The General Mental Health Forum is now a Read Only Forum. As we had two large areas making it difficult for many to find, we decided to combine the Mental Health & the Recovery sections of the forum into Mental Health & Recovery as a whole. Physical Health still remains as it's own area within the entire Recovery area.
If you are having struggles, need support in a particular area that you aren't finding a specific recovery area forum, you may find the General Struggles forum a great place to post. Any any that is related to emotions, self-esteem, insomnia, anger, relationship dynamics due to mental health and recovery and other issues that don't fit better in another forum would be examples of topics that might go there.
If you have spiritual issues related to a mental health and recovery issue, please use the Recovery Related Spiritual Advice forum. This forum is designed to be like Christian Advice, only for recovery type of issues. Recovery being like a family in many ways, allows us to support one another together. May you be blessed today and each day.
Kristen.NewCreation and FreeinChrist
Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
thanks for your kind, encouraging and tender words. Today I especially needed them. This time of year is very difficult for me, on several levels. But one reason is because many years ago, I was away at school. My parents were suppose to come to pick me up about 10-11 am, before the school was closed for Christmas vacation. The dorm was locked and I was locked out in the snow about noon, it was almost 10 pm before my parents finally showed up without any word. When they got there i asked them why they were late, they shrugged and said because they left late. The emotions of being abandoned on the streets of Ft. Wayne Ind. without somewhere to go, still haunts me. so when our son was missing and the realization that we couldn't find him, hit, all I could think was to let him know we were coming, that we hadn't abandoned him. The thought of him dieing, without knowing that we were looking for him, haunts me, especially this time of year. I feel, think, that we need to go pick him up from school (he was planning on attending school) but I don't know where to go or where to pick him up, and I don't want him to feel abandoned. I know that sounds kind of crazy, and maybe it is crazy, but it is the honest emotional response I battle, I just want him to know that the very second we knew something was wrong, we were there, searching and would never, ever, abandon him, not for a second, not at the cost of our very lives, we would always come, always. Oh how I want to say that to him, how I want him to know that even though he was alone, we were there, we were coming...it wasn't just God with him (I know he knew that, long story) but we were coming to....we would always come and are coming even now...Hi Razz,
This is my first post (been lurking a while, though), but I hear your heart and I just had to respond.
I am so sorry for your loss. I lost a son myself about 5 years ago (he was 7), so I know what it is like to be the member of this club that no one would ever join.
Your Dad in heaven mourns with you, too. We do not worship some cynical robot of justice in the sky, or a heartless vulcan Experimenter. Our God is the Servant King. He gave His own Son up for us, even while we were still in our sin. (So I'll have to amend that earlier statement - God Himself joined this awful club intentionally.) "Let us then with confidence draw near to the throne of grace, that we may receive mercy and find grace to help in time of need."
I am horrified by the way you are being treated by some others in the name of our Dad. Horrified and disgusted. These are the same sort that nailed Jesus to a chunk of wood for daring to declare "mercy and not sacrifice". Brood of vipers! Where are your brothers and sisters in Christ?!
You are being attacked by Job's friends. And just as Job was vindicated, so will you be. Don't listen to the Accuser no matter what form he comes in. You are the daughter of the Living God. He knows your grief and your rage first-hand, and He will not let you walk alone. You are His.
I pray that Dad will send you a friend to be a balm to your heart. I pray that you and your husband will be able to be gentle to each other through this terrible time. And I pray that Dad will send His Spirit to fill you and give you the power of His grace when you are faced with the evil of this world.
Peace to you sister
thanks...I'm not sure I could have found as much healing as I have without my husband, I can't even imagine going through a day without him by my side, holding each other up. The other kids help, but it isn't the same.((Hugs)) Our society has a terrible time dealing with death. Complicating it further, are the people who want to add significance to situations that are purely accidental or just parts of life. I lost my husband to cancer. No, he wasn't evil or doiing something to deserve God's wrath...he simply was a good man living in a fallen world that has disease in it...he died of skin cancer that was probably cause by his genetics.
Anyway, I digress. I am sorry that you are having to deal with these idiots along with your family's grief. It is more common than many people realize though.
We can't put links on this forum so I want to suggest you look into a group called Compassionate Friends....(google it). This is a wonderful nationwide grief support group for people who have lost children. There is online support as well as local groups. Those of us who are living with grief know that there isn't anything magical about that one year date. Life didn't go back to normal and our hearts didn't suddenly mend. ((hugs)) to your family.
the highlighted words have been haunting me. My husband and I are studying counseling (long story) and so this is especially interesting to me. How prevalent is it for people to say and do things like reduce the dead to money, be jealous over the loss, accuse the death of being judgment for believing what scripture says, etc. I would think that the majority of people would be like the majority of our church home and extended family that offer support, prayers, holding their tongue, etc. Anything they can do to ease the pain. How prevalent is the above behavior really? Can you provide any support for this claim some study, or something for us to review as we continue our adventure into the counseling side of thing? Thanks((Hugs)) Our society has a terrible time dealing with death. Complicating it further, are the people who want to add significance to situations that are purely accidental or just parts of life. I lost my husband to cancer. No, he wasn't evil or doiing something to deserve God's wrath...he simply was a good man living in a fallen world that has disease in it...he died of skin cancer that was probably cause by his genetics.
Anyway, I digress. I am sorry that you are having to deal with these idiots along with your family's grief. It is more common than many people realize though.
We can't put links on this forum so I want to suggest you look into a group called Compassionate Friends....(google it). This is a wonderful nationwide grief support group for people who have lost children. There is online support as well as local groups. Those of us who are living with grief know that there isn't anything magical about that one year date. Life didn't go back to normal and our hearts didn't suddenly mend. ((hugs)) to your family.
I know that sounds kind of crazy, and maybe it is crazy, but it is the honest emotional response I battle, I just want him to know that the very second we knew something was wrong, we were there, searching and would never, ever, abandon him, not for a second, not at the cost of our very lives, we would always come, always..
Our society has a terrible time dealing with death.
honestly, that part doesn't bother me too much. There are people who try to avoid the topic and us, but to me, that is just their way of grieving, so I don't put too much into it, I just allow them to grieve in their own way.I belong and participate on several young widows boards...and the horror stories that you read there are very common.
I was told "to write my address book in pencil" by a lovely widow very early in my journal because the people that were in my life would be very different in a year. And she was right. My married Christian friends were among the worst. These are women that trusted their children and wanted to spend time with me before and even stood with me in the hospital as my husband was dying. Since it took many months for me to even find the energy to participate in life, I don't know if they thought I wasn't interested in friendship anymore. I'd go to events and they would almost look horrified if they accidently bumped into me and would duck out as fast as they could. I don't know if my situation was a scary reminder of how delicate life is, or if they worried that now I was 'single' that I'd be husband hunting among their men, or if there was just something wrong with me that God would allow this to happen to us?
To be totally honest, I thought that kind of stuff was just life in an extended family and have no real understanding that it is surrounding grief, this is all very interesting stuff to me. Some of my extending family has already done everything in their power to destroy relationships, and then blame us for it. In fact, my parents tried a long time ago to turn our own kids against us. That didn't start happening when our son died, it happened way long before that. Very interesting, I think I can learn much here.As for my 'family' (actually my husband's family), a few members constantly looked to me to support them in their grief since I looked so strong. I was far from it. I heard that my MIL was calling my nephew "little Billy" because he looked like my husband ... something that would have killed my preteen son who spent hours in the mirror trying to find pieces of his dad in his reflection. They also talked about doing things with my kids but the invites never came. I moved 1500 miles away to a place where we knew no one so that this families' grief wouldn't ruin their relationship with my kids. Now when we visit, they are a priority and they don't have to see what I saw.
you know, a friend of ours recently had a heart attack, he was telling us how hard it was cause his children and grandchildren never come to visit or help after he got out of the hospital. Again, I never thought about these things being related to grief, to me they are just part of everyday life. I never realized they were attached to grief until he was telling his story.People made a lot of promises, but not one person followed through. Not even one man called to invite my son to go fishing or hunting even though they know he was both passionate about these activites and they had been an important part of his life with his dad.
yeah, this one I am familiar with...In fact, I guard myself against it with others I know who have lost...as to widows, I don't really know, I have not had to face that. I was told that for loosing a child it takes 3-4 years for it to be tolerable, I have also been told that it is the worst loss (I'm not sure about any of that, like I said, I can't personally compare it, but I have been told that by people who have lost both).The church and people as a whole, expect us to be "okay" and "normal" within months and if not, after that first year (which for a widow at least, is really just a beginning because that first year is just about surviving...the second year is when we have to start figuring out who we are now...and the truth is that we never stop thinking about our dead spouses on a daily basis...and I'm talking 15 years out and remarried). The church gets 'tired' of our grief and wants us to be "doing something about it" fairly quickly. On the flipside, there is zero guidance from anyone or even books that tells us how to manage the loneliness and parenting issues (like kid's weddings or graduations without dad or mom) that happen many years later.
I've often wondered about that advice, glad I'm not the only one who found it strange.When we become widowed, we are treated like we are children and people seem to feel like they have the right to very personal aspects of our life (financial especially). The advice is "not to do anything major for a year" but real life doesn't always allow us that luxury.
isn't that human nature, to want everyone to make the same decisions we think we would, but given the other persons shoes, it isn't as cut and dry as we first tried to make it? Oh that we would never fall into that same trap.Also people are horrified if we hang out with members of the opposite sex. I made friends with a widower who had kids the same age and wife also died of cancer. I lost family members over that relationship even though it was very therapeutic to find someone who I really could talk to. I also found it very damaging for everyone to treat me like I couldn't make good decisions anymore. It was very hard to make all the decisions alone but then they crushed what little confidence I did still have. I also was amazed with how many people wanted me to live the life that they thought they would have lived or that was best for them.
I guess, what I am confused about, is that these things seem to me to be more normal because they are based on the relationship the person had with the person who died. For example, the mother who demanded her son's ashed...where her behavior is attrocious, it is based on her relationship and grief, not on a purpose to destroy another human being and remove value from them. In fact, in a warped way, it gives value to the son that died.Other people's stories...a mother who demanded her son's ashes from his widow because "he had been hers longer". Families & "friends" coming in and wanting all the spouses things ... however, yes, she may still need that chainsaw ... or her baby boy might someday want daddy's hunting guns. Families that treat the widow like they are divorced "ex"es and not mourning loving spouses. Families that reject the dead's children...never calling or even sending Christmas or birthday gifts (unfortunately, not uncommon). And this is only a limited list.
oh, I have absolutely no problem believing that, what I took my by surprise was your claim that the evils we have known are common.As for documentation? Well, nobody studies us past the first year ... or maybe first couple years. I did read a study that looked at widows much further out and the researchers were amazed to find out that we never really go back to "normal" and that the average time frame for still thinking about the dead spouse on at least a weekly basis was 37 years after death! That we have a NEED to talk about them long after we stop finding people willing to listen.
June was one year for us, and I think we are still in shock...I totally think that numb would be goodGrief is poorly understood and I have read that even some psychology experts want to label our grief as "complicated" or as "depression" if we aren't "normal" within even WEEKS...darn, we aren't even done being numb in that time period.
we found our help in scripture where it says to take your thoughts captive unto the Lord. That helped so very much, it is still a struggle and still helping.Also "grief" and "depression" are often used interchangably but they are very different. We have a REASON for our sadness and we behave differently. I am grateful that the same drugs do help our brains become stabilized enough to live our lives while we are learning how to cope. There is so little rhyme or reason to how these are used...pushed on people who just need help crying...and denied to people who are struggling to find a way to function.
very wise words, that the tears are for self...very wise indeed...for me, I want people to just accept that the tears only speak of how great our love was/is, I want people to treat me like they always did, I'm the same person after all. I don't mind Jonathan coming up in conversation, but let it be a natural part of life, not purposed to bring him up, or purposed to never mention him, but just part of the nature flow of life, the memories that we find strengthening, the tears that we find healing, and the pain that is the natural part of life that is lost.How do you help? Be available to listen to us talk about our lost ones. Don't try to get us to stop crying because we need to get those tears out. The tears are there even if you don't see them. Don't tell us tired things like "they are in a better place" or "at least he died quickly"...but we think the better place is with US and we don't think there is any "good" way to die...we want "at least, he is still alive". As a Christian, I KNOW my husband is with God and in the better place...but my tears are for me, being left behind and alone. A counselor needs to understand that only we know when it is "time" to try something ... and even if it is obviously "too soon", we need to figure that out ourself and just have support waiting when we fall on our faces.
how do you mean, biblical support? I'm not sure I am following your questions here. When Jonathan died, my husband and I purposed to find comfort in God (as well as each other, the kids, and the church family that were there for us). So we found biblical support, like taking our thoughts captive unto the Lord and biblical Love that puts his interest above our own pain. These concepts have given us more healing than most of the people in our church can fathom and they look to us for help with their own struggles because of it. But as to financial, or moving forward in remarriage, and the like, I'm not sure what biblical support there is, that seems more like an individual God and you (generic you) decision, so I'm not sure what you mean here...thanks in advance for helping out here and thanks so much for sharing, it is helping me understand some things.I also wish I could find someone who would help me find Bible support. I open the Bible and see that other people prayed and were given their loved ones back. I assume that I'm a "young widow" but I don't have anytime to become "idle" or a "gossipmonger" which we are warned to avoid. My kids are children, so they can't support me. I am supposed to get married, if I can't devote myself to the church and God...and yet, life isn't that simple.
this is why I can't just take someones elses word for the difficulty of a child over a spouse, because that "Christmas tree light" analogy is how my husband and I are, and I can't fathom loosing that, but then again, I couldn't fathom loosing a son, and here we are...I think for me, I don't see how one could be more difficult than another, just very different, not better or worse, just different. And btw, if we were close to each other, I would give you a huge hug, and thank you for being the wonderful person I have glimpsed you of being. Gave a total stranger a hug once, he was missing his mom....I wake up every day and think "crap, I have to face another day". I can go days without interacting with other adults beyond the grocery store line. I make every decision alone now. And I am seldom touched by anyone beyond my children...after having a healthy married life. No one adores me anymore (okay, my kids do but that is not the same). The analogy that I like to use is that our lives were like tangled Christmas tree lights...you can't tell where one ends and another begins. Every decision I ever made had him considered in it. I also lost my entire future...our retirement dreams are gone, instead I have to figure out who I am now that I'm alone. Grief has also change who I am...I will never look at the world the same way.
In our experience, those who have always loved us, understand that it still hurts, those who have always hated us, hate us even more...If you really want an idea of what our lives and troubles look like, find a few of these grief forums and read our stories. However, also recognize that these are very private places to us...places where we post what we have nobody else to tell. Interaction of anyone not is our shoes feels like an invasion and we lose our feeling of safety even though we know that these are public forums. So just read, don't join or respond.
I only know about widow/er grief. I imagine that loss of a child gets even less sympathy after a few months because you don't "look" so alone.
when he was younger, he fell out a second story window (long story, wanted to "kill" the kids for disobeying which put them in that situation, but again, that's a long story) anyway, he told me that when he went out the window, he felt God slowing him down, so he didn't hit the ground so hard. It was truely a miracle, he fell between some posts that were below the window, missing all of them, and only had a very minor scratch. I know God cared for him, and Loves Him and when I focus on our son, I rejoice for him that he is with our Lord. I even imagine him waiting for us, so he can show us every wonder he has uncovered. But then I get my eyes on me and my pain and my memories of abandonment and I worry that he felt like we weren't coming...that he died alone. It is irrational, from my standpoint, but my "feelings" none the less. Thanks for the kind words and reminder that he is safe and happy and will never know the pains of this world.This is not crazy at all. You are a mother who wants her baby to know that he is loved. That is beautiful. And please remember that your boy is now in the presence of Love Himself. I know that's not worth much when you miss your son, but it's worth a lot when you worry about him. I have gotten to know our God pretty well over the last 5 years, and I stake my soul that your son does not feel abandoned in any way.
very interesting...thanks againBlackribbon
This is so true. Our primary goal in western culture these days is to live as long as possible. Period. It doesn't matter how much we have to sacrifice, how many pills we have to ingest, or how many machines we need to be hooked up to. Our only goal is to keep our heart technically pumping for as long as medically possible.
People who die "before their time" are blasphemous to this religion of "health". And we who lose a loved one are unclean by association. We are a reminder to others about how little control they have over their own lives.
I never thought of health as being a religion, and yet as you speak, I see it clearly. Anything can become our god, but we don't often think of health as one of those gods...and the funny thing is my husband and I just talked about that today in relation to a friend, and we didn't think to label it what it is...thanks...great insightYou are right that it is different for widows than for women who have lost children (why don't we have a title?). It's impossible to compare griefs, but a widow faces many more practical changes in her life (marital status, income, etc.) But we are all anathema.
I experienced something strange in the first year of my son's death. Some missionaries from backwoods Bolivia came to speak at our church. They describe all the prenatal attention that the women there were now receiving, and how the number of infant deaths had decreased by 50%. But all I could think of is how much worse off that tribe is now. I certainly don't glorify death, but those women used to all have a shared grief. When one of them lost a child, she could be sure that every other woman she saw on a daily basis knew exactly how she felt. But now they have missionaries spreading the gospel of "health" instead of the Gospel of Life.
My heart breaks for the new underclass that has been established in the name of Jesus.
that is where a good church family is helpful, unfortunately those can be very hard to find.I don't know that one is worse..they are both unacceptable. The problem I have is that I have no one to lean on anymore...and the disappearing friends makes it even harder.. especially on my kids since my friends are the mothers of their friends. I also feel that there are people who think we must have angered God. As Christians, even if this was the case, I would hope that someone would wrap their arms of love around me and help bring me back and not turn their backs on me.
I don't think I was justifying anything, just trying to see it from her perspective...I find that if I can understand things from the other persons perspective, it is easier to be able to show them how they are wrong and how to combat it.As for the woman wanting the ashes...this can't be justified.
exactly, but if you understand the reason for the mother doing this, then it is easier to find a compromise in which both parties have something to comfort them. It is easy in loss to think that we are the only ones hurting, we often forget that others are suffering too. So, let's just play with this specific incident because we don't know all the details. Let's say that the mother was feeling totally left out of the grieving process, and her demand was at heart, a cry for comfort, for some kind of comfort for her loss. Then, we could go to her with something that was her sons, a token so to speak that would satisify her need for comfort and at the same time, leave the spouse with the comfort she needs.Frequently, our lives become grab bags for everyone to "claim" belongings...belongings that bring us comfort or are just plain needed for daily life. They also often assume that we got big insurance settlement which many don't get...and our family incomes go down tremendously. We become our "stuff" and not people.
but that is my point, I just always thought that those relationships were always suppose to be bad, I don't have much to base my understanding on here, cause the things you describe are a natural, daily part of my life and relationships...to me, what you describe is no different than things before our sons death, so I really struggle to understand how the accusations levied against us are like what you describe. What you describe is every day stuff to us, the other things, the things that are greed and such, that are directed at destroying us and our sons memory are the new things.I don't think that all of this is just extension of our "previous" life's relationships...because over and over, I see people being betrayed by the very ones they would have bet their lives on as their strongest support system right after the death. There are those relationships that never were good and those usually don't get any better.
amen....I survive because of my faith in God.
Can you provide any support for this claim some study, or something for us to review as we continue our adventure into the counseling side of thing? Thanks
wise words, what I have learned is that listening is the most valuable tool a counselor has, that and real, biblical Love, but the really funny thing, is that listening is part of that real Love.I have never been a counselor (in an official capacity), but here is my take on the grief counseling I have received.
My very favorite pastor ran a grief counseling group which I joined after my son died. I don't think he had much experience with the structure of group counseling, but he was a wonderful listener. And I always had the impression that whatever I said, he had already spent ten years on a mountain top somewhere contemplating that very issue. He had a supernatural amount of grace when listening weekly to a roomful of christians who were angry with God.
But about three months in, he left to sprout a new church and a psychologist (a christian, but not a pastor) replaced him. The vibe of the group changed from being a bunch of grieving people encouraging each other to a "class" on the "five stages of grief" (the Kubler-Ross method which originated as a description of the psychological stages that someone with terminal illness goes through - and frankly, unhelpful to someone who just wants their baby back).
it's funny that you talk so much about Job, I have been equated to Job more times than I want to count, something I am very uncomfortable with since I know how much more I could loose. But, that is off topic. Job is a wonderful picture of what works and doesn't work in counseling....So, from my experience, I would look for these traits in a counselor:
1) The ability to shut up and listen instead of "teach". This is one of the major themes in the book of Job. Job's friends were doing a great job until they started talking.But it's a lot harder to do than it sounds.
2) The ability to be "unshockable". The last thing a grieving person needs to hear is how blasphemous they are. When someone that you have poured your heart into is suddenly gone, the bs cliches that you used to rely on no longer apply. This idea can also be found in Job. When Job started making demands of God, his friends decided that he wasn't being theologically correct, so they tried to set him straight. God was not pleased.
God is more than capable of handling our rage. If a woman has recently lost her husband and can't talk to God without cussing, I would say, "Cuss away". Is dropping the f-bomb in the middle of a perfectly respectable prayer "ideal"? Probably not. But Dad does not turn us away when we come to Him honestly - even if we are honestly [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse]ed. It is through His kindness that we receive grace, not by our "correctness".
3) And lastly, if my situation were more complicated than it was (like if I needed marriage counseling, or counseling for an addiction or something), I would look for a counselor who was highly trained.
I believe that anyone who is an official-type counselor should have more than a half-semester class in seminary or a 6-month online certification. This is not to say that I would never let anyone without a PhD offer me advice, but if I am going to give another human being the kind of regular access to my mind that an official-type counselor would have, they better know more than me on the subject.
actually, we are in deep study of Biblical Love, the counseling is a extra "bonus" as to how Love applies to the struggles of our lives. It is that Love that has brought us the healing we have known and it is Love that continues to bring us healing. But that is another topic I could talk about all day long.So if you and your husband are very serious about offering official-type counseling (as opposed to just being friends to the hurting), please consider some extensive schooling or a mentorship to prepare you. Of course, there is a lot of research that you can do on the topic of mental health before you make that commitment - just make friends with a librarian.
the same could be said for loosing a child, they consume your life 24/7 but on top of that, you are responsible for them 100%, not a shared responsibility. I guess my point is that I do get that better than you think. But there evil people in my life, need Christ, there are also grieving people in my life who simply need to know that I recognize their need to grieve as well. For example, my brother and sister in law lost their son about 6 years ago. When our son died, their nephew, the grief consumed them, because it brought up not only the grief over our sons death, but the painful reminders of their own loss and pain. Recognizing that pain put an end to a lot of nasty stuff. And honestly, recognizing that others loved our son enough to grieve is part of our healing process, so I guess I don't see those types of "evil" as harmful, because of the healing nature they have hidden deep within. Maybe it's because I have know so much pain in my life, that I see it that way, I don't know...maybe it is because of the Love study that we are doing, a study that is changing our perspective. I'm not sure why I see it that way, but I do, and I appreciate you taking the time to try to show me another perspective.To razzelflabben - The evil people in your life are trying to get attention because they have a big hole in their soul and don't know the loving God of Christianity. They need to be "better" than everyone else so that they can deserve their place in Heaven. They hurt and are trying to fill a need in their life...in that way, it exactly like the mother who left a demand note on the new widow's doorstep for her son's ashes...she wasn't wanting help but rather to have the attention brought to her...she could have found grief support in the arms of the man's widow but she wanted to be more important than his bride. Would her grief have been less if she had that box full of ashes? The widow would have even given her some...but the mother didn't ask for that. Most widows are willing to acknowledge other people's grief because is a symbol of how loved our spouses were. However, we don't have the energy to get in a competition for who is hurting the most. This was our spouse who was part of our life 24/7...good or bad. As much as a mother loves her adult child, they don't occupy their thoughts all day long. They lost something precious but they didn't lose their whole life.
this I do understand.Grief does not give people permission to hurt others. A more tangible example was a young woman and her husband rented the home next door and from his parents. While she was at the funeral home planning his funeral, the in-laws used their key and took whatever they wanted from her home. They also evicted her. Although it is irrational, we are often blamed for the deaths of our husband because people want someone to blame. The same parents also tried to get "their share" of his life insurance...and no, they didn't own them any money.
again, I get this, on all levels. We have family that steal the food from our childrens mouths (literally), not caring if they eat or not, and these people are worth somewhere close to a million dollars. I get the pain of it, that isn't the thing I am struggling to understand.People act badly because they are selfish and self-centered. More than one woman stuck in a bad marriage has called us "lucky". More than one person has shown up on our doorstep wanting a loan from the money that we need to live and raise our children. Yes, a greedy grab while grieving is no different than a greedy grab for attention. And it has tangible pain to go with emotional hurt.
If you can't see that your evil isn't just as bad as evil from those who are supposed to love us, then I will just have to let this go.
1. God called, equipped and gifted the person to counsel and 2. they have been down that road, and know what pain really is.
It is that Love that has brought us the healing we have known and it is Love that continues to bring us healing. But that is another topic I could talk about all day long.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?