tell you something that I had just sent to someone:

[FONT=&quot]You know back in the days when I was in the dark about OCD there were a few fleeting moments of relief. Here is one example:

Often I would tell someone about my symptoms in a very veiled language.

For example I would express the pressure I felt to reread something a number of times. Most people would think my need to reread something fulfilled some rational need, such as an achievement of mastery in the subject I was reading about. Of course, I would never tell them I had to reread this book as certain amount of times (a lucky number) so as to fulfill an OCD ritual and remove the curse of an OCD thought.

Yet occasionally this would occur with person I would be telling this to (in the veiled language):

Even thought I was totally confident that the person could never had the slightest inkling of what OCD is, sometimes they conveyed the impression that, somehow, they had an insight that I was going through much more of an ordeal than what appeared on the surface, even though they never could say what is was.

I could sense they had picked up on this and in some way I cannot explain, they conveyed to me: "I do not know what you are really going through, but for some reason I just KNOW (or sense, though some insight) you are going through hell. Even though having to re-read something a certain number of times may sound innocuous, I sense this is something more serious than meets the surface. And so I really feel your pain, and I really and deeply feel and sympathize with you."

They never said this in word but I sincerely believed they thought along these lines.

I would come away marveling that this person picked up something, and while never mentioning a thing about OCD, I could really sense a deep, genuine sympathy and while they gave no rational answers to my problem (and hidden ritual) sometimes the ritual would even disappear for a time.

Well I will close for now and thanks for your kind thoughts.


[/FONT]

 

[racough]

[FONT=&quot]Kaykay

I just sent a similar message to Judi but here is the basic same one. (Forgive me it I am confused on whether to reply to each one individually to everyone at the same time. I am new at these forums.

You know I often thought that if I did find a person at a OCD support group it might be both good and bad. If might be good for the obvious reasons. But it might be bad because I am afraid of seeing myself and the negative things that others had dumped on me in a reflection.

However, it could work out.

But I usually think of a normal person, of a person who has a problem in a different area that has great compassion. Perhaps it would be showing me that my present could be palatable and acceptable in a larger world that the OCD world.

I do so much appreciate your kind thoughts, I will post more later but I want to tell you something that I had just sent to someone:

[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]You know back in the days when I was in the dark about OCD there were a few fleeting moments of relief. Here is one example:

Often I would tell someone about my symptoms in a very veiled language.

For example I would express the pressure I felt to reread something a number of times. Most people would think my need to reread something fulfilled some rational need, such as an achievement of mastery in the subject I was reading about. Of course, I would never tell them I had to reread this book as certain amount of times (a lucky number) so as to fulfill an OCD ritual and remove the curse of an OCD thought.

Yet occasionally this would occur with person I would be telling this to (in the veiled language):

Even thought I was totally confident that the person could never had the slightest inkling of what OCD is, sometimes they conveyed the impression that, somehow, they had an insight that I was going through much more of an ordeal than what appeared on the surface, even though they never could say what is was.

I could sense they had picked up on this and in some way I cannot explain, they conveyed to me: "I do not know what you are really going through, but for some reason I just KNOW (or sense, though some insight) you are going through hell. Even though having to re-read something a certain number of times may sound innocuous, I sense this is something more serious than meets the surface. And so I really feel your pain, and I really and deeply feel and sympathize with you."

They never said this in word but I sincerely believed they thought along these lines.

I would come away marveling that this person picked up something, and while never mentioning a thing about OCD, I could really sense a deep, genuine sympathy and while they gave no rational answers to my problem (and hidden ritual) sometimes the ritual would even disappear for a time.

Well I will close for now and thanks for your kind thoughts.[/FONT]

 

[kaykay9.0]

[FONT=&quot]Kaykay[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I just sent a similar message to Judi but here is the basic same one. (Forgive me it I am confused on whether to reply to each one individually to everyone at the same time. I am new at these forums.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]You know I often thought that if I did find a person at a OCD support group it might be both good and bad. If might be good for the obvious reasons. But it might be bad because I am afraid of seeing myself and the negative things that others had dumped on me in a reflection.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]However, it could work out. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]But I usually think of a normal person, of a person who has a problem in a different area that has great compassion. Perhaps it would be showing me that my present could be palatable and acceptable in a larger world that the OCD world. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I do so much appreciate your kind thoughts, I will post more later but I want to tell you something that I had just sent to someone:[/FONT]



[FONT=&quot]You know back in the days when I was in the dark about OCD there were a few fleeting moments of relief. Here is one example:[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Often I would tell someone about my symptoms in a very veiled language. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]For example I would express the pressure I felt to reread something a number of times. Most people would think my need to reread something fulfilled some rational need, such as an achievement of mastery in the subject I was reading about. Of course, I would never tell them I had to reread this book as certain amount of times (a lucky number) so as to fulfill an OCD ritual and remove the curse of an OCD thought. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Yet occasionally this would occur with person I would be telling this to (in the veiled language):[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Even thought I was totally confident that the person could never had the slightest inkling of what OCD is, sometimes they conveyed the impression that, somehow, they had an insight that I was going through much more of an ordeal than what appeared on the surface, even though they never could say what is was. [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I could sense they had picked up on this and in some way I cannot explain, they conveyed to me: "I do not know what you are really going through, but for some reason I just KNOW (or sense, though some insight) you are going through hell. Even though having to re-read something a certain number of times may sound innocuous, I sense this is something more serious than meets the surface. And so I really feel your pain, and I really and deeply feel and sympathize with you." [/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]They never said this in word but I sincerely believed they thought along these lines.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]I would come away marveling that this person picked up something, and while never mentioning a thing about OCD, I could really sense a deep, genuine sympathy and while they gave no rational answers to my problem (and hidden ritual) sometimes the ritual would even disappear for a time.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Well I will close for now and thanks for your kind thoughts.[/FONT]

Well, I would just encourage you, hopefully, by saying that my husband and I have been happily married for 33 years. Has my OCD caused times of pain and hardship for him as well as me? Yes, it has. But I don't think he regrets marrying me because of it. Overall, we are very happy together. Most everyone has some issues. Admitedly, OCD can be a big issue, but that doesn't mean that you can't find someone who can deal with it sucessfully.
Prayers for you~

 

[racough]

I wanted to repost my reply. I use using a computer at school and the building was going to be closed so I was rushing and made some mistakes.
Some people made the comment “they do not have specific answers” and while I do like specific answers there are other things a people can do to help.
For example I have been very touched at the heartfelt comments. Sometimes just feeling someone’s compassion can do so much healing, even with getting a concrete example.
I have in past years occasionally been really helped by someone was a supernatural insight and compassion.
There are several incidents in my life that would illustrate this type of insight and compassion, but I forgot the details. So I will make up an archetype of those real but forgotten incidents, of which I experienced this insight and compassion from others.
Here it is:
As common with OCDers I often felt the need to confess, but the very thing I wanted and needed to confess the most—my OCD—I had to keep veiled. So I would give a diluted version of what I really wanted to unload.
One of the many OCD rituals I had was this: I would have to read something (something I enjoyed) a certained amount of times or it would be erradicated in my brain or I would lose any benefit I may have accured from reading it.
I would often express my frustration to others of having to read this book so many times, without them telling them about the OCD curse associated with this need.
Most people would think my need to reread something a certain amount of times fulfilled some rational need, such as to master book or its subject to achieve some educational benefit—like as though I was studying this in a college course.
The people would respond with a rational argument about I should not pressure myself to overachieve, etc. but never touching on the fact I was doing this to avoid an OCD curse.
Yet sometimes despite my veiled language, a person I have spoken to, with some gift of insight, sensed my anguish, and despite no knowledge of any of my OCD or even OCD itself, looked beyond the superficial, sensed my deep pain and conveyed to me a real sense of compassion.
I am not talking about a perfunctory and obligatory “God is with you. I am sure everything will turn out OK,” but a deep and penetrating empathy that “transcends all human understanding.”
The resulting relief and warmth I received as a result, caused my OCD to melt away (more than any SSRI could have done) and actually for a time, I would not have to carry out my rituals. Unfortunately, these incidents were very rare and fleeting but my only excursion into the non-OCD world.
Secondly
When I blasphemed God, this was when I knew about OCD and still did it voluntarily. I was so angry at God. Strangely the things that cause me to pour anger at God is little things, like forgetting to take my oatmeal raison cookie with me which I so enjoy so much or forgetting my flashdrive. Also when anything messes up a ritual.
[FONT='Times New Roman','serif']
[/FONT]

​

You see, I used to hold it in but when I learned about OCD I thought “What’s the use? I am condemned to this forever. Why even try?”
I am so ashamed to even mention this. Oh God, I wish you would forgive me. I tasted some of your goodness and now I want to repent. I am so evil. It is not just OCD but me. Oh how I would love you know your forgiveness.
Do you people think this is sufficient for God to forgive me? Know that I knew what I was doing when I blasphemed. Oh God would have to be so merciful to forgive me.
It was not just thoughts I was pouring out anger. I am ashamed to tell you what I said.
Thank you for reading this post.
Rex

 

[kaykay9.0]

Well, Rex, a long time ago I shared a story on this forum about one of our former pastors. He and his wife lost a baby at birth (stillborn.) He was so angry at God about this that he used to go out in his back yard and yell things at God like, " Why don't you just strike me dead and send me to hell right now because there's one thing I know I'm going to like about hell. YOU won't be there!" And he did this kind of thing not just once but repeatedly. (He was already in the ministry at this time.) Needless, to say he got out of the ministry and went into sales. He was really good at sales, too, and financially did very well. To make a long story short, however, he found he couldn't live without God in his life. He had essentially an "emotional breakdown" and was committed short-term to a psychiatric facility. He turned back to God.

He said that those nights when he would go outside and shout whatever awful things he could think of to God, he would sense God say back to him something like, "You're going to be alright, son." That made him madder.

Today this man is a pastor and has been in fruitful, productive ministry for many years now. I know that God forgave him of his anger. Personally, I believe that anyone who still desires forgiveness is able to be forgiven by God.