Another prayer request please! and Help needed on Abortion issue

[christiangirrl]

I've just totally realized today in school how hard it is to be a Catholic especially in high school. I have a good amount of friends who believe (some who go to my youth group, from work, school) but there are many who dont believe in God or in Jesus. My friend who I've been close with for a long time has recently told me that she is not sure if she believes in Jesus or not. Ever since her grandpa died her attitude towards church has been bad and I hope she finds her way back to the church.
But anyway, I really need the strength to stand up for our faith and I'm just beginning to realize that this journey through life is not going to be an easy one.


ALSO..i need advice on how to explain this is to a girl in my school and one of my Jewish friends. They claim that abortion is NOT killing because the baby doesnt "feel" the pain. Emily, the girl from my school, says also that the baby is not completely formed yet so then you are not really killing anything. I of course completely disagreed with her. I told her that I believe that abortion is killing and should be banished. She said that I am saying only what my church teaches and to quote her "There is something called a seperation of church and state". Emily is half-Jewish and half-Christian but I dont think she practices either one so she is not at all for the Catholic Church. She also believes that women have the right to choose and that no man (im guessing she meant the president) can take that right away. Please I need help to defend myself and this issue. If you can give any advice I'd be forever grateful! Thanks so much for giving your time to read my post and to help. God Bless!
Kim

 

[geocajun]

Kim,

Ask your friends, if they feel taking the life of mentally retarded people who are not aware of pain is OK.
Or if killing those who are heavily dosed with pain killers is OK.
Ask them where they got the idea that the ability to feel pain is when life begins?

 

[Spence06]

They claim that abortion is NOT killing because the baby doesnt "feel" the pain.

If you kill a person with a spinal injury that can't "feel" pain, does that mean its okay?

http://www.religioustolerance.org/abo_pain.htm

Full article; and basically a child in the womb can feel pain, but there are no defined answers amoung the experts. So your friend is on thin and unscientific ice when she says that sort of stuff.

Emily, the girl from my school, says also that the baby is not completely formed yet so then you are not really killing anything

http://www.abortiontv.com/BabysLifeBeforeBirth.htm

And that argument is weak. Because just because the child in the womb is less developed then someone else, does not mean that its okay to kill the child.

A infant is less development then an adult, should we kill the infant soley on that? of coarse not.

"There is something called a seperation of church and state".

http://www.godlessprolifers.org/home.html

Just send them there, they'll see its not a religious issue but a science issue.

 

[Lifesaver]

The embryo is a living individual from the moment of conception.
It has the DNA neither of the father or the mother; it is therefore a distinct individual.
It is living, that is, it is never dead matter. On the contrary, it gathers nourishment, multiplies cells, etc.

So it is a living individual. If there is still doubt concerning this individual's species, any scientist can clear that up: Homo sapiens sapiens; the same species we are.

Therefore, it is a living human; and we didn't even bring souls or God to the discussion (which most non-Catholics would consider a sinful thing to do, for it greatly insults them and invades their rights to do so...).

 

[Spence06]

I know its a habit guys, but make sure yuo never call the child, "it". Pro-choicers will hear that and attack you on it. They will seek anything they can find.

Make sure you never call the unborn baby, "it." ITs a habit, you just have to break it, I use to do it without thinking.

 

[geocajun]

I know its a habit guys, but make sure yuo never call the child, "it". Pro-choicers will hear that and attack you on it. They will seek anything they can find.

Make sure you never call the unborn baby, "it." ITs a habit, you just have to break it, I use to do it without thinking.

Spence, I think you, like the pro-abortionists are reading too deeply into the term "it".
If I was to say "The human body is magnificant in design, it is amazing." I would not be violating any rule by referring to the body as "it", nor was lifesaver by referring to the embryo as 'it'.
If we are referring to the person of the embryo, then it would be wrong to call the child 'it', however when referring to it's nature, it is OK.

 

[AdJesumPerMariam]

Babies have all their chromosomes from the moment of conception. They have everything they will ever need at that time. As they form, there is a heartbeat at 21 days....rarely do you even know you are pregnant at that point. Somewhere around the 3rd wk...and again you may not even know you are pregnant...there is brain & spinal cord formation. As far as feeling, I believe they do feel. The normal abortion happens around the 6-8 wk time period, at that point, At 7.5 weeks: the eyes move forward on the face and eyelids begin to form, the palate is nearing completion and the tongue begins to form, gastrointestinal tract separates from the genitourinary tract. All essential organs have begun to form.

As far as abortion being legal, We have a law against murder. When abortion is done, you are murdering a life. When a woman becomes pregnant & she wants the child, then loses the child, she believes she has lost a life.

 

[Spence06]

Yea I have just seen many good honest people in debates be thrown on their heals and the pro-choicers just trying to uproot their whole position because the word "it" was used. Its just something they love to use.

They need these loopholes because they have no firm scientific evidence to rest on, they need something else cause they got nothing.

In my mind, "it" is not a big deal. But ever since I have been publically speaking out against abortion, they will find everything wrong with you say.

 

[Ann M]

Do you know if they are pro-euthanasia as well?

Isn't it ironical that science is working hard to try to find cures so that we can live longer and they are working just as hard to terminate the lives of those whom this research could eventually help?

One documentary I have watched that has stood out, has been about the 'research' done by the Nazi regime early last century. Essentially they rounded up all the disabled - physical, mental etc, and placed them into 'hospitals'. They were then used as human guinea pigs for all sorts of horrific experiments. One that stands out were the people (children?) who were placed into freezing cold water and then into hot water and virtually boiled alive. These people were delivered home to their families in coffins afterwards, with no-one knowing what had happened to their children. It was only recently, I believe, that we even learnt that many of these people had had their spines and brains removed after death to be stoerd and used for further research.

Here-in lies the problem of defining life. A child/person who lives on life-support, in a coma, is considered by many to be expendable. However to the family of that person, he/she may be the most precious and loved member of that family.

An aborted baby may be to the would-be parent, an unwanted problem, yet to a couple who are childless and who cannot be helped by science, it may have been the only chance they had to raise they family they desired.

In 2002, there were 987 families on the waiting list in Queensland, and 49 children available for adoption. The Qld Goverment closed the list for the last 2 years, and have recently reopened it - for a period of 8 weeks only. There are over 800 couples on the mailing list waiting for information on how to submit an 'expression of interest' towards adopting a child. In the same time there were many children aborted. If only we could be made to see that these lives are special and wanted, and nt look at these new lives and an inconvenience or encumberance.

 

[ZooMom]

Praying for you and your friends, Kim. My advice is...don't 'debate' with these girls unless you have plenty of time and patience to sit down and do it right. You are not going to convince them of anything in the five minute break between classes and your arguements will end up coming out disjointed. Don't try to talk to them all at the same time either. Go one-on-one, in a place where neither of you feel pressured. This is a very difficult topic. You will find that most people will get almost violently (not physically, but verbally)defensive when they realize that their position is untenable. Anyone who has ever made a reversal from pro-choice to pro-life has had to wrestle with angels and swallow a great big lump of pride. It's not easy. I've been there.

Anyway, praying for you all.


Peace be with you!

Sandy

 

[wellab]

I think there is a lot of good advice here for you Kim.


Whenever some young woman comes up to you and asks about your opinion about abortion, never ever hesitate to state that you believe it is murdering a child.

A friend of mine told me several years back that she was pregnant and thinking of getting an abortion. I know she knew my feelings on the subject but she just had to call me and tell me what she was going to do. Because I was 1000 miles away, and because I had little influence in her life at the time (we had gone our separate ways months before after a huge disagreement on something else) I really didn't know what else to do. Back then neither of us were practicing our religion. She still isn't as far as I know. Her family never raised her in the proper Catholic tradition. I however came back to the Church 5 years ago and regret even now for not trying harder to stop her from having that abortion. Short of flying to Denver and convincing her to her face, I really don't know that I could have stopped her. I could only verbally try to convince her that abortion is murder.

Even when I was not practicing my Catholic religious faith, I was always Pro Life. I left the Church because I did some things I thought I couldn't be forgiven of. How wrong I was? I didn't understand the forgiveness that God always gives if we ask. I was afraid of confession, really afraid of it. Now I am not. So it took me half my life to be re-educated in Church teachings and also do a little emotional maturing before I could readily accept it all.

If only we could all be patient with our Pro Choice friends and try every day to convince them, one by one, to understand the error of their beliefs.

 

[kellyb32]

I've just totally realized today in school how hard it is to be a Catholic especially in high school. I have a good amount of friends who believe (some who go to my youth group, from work, school) but there are many who dont believe in God or in Jesus. My friend who I've been close with for a long time has recently told me that she is not sure if she believes in Jesus or not. Ever since her grandpa died her attitude towards church has been bad and I hope she finds her way back to the church.
But anyway, I really need the strength to stand up for our faith and I'm just beginning to realize that this journey through life is not going to be an easy one.


ALSO..i need advice on how to explain this is to a girl in my school and one of my Jewish friends. They claim that abortion is NOT killing because the baby doesnt "feel" the pain. Emily, the girl from my school, says also that the baby is not completely formed yet so then you are not really killing anything. I of course completely disagreed with her. I told her that I believe that abortion is killing and should be banished. She said that I am saying only what my church teaches and to quote her "There is something called a seperation of church and state". Emily is half-Jewish and half-Christian but I dont think she practices either one so she is not at all for the Catholic Church. She also believes that women have the right to choose and that no man (im guessing she meant the president) can take that right away. Please I need help to defend myself and this issue. If you can give any advice I'd be forever grateful! Thanks so much for giving your time to read my post and to help. God Bless!
Kim

Hi Kim.

I am a mom of 3 kids. My first pregnancy was when I was 21 (I got married at the age of 19) and I used to be pro-choice as well because I thought up until 3 months gestation the baby was what pro-abortionists say was just a piece of flesh that can have no way of surviving outside the womb or feeling emotions or pain.

I ended up in the hospital at 26 weeks pregnant being 5 cm dilated and in labor. They were able to stop my labor but the baby was so small and right there ready to come out that I was placed practically upside down in my hospital bed without being able to get up to even use the bathroom or wash up properly. I couldn't sit up to eat, nothing.......all so I could keep my baby inside a while longer so she had a better chance of survival without any problems.

I had many sonograms while in the hospital because they wanted to keep close tabs on my daughter. I managed to stay 3 weeks in that position and had all that time to really think things through before my little one made her appearance at a full 3 pounds 10 ounces. She was one of the larger premies in the NICU. Some of the babies were born at 26 weeks and you could hardly see them under the mass of tubes and wires attached to their bodies.

Women have abortions at that point in their pregnancies. I got sick thinking about it.

Today she is a beautiful and healthy 10 year old.

Flash forward 7 years from my stay in the hospital.....We finally got pregnant again after years of trying. Because of what happened to me with my first pregnancy I had to have surgery to stitch my cervix closed. At 11 weeks pregnant I had to have a sonogram to make sure the baby was viable, that is there was no evidence of problems that may end the pregnancy in miscarriage.

I saw my second daughter for the first time, her little hands, her legs and feet, she was active and moving even though I didn't feel a thing. I saw her heart beating strong. I wept because the surgery carries the risk of miscarriage. I prayed for the safety of my child. And now she is a beautiful, healthy 3 year old.

Content that we had more than one child, never thinking it would happen again especially after experiencing some female problems last year around April and May of '03, I missed my cycle. I took 4 pregnancy tests, for 4 consecutive weeks with all negative results. June 18, 2003 I was upset and decided to take one more, if it was negative I was going to call the doctor in the morning.

It was positive.

My husband and I were shocked. I called the doctor and had a blood test done. I was only about 4 weeks pregnant according to the bloodwork.

My doctor told me at that point women don't usually know they are pregnant. She wanted to wait a couple of weeks and then send me for a sonogram because if this was a viable pregnancy they could usually tell early on if a miscarriage is possible.

I had to have an internal sonogram done because the regular one didn't detect my baby. The internal one was successful.

I was 7 weeks and 2 days pregnant according to the measurements of the baby. The screen showed a tiny little peanut with little arm and leg buds forming, you can see the baby's hands starting to take shape and the heart was beating strong. The tech turned up the volume and I listened to my son's heart beat for the first time at less than 2 months pregnant.

Even amdist the joy, what a heavy feeling came over me. I told the technician that I can't imagine women aborting their children at all, even this early on.

She told me that she has to date pregnancies for women who are considering abortions. She has to tell them not to look at the screen if they are serious about getting the proceedure done. I couldn't do her job I said. I would lose my job because I'd be pointing out the baby's features to the mom in the hopes of changing her mind to save her child.

There was an article in August about a woman who aborted her 4th child at 12 weeks gestation. She went home from the proceedure and delivered the aborted baby's head in the toilet that night. She felt something slip out of her like she had given birth, looked in the toilet to see this lump that appeared to have a bone in it and realized she was looking at her baby's face.

The article can be found by searching "aborted baby's head left inside woman". BE WARNED there is a picture that could be VERY DISTURBING to you.

My friend says this to those who claim the baby isn't a baby when it's so little it can't live outside the mother's body so it's okay to terminate the pregnancy, she says: It would if you left it alone!

People desensitize the issue by using terms that water down the situation.

Baby is called fetus
Mother is called woman
Pregnancy is called problem

They detach any sense of sacredness to being with child by de-humanizing the parties involved and taking away any emotion that is attached to the pregnancy.

But that's just my experience and opinion.