Anti-Feminist

[mandyangel]

Any other Christians anti-feminists like me? Do you think you can be christian and a feminist at the same time even though that would go contrary to the scriptures about it. Or do you believe that those scriptures don't matter?

 

[PetLuv]

I think it all depends on how you define feminist.

I don't think I am less just because I am a woman, but I do think there is a point of division among men and women. (Jobs in the military being one)

 

[jehoiakim]

I don't like the term feminist because it implies if you don't support their agenda you are against women. I though I sympathize with where you are coming from I don't like the term anti-feminist for the same reason. Complementarian is a term I think works much better, but not everyone knows what that means

 

[Caesars Ghost]

I agree with Complimentarian as a term that best fits my point of view.

I wouldn't say I'm anti-feminist however, because I think those that participate in that ideology have very sound reasons for doing so. As the Bible denotes in scriptures women are suppose to accept a lesser status to that of men.

And as such I think feminist women are seeking to overthrow subservient roles that have been meted out for them according to a secular ideology that emulates that Biblical role without making it seem as if it has religious undertones in so much as it's implied it's because women are the weaker sex.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Any other Christians anti-feminists like me? Do you think you can be christian and a feminist at the same time even though that would go contrary to the scriptures about it. Or do you believe that those scriptures don't matter?

On the contrary I'm a Christian and a feminist/egalitarian because of what Scripture says. Chauvinism and misogyny are unbiblical. If you think men are better than women, then you're wrong. It's that simple. End of debate.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[mandyangel]

On the contrary I'm a Christian and a feminist/egalitarian because of what Scripture says. Chauvinism and misogyny are unbiblical. If you think men are better than women, then you're wrong. It's that simple. End of debate.

-CryptoLutheran

But what about these scriptures? AND Don't tell me that they don't mean what they say or can be "interpreted" to find some other meaning. The Bible means exactly what it says.


For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man. Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man. --- I Corinthians 11:8-9

But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. --- I Timothy 2:12

Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. --- I Corinthians 14:34

 

[wannabeadesigirl]

Depends on your definition of Feminism. Are you talking about the women who are anti-men, "Men are the cause of all our problems", "if you're a stay at home mom you might as well under go FGM" type feminist, or are you talking about women who are outspoken about things that, if they go unchanged, will mean a worse world for the rest of us?

For example rape apology: She was wearing a short skirt. She was out at a bar alone. She was walking down the street alone at night. Her heels were too loud under her burka. She was dancing provocatively. She came up to my apartment for coffee. She's my wife. She's had a head ache for 3 weeks... Ad Nauseum.

There is NO reason for a man to touch a woman without her permission, and this is not something new that has occurred with the feminist movement either. Rape has been a thing for a very long time, and it wasn't until the feminist movement that women began to be told it is not okay for a man to have sex with you unless you tell him he can. Feminists have helped wake guys up to something of an epidemic concerning sexual assault, and it was the feminist movement that helped place anti harassment policies into the work place.

You can't throw the baby out with the bathwater either: Women can vote because of early feminists.

 

[Audacious]

http://www.christianthinktank.com/fempush.html

Have fun, OP; I'm pretty sure your entire 'anti-feminist' view will be changed by reading this. I like the person running A Christian Thinktank because he's very reasonable and cites a lot of sources.

RE: "The Bible means exactly what it says" - sure it does, but it doesn't mean what you think it says. We're talking about a book written, depending on the text, anywhere from 3500-2000 years ago and meant to be read by Jewish people in the scripture's contemporary context - what you think it says based on a 21st century Christian background could easily be very different from what it's actually saying.

Also, "the bible means exactly what it says" is a thought-terminating cliche; it's not an argument. You can't back up anything with that. If you're curious as to what that is, feel free to click here. (Scroll down to 'thought-terminating cliche'.).

James

Edit: It may also behoove you to read Wikipedia's brief list of logical fallacies.

 

[Radagast]

Any other Christians anti-feminists like me? Do you think you can be christian and a feminist at the same time even though that would go contrary to the scriptures about it. Or do you believe that those scriptures don't matter?

Many Christians take the point of view that these people have: http://cbmw.org/

That includes some people on CF.

 

[Caesars Ghost]

There's a glitch in the URL to the thought-terminating cliche link. There's a error in the URL.

So here is the direct Wiki link.
Thought Reform and the Psychology of Totalism

 

[mandyangel]

http://www.christianthinktank.com/fempush.html

Have fun, OP; I'm pretty sure your entire 'anti-feminist' view will be changed by reading this. I like the person running A Christian Thinktank because he's very reasonable and cites a lot of sources.

RE: "The Bible means exactly what it says" - sure it does, but it doesn't mean what you think it says. We're talking about a book written, depending on the text, anywhere from 3500-2000 years ago and meant to be read by Jewish people in the scripture's contemporary context - what you think it says based on a 21st century Christian background could easily be very different from what it's actually saying.

Also, "the bible means exactly what it says" is a thought-terminating cliche; it's not an argument. You can't back up anything with that. If you're curious as to what that is, feel free to click here. (Scroll down to 'thought-terminating cliche'.).

James

Edit: It may also behoove you to read Wikipedia's brief list of logical fallacies.

No thanks. I think I'll let God have the last word on this, not wikipedia

 

[Audacious]

No thanks. I think I'll let God have the last word on this, not wikipedia

My first link was actually relevant God's word on that. Also, that's another thought-terminating cliche.

I'd definitely read that list of logical fallacies if I were you. o.o

James

 

[emily_elizabeth]

I'm anti-feminists who think feminism means men are scum and housewives are stupid and need to get lives. Do I think women should be treated with respect, be able to vote, be paid as much as a man with the same qualifications? Absolutely. But when it gets to the point where all you do is scream at men, whine about how oppressed you, and shame women who want to be mothers and housewives (and I've seen many feminists do that), it's ridiculous and wrong.

 

[Corey201]

All scripture matters!

Feminism is contrary to Christianity.

 

[mandyangel]

All scripture matters!

Feminism is contrary to Christianity.

COMPLETELY AGREE!

I'm anti-feminists who think feminism means men are scum and housewives are stupid and need to get lives. Do I think women should be treated with respect, be able to vote, be paid as much as a man with the same qualifications? Absolutely. But when it gets to the point where all you do is scream at men, whine about how oppressed you, and shame women who want to be mothers and housewives (and I've seen many feminists do that), it's ridiculous and wrong.

You make a good point, that has been MY experience with feminists, not saying they are all like that but the ones I've met are and thats one reason why I think its stupid.

 

[ViaCrucis]

But what about these scriptures? AND Don't tell me that they don't mean what they say or can be "interpreted" to find some other meaning. The Bible means exactly what it says.


For the man is not of the woman; but the woman of the man. Neither was the man created for the woman; but the woman for the man. --- I Corinthians 11:8-9

But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. --- I Timothy 2:12

Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience, as also saith the law. --- I Corinthians 14:34

Context is helpful. But if you are unwilling to talk context and exegesis when discussing Scripture then further dialogue is probably fruitless.

But here's a thought for you: Why would St. Paul in 1 Corinthians 11 discuss women prophesying in church if he expects women to be absolutely tight-lipped in 1 Corinthians 14.

Either Paul is contradicting himself, or the answer to the question requires that we honestly look to what he means in either or both instances. However it makes little sense to tell women to shut up in one breath, and in another discuss them as speakers, workers, and actively dynamic in the goings-ons of Church life. This is the same Paul who mentions a female apostle, a female deacon, and who consistently speaks of women as equals. Going so far as to instruct husbands to show mutual and reciprocal respect and submission to them (read through Ephesians 5:21-33).

For every proof text you can offer telling me why your gender is inferior to mine, I can offer one that points out that we are equals in nature, dignity, and capacity.

Also, don't you find it a little strange to use a passage you claim says that women cannot teach men, and then attempt to use it to teach me this lesson? My guess is that not even you truly believe that women are to be mild mannered, do-nothing, say-nothing doorposts without opinion and insight. I hope that's the case, because you are created in God's image, you are a human being full of value and worth; and your opinions and thoughts on faith and life matter. You have a voice in the Church, and you have the freedom and right in Christ to have that voice for and in His Church.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[wannabeadesigirl]

Since we're using the Bible here let's do a comparison: Dear mandyangel, what exactly does God say (in the Bible) about a womans place in Christianity and in the Christian household? Please give me the verses you're referring to and we'll go from there.

 

[Cuddles333]

I think that what the Feminism Movement did for women is kind of like what the Labor Union did for the Blue Collar worker in the U.S.A.

If we were to abide in the culture of the New Testament we wouldn't be allowed to initiate a divorce, own property, testify in court, or even get an education.

 

[SilenceInMotion]

On the contrary I'm a Christian and a feminist/egalitarian because of what Scripture says. Chauvinism and misogyny are unbiblical. If you think men are better than women, then you're wrong. It's that simple. End of debate.

I don't think men are better then women, and so women should stop demanding to be treated better then men.

Women get more leeway in just about all social endeavors, whether it be sentencing at court, custody cases, a loosed construct of accountability, a higher freedom of expression, a less demanding production of labor, and so on.

There is a huge bias which blankets all society and feminists want to talk about how men get paid more?
Well, gee, that's a perk of being a man, about the only perk there is socially speaking. Feminism is unwarranted and a false moral palette. If you look in the Bible, about half of what feminists project is contrary to it.

 

[wannabeadesigirl]

I don't think men are better then women, and so women should stop demanding to be treated better then men.

Women get more leeway in just about all social endeavors, whether it be sentencing at court, custody cases, a loosed construct of accountability, a higher freedom of expression, a less demanding production of labor, and so on.

There is a huge bias which blankets all society and feminists want to talk about how men get paid more?
Well, gee, that's a perk of being a man, about the only perk there is socially speaking. Feminism is unwarranted and a false moral palette. If you look in the Bible, about half of what feminists project is contrary to it.

Quite a few of the neo-feminists, that is young women (and young men even) whose mothers saw the womens lib movement of the 60's have much of the same idea you have. If we are going to be truly equal then we need equality for both genders across the board. So a woman CEO ought to be paid the same as male CEO's in her career type, and a man ought to be allowed the same amount of custody and priveleges in a divorce as his wife does.

So many of the laws we have concerning custody and child support etc come from archaic societal norms which said that a woman who was divorced needed to be supported because she couldn't get a job outside of the home. Those times have changed, and so should the rules.