Anything goes?

[Polycarp_fan]

So, you can prove original sin to the degree that we can prove, say, gravity?

In a preschool (playground or classroom).

And all the way to our universities (playground or classroom)

Next easy assigment?

 

[Andreusz]

The existence of bad traits in human beings is in no way a proof of the existence of original sin, unless you define the former as the latter. The doctrine of original sin consists of a set of propositions (existence of Adam and Eve, existence of God, guilt by inheritence, rationality of Paul of Tarsus), all of which are scientifically unprovable.

 

[Polycarp_fan]

The existence of bad traits in human beings is in no way a proof of the existence of original sin, unless you define the former as the latter. The doctrine of original sin consists of a set of propositions (existence of Adam and Eve, existence of God, guilt by inheritence, rationality of Paul of Tarsus), all of which are scientifically unprovable.

Scientifically unprovable?

Observation, cause and effect is not a scientific method for determining things?

Why do good people do so many bad things to other good people?

Sin orientation?

I must have missed the history lessons about the waves of invading armies sweeping over other lands bringing food, clothing and building materials? I was taught quite a different story.

I've lived quite awhile and have yet to see the evidence not strongly suggest a congenital condition for immorality and injustice to be so ubiquitous an occurence throughout the existence of the human species.

But hey, who wants to look at facts.

 

[Andreusz]

No-one's disputing the facts. I am saying that ascribing those facts to original sin is not even vaguely scientific.

 

[Polycarp_fan]

No-one's disputing the facts. I am saying that ascribing those facts to original sin is not even vaguely scientific.

I am saying that they are.

Apply the scientific method of observing cause and effect to behaviors over a vast expanse of time. We have enough experiements to make a solid statement.

Andy, OK, you're a decent enough guy for the most part. It's time for you to give ground to the logic inherent in the theistic position of Christian thought. At least on this issue.

 

[Polycarp_fan]

And I step again . . .

Originally Posted by Andreusz

The existence of bad traits in human beings is in no way a proof of the existence of original sin, unless you define the former as the latter. The doctrine of original sin consists of a set of propositions (existence of Adam and Eve, existence of God, guilt by inheritence, rationality of Paul of Tarsus), all of which are scientifically unprovable.
​

Scientifically unprovable?

Observation, cause and effect is not a scientific method for determining things?

Why do good people do so many bad things to other good people?

Sin orientation?

I must have missed the history lessons about the waves of invading armies sweeping over other lands bringing food, clothing and building materials? I was taught quite a different story.

I've lived quite awhile and have yet to see the evidence not strongly suggest a congenital condition for immorality and injustice to be so ubiquitous an occurence throughout the existence of the human species.

But hey, who wants to look at facts.

Andy, the atheist assertion, that bad things happening to good people is unfair, is a great place to observe original sin tried and found true.

 

[Gilyon]

It's not scientific to say "X is the reason for Y. I see Y therefor X". If I say "It rains because the giant Cry Bear carebear in his rainbow palace is using his rain beam" and then see it rain, that doesn't make it true.

 

[Psudopod]

Andy, the atheist assertion, that bad things happening to good people is unfair, is a great place to observe original sin tried and found true.

Please clarify. The concept that bad things happenign to good people is unfair is only true if there is an an existing force that is capable of punishing the bad and rewarding the good and is failing to do so consistantly. Otherwise it's not unfair, just unlucky.

 

[Polycarp_fan]

It's not scientific to say "X is the reason for Y. I see Y therefor X". If I say "It rains because the giant Cry Bear carebear in his rainbow palace is using his rain beam" and then see it rain, that doesn't make it true.

I'm thinking science pretty much has proven the whole rain thing.

Anything goes?

That's a liberal thing brought to us by the observation of cause and effect. Like how rain is "caused."

Well sort of. Facts are liberals don't allow just any anything goes things. 'Cuz usually the things that stop the anything goes thing is stopped. Which of course still shows anything goes for what it is.

 

[Psudopod]

Originally Posted by Gilyon

It's not scientific to say "X is the reason for Y. I see Y therefor X". If I say "It rains because the giant Cry Bear carebear in his rainbow palace is using his rain beam" and then see it rain, that doesn't make it true.
​

I'm thinking science pretty much has proven the whole rain thing.

Well done on missing the point utterly there.

Well sort of. Facts are liberals don't allow just any anything goes things. 'Cuz usually the things that stop the anything goes thing is stopped. Which of course still shows anything goes for what it is.

But of course this isn't true. For example, take the smoking ban in my country. Fought for and won by the left, largely. But this is a removal of freedom and against the idea of anything goes.

 

[Maren]

It hasn't been a civl right before.

And do you really think that the crisis in youth has been as bad as it is now?

Sure I do. A quote attributed to Socrates, "The children now love luxury; they have bad manners, contempt for authority; they show disrespect for elders and love chatter in lace of exercise. Children are now tyrants, not the servants of their households. They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize their teachers."

From Hesiod in the 8th Century B.C., "I see no hope for the future of our people if they are dependent on the frivolous youth of today, for certainly all youth are reckless beyond words. When I was a boy, we were taught to be discrete and respectful of elders, but the present youth are exceedingly wise and impatient of restraint."

From Peter the Hermit from about a thousand years ago, "The world is passing through troublous times. The young people of today think of nothing but themselves. They have no reverence for parents or old age. They are impatient of all restraint. They talk as if they knew everything, and what passes for wisdom with us is foolishness with them. As for the girls, they are forward, immodest and unladylike in speech, behavior and dress."

It seems that pretty much every generation in history thinks the generation after them is the "worst ever".