Another look at Lewontin

It seems as if the same topics get rehashed over and over again, so I figured I'd join the club and repost this revealing quote by Richard Lewontin (emphasis mine).

‘We take the side of science in spite of the patent absurdity of some of its constructs, in spite of its failure to fulfill many of its extravagant promises of health and life, in spite of the tolerance of the scientific community for unsubstantiated just-so stories, because we have a prior commitment, a commitment to materialism. It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world, but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations, no matter how counter-intuitive, no matter how mystifying to the uninitiated. Moreover, that materialism is an absolute, for we cannot allow a Divine Foot in the door.’

Richard Lewontin, ‘Billions and billions of demons’, The New York Review, January 9, 1997.

To those who would argue he's just saying that if it entertains the possibility of the supernatural, it can't be science:

"It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world"

So that can't be what he's saying. What he's saying is quite clear. "It doesn't matter if something doesn't really have a material explanation or how absurd or wrong our explanations may be, the point is to make sure we do not allow a divine foot in the door."
 

MSBS

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Well npetreley, it's not quite so clear as you make out.  First off this quote is from The New York Review of Books not The New York Review (two very different publications), and it is a book review of Carl Sagan's book The Demon-Haunted World: Science as a Candle in the Dark.  I guess the creationist site you copped this from thought it would have more impact if people didn't know it was a book review.  It was pretty hard to find the original article, what with every anti-science creationist website in on the feeding frenzy and the incorrect citation that most of them were using, but I did manage :D .  The article is here.  If you read this in it's context, the meaning is different than you make out.

Third, it is said that there is no place for an argument from authority in science. The community of science is constantly self-critical, as evidenced by the experience of university colloquia "in which the speaker has hardly gotten 30 seconds into the talk before there are devastating questions and comments from the audience." If Sagan really wants to hear serious disputation about the nature of the universe, he should leave the academic precincts in Ithaca and spend a few minutes in an Orthodox study house in Brooklyn. It is certainly true that within each narrowly defined scientific field there is a constant challenge to new technical claims and to old wisdom. In what my wife calls the Gunfight at the O.K. Corral Syndrome, young scientists on the make will challenge a graybeard, and this adversarial atmosphere for the most part serves the truth. But when scientists transgress the bounds of their own specialty they have no choice but to accept the claims of authority, even though they do not know how solid the grounds of those claims may be. Who am I to believe about quantum physics if not Steven Weinberg, or about the solar system if not Carl Sagan? What worries me is that they may believe what Dawkins and Wilson tell them about evolution.

With great perception, Sagan sees that there is an impediment to the popular credibility of scientific claims about the world, an impediment that is almost invisible to most scientists. Many of the most fundamental claims of science are against common sense and seem absurd on their face. Do physicists really expect me to accept without serious qualms that the pungent cheese that I had for lunch is really made up of tiny, tasteless, odorless, colorless packets of energy with nothing but empty space between them? Astronomers tell us without apparent embarrassment that they can see stellar events that occurred millions of years ago, whereas we all know that we see things as they happen. When, at the time of the moon landing, a woman in rural Texas was interviewed about the event, she very sensibly refused to believe that the television pictures she had seen had come all the way from the moon, on the grounds that with her antenna she couldn't even get Dallas. What seems absurd depends on one's prejudice. Carl Sagan accepts, as I do, the duality of light, which is at the same time wave and particle, but he thinks that the consubstantiality of Father, Son, and Holy Ghost puts the mystery of the Holy Trinity "in deep trouble." Two's company, but three's a crowd.

Our willingness to accept scientific claims that are against common sense is the key to an understanding of the real struggle between science and the supernatural. We take the side of science in spite of the patent absurdity of some of its constructs, in spite of its failure to fulfill many of its extravagant promises of health and life, in spite of the tolerance of the scientific community for unsubstantiated just-so stories, because we have a prior commitment, a commitment to materialism. It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world, but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations, no matter how counter-intuitive, no matter how mystifying to the uninitiated. Moreover, that materialism is absolute, for we cannot allow a Divine Foot in the door. The eminent Kant scholar Lewis Beck used to say that anyone who could believe in God could believe in anything. To appeal to an omnipotent deity is to allow that at any moment the regularities of nature may be ruptured, that miracles may happen.

The mutual exclusion of the material and the demonic has not been true of all cultures and all times. In the great Chinese epic Journey to the West, demons are an alternative form of life, responsible to certain deities, devoted to making trouble for ordinary people, but severely limited. They can be captured, imprisoned, and even killed by someone with superior magic.6 In our own intellectual history, the definitive displacement of divine powers by purely material causes has been a relatively recent changeover, and that icon of modern science, Newton, was at the cusp. It is a cliché of intellectual history that Newton attempted to accommodate God by postulating Him as the Prime Mover Who, having established the mechanical laws and set the whole universe in motion, withdrew from further intervention, leaving it to people like Newton to reveal His plan. But what we might call "Newton's Ploy" did not really get him off the hook. He understood that a defect of his system of mechanics was the lack of any equilibrating force that would return the solar system to its regular set of orbits if there were any slight perturbation. He was therefore forced, although reluctantly, to assume that God intervened from time to time to set things right again. It remained for Laplace, a century later, to produce a mechanics that predicted the stability of the planetary orbits, allowing him the hauteur of his famous reply to Napoleon. When the Emperor observed that there was, in the whole of the Mécanique Céleste, no mention of the author of the universe, he replied, "Sire, I have no need of that hypothesis." One can almost hear a stress on the "I."

Richard Lewontin, ‘Billions and Billions of Demons’, The New York Review of Books, January 9, 1997.

In context the words "patent absurdity" and "extravagant promises" certainly read differently, and we see that this was not about being anti-God but about science being naturalistic and not using supernatural explanations.

this is made clear in an earlier passage in the review:

Sagan believes that scientists reject sprites, fairies, and the influence of Sagittarius because we follow a set of procedures, the Scientific Method, which has consistently produced explanations that put us in contact with reality and in which mystic forces play no part. For Sagan, the method is the message, but I think he has opened the wrong envelope.

edited to add the last quote and fix the link.
 
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Originally posted by MSBS
Well npetreley, it's not quite so clear as you make out.  First off this quote is from The New York Review of Books not The New York Review (two very different publications),

I apologize for letting that one slip by. Whatever the reason was behind the error for the site where I copied it from, I knew it was the New York Review of Books and listed it that way the last time I posted that quote.

But the context does nothing to save the quote.

Originally posted by MSBS
In context the words "patent absurdity" and "extravagant promises" certainly read differently, and we see that this was not about being anti-God but about science being naturalistic and not using supernatural explanations.

this is made clear in an earlier passage in the review:

Actually, the earlier passage contradicts your assertion. He says, "For Sagan, the method is the message, but I think he has opened the wrong envelope."

Which brings us back to this quote: "It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world, but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations..."

In other words, he's saying quite clearly that it isn't science or the scientific method that requires him to find material explanations for things, but an a-priori commitment to materialism that drives his definition of science. Materialism is the motivation and the message, not the method (scientific or otherwise).
 
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MSBS

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Originally posted by npetreley
He says, "For Sagan, the method is the message, but I think he has opened the wrong envelope."

Which brings us back to this quote: "It is not that the methods and institutions of science somehow compel us to accept a material explanation of the phenomenal world, but, on the contrary, that we are forced by our a priori adherence to material causes to create an apparatus of investigation and a set of concepts that produce material explanations..."

In other words, he's saying quite clearly that it isn't science or the scientific method that requires him to find material explanations for things, but an a-priori commitment to materialism that drives his definition of science. Materialism is the motivation and the message, not the method (scientific or otherwise).

Not at all, he is saying the the scientific method is materialistic, and as such scientists must have the "a-priori commitment to materialism" that he talks about.  Otherwise, you can discover nothing, do no experiments, and elucidate no laws, because if you are not materialistic in your studies of the world any little traipsing fairy or angry demon or your horoscope or the feng shui of your lab can effect your results, skew your data, and render all explanation meaningless.  This was the point the author was making in the book review, not, as you seem to think, that some evil scientists hate God. 
 
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Originally posted by MSBS
Not at all, he is saying the the scientific method is materialistic, and as such scientists must have the "a-priori commitment to materialism" that he talks about.  Otherwise, you can discover nothing, do no experiments, and elucidate no laws, because if you are not materialistic in your studies of the world any little traipsing fairy or angry demon or your horoscope or the feng shui of your lab can effect your results, skew your data, and render all explanation meaningless.  This was the point the author was making in the book review, not, as you seem to think, that some evil scientists hate God. 

That's what YOU are saying. That's not what he is saying, and I think that's extremely clear.
 
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Morat

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  In all fairness to Nick, he didn't set out to deliberatly misquote the piece.

   Nick just continues to use the same sources, even though it tends to make him look foolish when their deception is uncovered.

  Face it, Nick. You got snookered. Again. When are you going to get sick of being played like a fool and start checking out your sources yourself?

 
 
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