Are evil desires considered sin?

[Carico]

James 1; 13-15 says, "but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed. Then, after desire has conceived, gives birth to sin, and sin when it is full grown, gives birth to death." According to this passage, evil desires are only precursors to sin. Then Jesus said, 'whoever looks at a woman lustfully, he has already committed adultery with her in his heart. If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away..." Here, he said CAUSES you to sin which means that evil desires lead to sin rather than that they are sin. He is showing us that even if your actions are perfect, our hearts are not which is why we need Him. We do need him in order to change our hearts, but are our desires sin?

 

[d0c markus]

I think not yet, christ can overcome our evil desires, and when he does that and prevents us from acting on them then we have not fallen into sin. I bet that makes satan so mad!

 

[ydouxist]

James 1; 13-15 says, "but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed. Then, after desire has conceived, gives birth to sin, and sin when it is full grown, gives birth to death." According to this passage, evil desires are only precursors to sin. Then Jesus said, 'whoever looks at a woman lustfully, he has already committed adultery with her in his heart. If your right eye causes you to sin, gouge it out and throw it away..." Here, he said CAUSES you to sin which means that evil desires lead to sin rather than that they are sin. He is showing us that even if your actions are perfect, our hearts are not which is why we need Him. We do need him in order to change our hearts, but are our desires sin?

I don't believe they are. "It says after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin,"
What do we do with our desires when we have them? This is the very thing God has been dealing with me on. We are only human but at the same time, "We have the mind of Christ." Thats why it says,"To him who overcomes"
We should never accept sin as a part of life.

 

[Carico]

I agree 100% with that! But, even though we have evil desires many times each day, are those really sins? Or is it irrelevant? I definitely do not want to have envy, greed, pride, lust, or anger, and God's love and mercy does turn those into thankfulness, humility, love, and compassion, but according to James, those are not sins, only actions are.

 

[d0c markus]

Hmm.. is it a sin to say have a pornographic dream?

 

[Carico]

According to Jesus, it's an evil desire, not a sin. But it can lead to sin if we don't ask God to turn lust into genuine love.

 

[ydouxist]

According to Jesus, it's an evil desire, not a sin. But it can lead to sin if we don't ask God to turn lust into genuine love.

It only leads to sin if we dwell on the desires. I'm not really sure of what you mean by "ask God to turn lust into genuine love"

 

[Carico]

Once we confess our sins and seek to not want selfish desires, God's love and mercy fill our hearts which makes us thankful and desire to love others and please Him more than ourslves. The more sins we confess, the more love and forgiveness fills our hearts until we desire that more than worldly appetites. The fruits of the spirit gives us much more satisfaction than the desires of the flesh. Pretty soon, our wolrdly appeities fall away and all that's left is the spirit. That's my goal.

 

[Philip]

The desires are a product of our fallen nature and separation from God. They are not themselves sins.

 

[Carico]

I agree.

 

[ydouxist]

The desires are a product of our fallen nature and separation from God. They are not themselves sins.

Short and well stated. We stand in agreement brother.

 

[Palatka44]

The desires are a product of our fallen nature and separation from God. They are not themselves sins.

That deserves a hardy Baptist AHMEN!!!!

 

[Hidden in Christ]

Well, I believe that, apart from Christ, our hearts are "deceitful and desperately wicked." I also believe that Jesus teaches purity of heart as well as purity of action. He says that if you lust in your heart, that is as bad as committing adultery in His eyes. And if you hate in your heart, that is as evil as murder. God looks on the heart, even if you have not actually done the physical action of sin. I think it is wrong to justify evil desires by saying that they are not as bad as the physical action. However, I do heartily agree that it would cause far less damage for someone to only think a sinful thought and not act on it. Any idiot can see that is true. But the Spirit of God can help us not to have evil desires. For me personally, when I am where I need to be with God, if an evil desire starts to whisper tempting thoughts to me, the Spirit of God then whispers words of love and purity that are far more powerful, and I forget about the evil desire. I have found also that my dreams are even pure when I'm walking close to God, because His holiness is such a strong presence in my heart and mind when I am awake. I definitely believe God wants to and is able to cleanse us from the inside out.

 

[Carico]

I don't think we're justifying evil desires. I think we're saying that if left unchecked, they lead to sin. Jesus is the only answer to our evil desires and resulting sin. We still need Him for our evil desires. He has to cleanse us from the inside out. There is no other way. He starts with the heart. We're just having a conversation about what sin actually is according to Christ.

 

[He put me back together]

I think there is a pretty good essence here. We know from new testiment teaching, particularly from Christ, that sin occurs in the heart, not in the hands. Verily, I think that one's heart is that which must be changed. We CAN in fact follow the Torah to a T on our own--I haven't read any new testiment teaching that says we cannot. Following the Torah, however, does not purify a man's heart--nor can the man himself. Christ's blood raises us from the dead. He did what the Torah was powerless to do--he changes our hearts, from the heart of a sinner to the heart of a saint. Christ changes what cannot be seen. The changing of the heart is what I understand to be salvation; the changing of the heart from corruptable to incorruptable, from evil to the likeness of Christ, is being raised from the dead.

So, as we all agree that sin occurs in the heart rather than the hands, I believe it is also imperative, as it seems many of you in this thread agree, to decifer between temptation and sin. Temptation is not sin--evil thoughts are not sin. If evil thoughts were sin, Christ would be a sinner, because Christ had evil thoughts. (The temptation in the wilderness, Matt 4, Luke 4) Giving in to evil thoughts is sin. Comitting evil in your heart is sin--but it is not sin to stumble upon thoughts of evil, or thoughts of doing evil. It is obviously important to pray to God to help you with temptation, as "Lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil." is a component of the Lord's prayer, but I think that expecting God to remove all evil thoughts, when Christ himself was not void of evil thoughts, is a waste of energy that could be spent elsewhere. I say do what Christ did--rebuke the source of the evil thoughts, and go on with what God has for you to do. I believe that we can be free from sin, but as long as we are here, the tempter will try us. That's what I feel is the root of the matter...as far as "desire" is concerned, I suppose that depends on how one defines the word.

 

[RhetorTheo]

As Jesus said about lusting after women, to think the thought is, by itself, to sin. So, by Jesus's standard, you sin merely by having bad thoughts, regardless of whether you act on them. Certainly anyone who thinks bad thoughts and acts on them (self-abuse) is a serious sinner.

 

[RhetorTheo]

I think you can interpret the words of Jesus to say that a person who lusts after a married woman, thinking "I really would love to sleep with her but I won't because God tells me I can't," is sinning. But mere physical attraction may not be sinful. This would be akin to God wanting a cheerful giver, not someone who follows his word but with gritting teeth. This is just one interpretation of Jesus's words, but it would be more consistent with other things said in the Bible about sin.

 

[Sharky]

I think evil desires are pretty much on the same level as temptation. Like an urge to do something evil.

I say unwilling evil desires are temptation. Willing sinful desires are probably sin too.

I'm not 100% sure someone correct me if i'm wrong.

 

[Icystwolf]

I think evil desires are pretty much on the same level as temptation. Like an urge to do something evil.

I say unwilling evil desires are temptation. Willing sinful desires are probably sin too.

I'm not 100% sure someone correct me if i'm wrong.

I think it comes down to acknowledging whether it's a sin you'll be committing. If forexample you want to hurt someone, but you had no intention of really hurting him/her....and in the end you didn't do it, then it's not really a sin. However if you want to hurt a person, and you know that it was wrong for you to hurt him/her, and you still continued with that...then....


It gets to a number of levels and degrees of conscience to decide that...

I think it's too confusing to think about it, and it's not worth finding out the borders to commit them.....

Better to keep away as much as possible is my way!

 

[He put me back together]

As Jesus said about lusting after women, to think the thought is, by itself, to sin. So, by Jesus's standard, you sin merely by having bad thoughts, regardless of whether you act on them. Certainly anyone who thinks bad thoughts and acts on them (self-abuse) is a serious sinner.

Hi, RoleTroll. I'm interested to hear your opinion about Jesus' thoughts in Matthew chapter 4 and Luke 4.