Animals into ark - contradiction

[zaire]

Someone is using this passage below to say that the Bible contradicts itself. They say God told moses to Moses to bring a pair of all animals and Moses did this. Then God told Moses to bring seven pairs of clean and a pair of unclean, Moses then did this. They say that this is contraction. What do yous think of this?

Gen6 19 You are to bring into the ark two of all living creatures, male and female, to keep them alive with you. 20 Two of every kind of bird, of every kind of animal and of every kind of creature that moves along the ground will come to you to be kept alive. 21 You are to take every kind of food that is to be eaten and store it away as food for you and for them."
22 Noah did everything just as God commanded him.
Gen7 1 The LORD then said to Noah, "Go into the ark, you and your whole family, because I have found you righteous in this generation. 2 Take with you seven of every kind of clean animal, a male and its mate, and two of every kind of unclean animal, a male and its mate, 3 and also seven of every kind of bird, male and female, to keep their various kinds alive throughout the earth. 4 Seven days from now I will send rain on the earth for forty days and forty nights, and I will wipe from the face of the earth every living creature I have made."
5 And Noah did all that the LORD commanded him.

 

[Gwynne]

Well, first off, I think Moses had nothing to do with the animals on the ark..... other than that I'll let those with more experience in the OT try to clarify that because I'd like to see the answer myself.

 

[Yahudim]

Gen 6:19 And of every living thing of all flesh, two of every sort shalt thou bring into the ark, to keep them alive with thee; they shall be male and female.

The crux of the argument stems from the number of animals, correct? If so, perhaps this will clarify. Strong's Hebrew and Greek Dictionaries yeilds this definition: H8147
shen-ah'-yim, shet-tah'-yim

(The first form being dual of H8145; the second form being feminine); two; also (as ordinal) twofold: - both, couple, double, second, twain, + twelfth, + twelve, + twenty (sixscore) thousand, twice, two.

Perhaps the word would have better been translated as pair(s) or couple(s). You know, as in mating pairs? This makes the subsequent verses a bit more understandable.

I hope this helps...

 

[JSynon]

Noah brought two of every kind of unclean animal and seven of every kind of clean animal onto the ark. The extra clean animals were for sacrificial worship after the flood had receded (Gen. 8:20).

 

[zaire]

Gen8 20 Then Noah built an altar to the LORD and, taking some of all the clean animals and clean birds, he sacrificed burnt offerings on it

Why does it say some?

 

[pimorton]

Gen8 20 Then Noah built an altar to the LORD and, taking some of all the clean animals and clean birds, he sacrificed burnt offerings on it

Why does it say some?

Because it was more than none. He would have also used some for food, since they were clean and after the flood permissible for food.

 

[G4m]

Because it was more than none. He would have also used some for food, since they were clean and after the flood permissible for food.

He would have also had to release some.

 

[Trench777]

He would have also used some for food, since they were clean and after the flood permissible for food.

This is something that has intrigued me...

"Clean" and therefore permissible to eat. I'm hip to the notion...however;

The Mosiac (Levitical?) Law dictating what was permissible and what was not, had not yet been delivered to man. I've no doubt God could/would have shown Noah which were clean and which were unclean, but I find it fascinating that this comes up so early in the Scriptures and not again until Moses (or does it get addressed again before Moses & is just slipping my mind?)

Just an interesting (to me at least, heh) note I thought I'd toss in.

God bless!!

T777

 

[Tavita]

This is something that has intrigued me...

"Clean" and therefore permissible to eat. I'm hip to the notion...however;

The Mosiac (Levitical?) Law dictating what was permissible and what was not, had not yet been delivered to man. I've no doubt God could/would have shown Noah which were clean and which were unclean, but I find it fascinating that this comes up so early in the Scriptures and not again until Moses (or does it get addressed again before Moses & is just slipping my mind?)

Just an interesting (to me at least, heh) note I thought I'd toss in.

God bless!!

T777

Which leads me to think certain parts of the Law given by Moses were around long before the Israelites were brought out of Egypt. Do you think maybe God made His Laws known from the beginning and over the 400 years the Israelites were in captivity and under heavy burden they had forgotten? So God had to remind them again in the giving of the Law at Sinai? I say only parts, as the priesthood and temple were instituted at Sinai. Does anyone else have any opinion?

(Gen 18:19) "For I have chosen him, so that he may command his children and his household after him to keep the way of the LORD by doing righteousness and justice, so that the LORD may bring upon Abraham what He has spoken about him."

 

[G4m]

Which leads me to think certain parts of the Law given by Moses were around long before the Israelites were brought out of Egypt. Do you think maybe God made His Laws known from the beginning and over the 400 years the Israelites were in captivity and under heavy burden they had forgotten? So God had to remind them again in the giving of the Law at Sinai? I say only parts, as the priesthood and temple were instituted at Sinai. Does anyone else have any opinion?

(Gen 18:19) "For I have chosen him, so that he may command his children and his household after him to keep the way of the LORD by doing righteousness and justice, so that the LORD may bring upon Abraham what He has spoken about him."

Hi Tavita!

I hope this answers your question:

Galatians 3
17 And this I say, that the covenant, that was confirmed before of God in Christ, the law, which was four hundred and thirty years after, cannot disannul, that it should make the promise of none effect.

 

[Tavita]

Hi G4!

Yes, you're right, the Mosaic Law was brought in 430 years later, but why did God bring 'clean and unclean' animals into the ark, which we know of as a Levitical Law? To make clean sacrifice yes.. how did they know how to make clean sacrifice?

How did Abraham know how to keep the 'ways of the Lord', and command his children so they would do righteousness? How did he know what constituted 'doing righteousness'?

(Gen 18:19) "For I have chosen him, so that he may command his children and his household after him to keep the way of the LORD by doing righteousness and justice, so that the LORD may bring upon Abraham what He has spoken about him."

Just before Cain killed Abel, God said to him...

(Gen 4:7) "If you do well, will not your countenance be lifted up? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door; and its desire is for you, but you must master it."

We know what sin is because of law...

(Rom 7:7) What shall we say then? Is the Law sin? May it never be! On the contrary, I would not have come to know sin except through the Law; for I would not have known about coveting if the Law had not said, "YOU SHALL NOT COVET."

So, did God give law (torah - meaning: teachings and instructions) from the beginning? He must have.

 

[Trench777]

Also from Romans:

RO 2:14 For when the Gentiles, which have not the law, do by nature the things contained in the law, these, having not the law, are a law unto themselves:
RO 2:15 Which show the work of the law written in their hearts, their conscience also bearing witness, and their thoughts the mean while accusing or else excusing one another.

"Law written in thier hearts" is the line I'd like to point out. I'm not sure whether God had given the law to Cain through spoken Words or if He was telling him to "observe the law" in his own heart (We can be 100% certain however that Cain; A: broke the law and B: was held accountable for doing so).

I'm also not sure (as you point out) how pre-Levitical people were to know how to make a clean sacrifice without any written guidelines.

I DO know this thread has taken an interesting turn!

T777

 

[G4m]

Hi G4!

Yes, you're right, the Mosaic Law was brought in 430 years later, but why did God bring 'clean and unclean' animals into the ark, which we know of as a Levitical Law? To make clean sacrifice yes.. how did they know how to make clean sacrifice?

How did Abraham know how to keep the 'ways of the Lord', and command his children so they would do righteousness? How did he know what constituted 'doing righteousness'?

(Gen 18:19) "For I have chosen him, so that he may command his children and his household after him to keep the way of the LORD by doing righteousness and justice, so that the LORD may bring upon Abraham what He has spoken about him."

Just before Cain killed Abel, God said to him...

(Gen 4:7) "If you do well, will not your countenance be lifted up? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door; and its desire is for you, but you must master it."

We know what sin is because of law...

(Rom 7:7) What shall we say then? Is the Law sin? May it never be! On the contrary, I would not have come to know sin except through the Law; for I would not have known about coveting if the Law had not said, "YOU SHALL NOT COVET."

So, did God give law (torah - meaning: teachings and instructions) from the beginning? He must have.

But are you thinking that maybe He gave the complete law? If so remember that Galatians said the law came after the promise and not before. Or are you suggesting that God gave a subset of the complete torah earlier?

My apologies for my lack of understanding.

 

[Rafael]

Just to add a little to an interesting thread - Even before the law of Moses, the lamb was slain and eaten on the night the angel of death passed over the children of Israel in Egypt, too. So I agree with Tavita, that God has given instructions for blood sacrifice for a long time and had the law in mind eternally along with the blood sacrifice we all come to God in righteousness through. The law is a spiritual thing and eternal, so the ten commandments fulfilled in the laws of love, given by Jesus, and are eternally part of God, as Jesus said, "not one jot or tittle will pass away". Think of that blood shed by Jesus - what acts built up to it and will ever after stand for eternity.

Ro 7:14 For we know that the law is spiritual: but I am carnal, sold under sin.