AP students question #one

[Connect]

Good morning all. My Brother in law has some AP students that asked the following question and I was hoping to get some thoughts from you thinkers please.

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How does one look at the fails, deficiencies of our world and basic tragedy and evil, without surmising there is little evidence in a loving and omnipotent God and conclude there is not a God who is actively concerned in the affairs of humans or as the theist existentialist tenants, it is impossible to conclude or assert anything about God.

Thank you for sharing your ideas on this question. I guess they have given him 4 main questions and the above is the first. [/FONT]
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[Ana the Ist]

Denial.

 

[Connect]

Hi Ana the Ist. Denial what? Do you have some thoughts to share with me on their question?

 

[Ana the Ist]

Hi Ana the Ist. Denial what? Do you have some thoughts to share with me on their question?

Sure...question was "how" answer was "denial".

 

[Connect]

I dont understand what you are saying sir

 

[Chany]

I dont understand what you are saying sir

He is saying the only possible way to reach the conclusion that the amount of evil in the world is compatible with an all loving theistic deity is through denial; one must psychologically reject any problem via a weak justification.

The only way to justify God in the world is to show evidence for the existence of God so great that it outweighs the evidence against God.

 

[keith99]

Being a reasonably honest man of wealth and taste I'll give my answer.

There is no way to support the idea of an omnipotent God with any degree of benevolence.

But I personally find no claim of omnipotence, especially in the modern sense, being made for the Christian God in Scripture.

One powerful entity, sure. The most powerful of all, sure. But not Omnipotent. And it seems scripture claims there are other powerful entities. Entities far more powerful and knowledgeable than men which think they could overthrow the Christian God. It would seem such entities would have to be pretty close in power to think they could overthrow Him, even if they were delusional.

IF there is any truth to the Christian stories I think they show something much closer to an equal struggle than one entity firmly in control.

 

[Hawkins]

Good morning all. My Brother in law has some AP students that asked the following question and I was hoping to get some thoughts from you thinkers please.

[FONT='Calibri','sans-serif'] Thank you for sharing your ideas on this question. I guess they have given him 4 main questions and the above is the first. [/FONT]
[FONT='Calibri','sans-serif'][/FONT]
[FONT='Calibri','sans-serif']Connect[/FONT]

The Christian God won't make the contradiction that He loves the wolves while loving the sheep. If He loves the wolves He'll feed them with the sheep.

God's love is thus dedicated to His sheep and His sheep only.

Planet earth is not paradise. It's a wilderness full of wolves. God's job here is to get His sheep identified openly such that He will legitimately bring them to heaven.

Only heaven is a perfect world. Humans here expect too much without actually understanding God's purpose of planet earth.

 

[juvenissun]

Good morning all. My Brother in law has some AP students that asked the following question and I was hoping to get some thoughts from you thinkers please.

[FONT='Calibri','sans-serif'] Thank you for sharing your ideas on this question. I guess they have given him 4 main questions and the above is the first. [/FONT]
[FONT='Calibri','sans-serif'][/FONT]
[FONT='Calibri','sans-serif']Connect[/FONT]

There are also many examples on the opposite case. They do show a loving God.

 

[Connect]

He is saying the only possible way to reach the conclusion that the amount of evil in the world is compatible with an all loving theistic deity is through denial; one must psychologically reject any problem via a weak justification.

The only way to justify God in the world is to show evidence for the existence of God so great that it outweighs the evidence against God.

Yes, and that has not been shown. Thank you for that help Chany

 

[Connect]

Being a reasonably honest man of wealth and taste I'll give my answer.

There is no way to support the idea of an omnipotent God with any degree of benevolence.

But I personally find no claim of omnipotence, especially in the modern sense, being made for the Christian God in Scripture.

One powerful entity, sure. The most powerful of all, sure. But not Omnipotent. And it seems scripture claims there are other powerful entities. Entities far more powerful and knowledgeable than men which think they could overthrow the Christian God. It would seem such entities would have to be pretty close in power to think they could overthrow Him, even if they were delusional.

IF there is any truth to the Christian stories I think they show something much closer to an equal struggle than one entity firmly in control.

Thank you. I cant fathom something equally as powerful as God. Perhaps "not God" and human choice to deny accepting God. Free choice for example but I;m not sure if that is what u are talking about in your post.

 

[Connect]

The Christian God won't make the contradiction that He loves the wolves while loving the sheep. If He loves the wolves He'll feed them with the sheep.

God's love is thus dedicated to His sheep and His sheep only.

Planet earth is not paradise. It's a wilderness full of wolves. God's job here is to get His sheep identified openly such that He will legitimately bring them to heaven.

Only heaven is a perfect world. Humans here expect too much without actually understanding God's purpose of planet earth.

Thank you Hawkins. God is seeking the sheep as you said to bring them to heaven. In heaven there was rebellion with a lot of angels being sent out though too.

 

[Connect]

There are also many examples on the opposite case. They do show a loving God.

"God is love." God cant be anything agaist his nature imo. Will you please list some examples of the opposite case as you said above?

 

[Albion]

Good morning all. My Brother in law has some AP students that asked the following question and I was hoping to get some thoughts from you thinkers please.

How does one look at the fails, deficiencies of our world and basic tragedy and evil, without surmising there is little evidence in a loving and omnipotent God and conclude there is not a God who is actively concerned in the affairs of humans or as the theist existentialist tenants, it is impossible to conclude or assert anything about God.

Gosh. There are a number of ways of debunking such a superficial approach to this issue. The most obvious may be that God has some reason for letting us live through such experiences. Too obvious, eh?

Many's a toddler who wonders how a real parent could force him to undergo such an awful thing as an immunization, too. I wonder if this "AP" class that couldn't even put its question in grammatically correct form could handle that one before moving on to proving or disproving God.

 

[Paradoxum]

The Christian God won't make the contradiction that He loves the wolves while loving the sheep. If He loves the wolves He'll feed them with the sheep.

God's love is thus dedicated to His sheep and His sheep only.

Planet earth is not paradise. It's a wilderness full of wolves. God's job here is to get His sheep identified openly such that He will legitimately bring them to heaven.

Only heaven is a perfect world. Humans here expect too much without actually understanding God's purpose of planet earth.

How is healing all people the same as feeding sheep to wolves? It's not as if only bad people die of cancer anyway.

Gosh. There are a number of ways of debunking such a superficial approach to this issue. The most obvious may be that God has some reason for letting us live through such experiences. Too obvious, eh?

Many's a toddler who wonders how a real parent could force him to undergo such an awful thing as an immunization, too. I wonder if this "AP" class that couldn't even put its question in grammatically correct form could handle that one before moving on to proving or disproving God.

And what would be the reason for children getting cancer and dying?

Saying 'God might have a reason' doesn't explain anything... it just sweeps the problem under the carpet.

I don't think there is a possible good reason for allow someone to be raped and murdered. Nothing justifies allowing someone to be violated like that.

Also, lots of people aren't raped and murdered. So is rape and murder required for this great moral plan or not? If a few people need to be raped murdered in Gods plan, why not everyone, if it's so great for them?

Just sayin...

 

[Albion]

And what would be the reason for children getting cancer and dying?

Look, this is sophomoric. We do not know everything about God's doings and purposes and we cannot know everything. That's because the nature of the inquiry deals with things above our "grade level." We can know much, but it doesn't follow that we must know everything or else there can't be a God.

I said there are a number of possible answers, all sensible. However, I'm not going to proceed to prove God to anyone when the question of the OP didn't even ask that of us! It is sufficient to say that the question the class posed is not worth asking, being little more than a complicated and ungrammatical way of saying "We don't know everything about God, so we're going to conclude that he doesn't exist."

 

[Connect]

[FONT='Verdana','sans-serif']Thank you for your replies Albion and Paradoxum as a child who does not understand the reason for their parents behavior and they feel mistreated the parent has plans and a fuller undemanding of what they do as God does. Pradoxum pointed out why not also violate the whole population. My issue with that is God will punish many as not all will be saved. He wishes that none perish but they do, they do not come to God. He also provides a way to salvation, the gift of God which is the ransom of Jesus to cover the sins of the world. Did I understand the both of your posts? Para you seem to think it "is an unjust moral plan" is that correct? What would make a better moral plan if that's what you are saying? Thank you. [/FONT]

 

[juvenissun]

"God is love." God cant be anything agaist his nature imo. Will you please list some examples of the opposite case as you said above?

Parents love children. Employees love boss. Soldiers love country. Etc.
If you do not know more examples of love, you have big problem.

 

[leftrightleftrightleft]

Thank you. I cant fathom something equally as powerful as God. Perhaps "not God" and human choice to deny accepting God. Free choice for example but I;m not sure if that is what u are talking about in your post.

I think keith99 was referring to things like Satan, demons, angels and other spiritual entities. Christianity often highlights the spiritual struggle between God and Satan. Since there is such a struggle present in the literature, it would imply that God is not omnipotent.

 

[Chany]

Thank you for your replies Albion and Paradoxum as a child who does not understand the reason for their parents behavior and they feel mistreated the parent has plans and a fuller undemanding of what they do as God does. Pradoxum pointed out why not also violate the whole population. My issue with that is God will punish many as not all will be saved. He wishes that none perish but they do, they do not come to God. He also provides a way to salvation, the gift of God which is the ransom of Jesus to cover the sins of the world. Did I understand the both of your posts? Para you seem to think it "is an unjust moral plan" is that correct? What would make a better moral plan if that's what you are saying? Thank you.

You are surprising non-confrontational for someone posting in these forums.