Anglicanism vs Orthodoxy

[EricTheRed]

I read in a recent thread (dont know where) that at some point the Anglican church was very close to orthodoxy and there was some hope for union. When was this and what has changed?

 

[Torah613]

what quashed it initially? in a word, Bolshevism. it was a personal project of Patriarch Tikhon. In fact the service book used by most American Orthodox was translated by an Episcopalean.

What has happened since then? well, a number of things too numerous to mention.

Joe Zollars

 

[gzt]

There was some more dealings going on like in the 50's-70's, but Anglicanism just moved suddenly away, I think the final nail was women's ordination.

 

[EricTheRed]

thats sad. it would have been nice to have a western side of the church again.

 

[prodromos]

I seem to recall that when Timothy Ware (now Bishop Kalistos) approached the Greek church in England with a view to converting, they told him to remain Anglican as they would soon become part of the Orthodox communion. He eventually went to the Russians.

Note that I have only a vague memory of someone else telling me this and have no sources to back this up so it could be complete fiction.

John

 

[She]

Yes it is a shame. If it were easier to join the Orthodox Church in this country, I would do so. But the Orthodox Churches, here, in England are too far away from where I live. Also, their services are mainly in other languages. It is a real pity that the Anglican Church did not join with them but instead took a more liberal route.

 

[Ioan cel Nou]

Yes it is a shame. If it were easier to join the Orthodox Church in this country, I would do so. But the Orthodox Churches, here, in England are too far away from where I live. Also, their services are mainly in other languages. It is a real pity that the Anglican Church did not join with them but instead took a more liberal route.

Where do you live? I might be able to point you in the direction of a parish that uses English at least from time to time if not every Sunday. My own parish uses almost entirely Romanian (not surprising since I'm one of only two converts there) but there are quite a number that do use English. Let me know (PM me if you like) if I can help.

James

 

[eoe]

If it were easier to join the Orthodox Church in this country, I would do so.

Driving a long distances or dealing with convert issues (language) are the easy parts of becoming Orthodox. To become Orthodox is to take on a life of asceticsm and self denial. The cost is high but the rewards are immeasureable.

 

[Theophorus]

I found this blog the other day. It makes some good points on what constitutes the Church.
It also demonstartes to me that the Orthodox Church exists by no other way than the grace of God.

 

[Monica child of God 1]

I seem to recall that when Timothy Ware (now Bishop Kalistos) approached the Greek church in England with a view to converting, they told him to remain Anglican as they would soon become part of the Orthodox communion. He eventually went to the Russians.

Note that I have only a vague memory of someone else telling me this and have no sources to back this up so it could be complete fiction.

John

No I heard this from his own mouth. You're not making things up

M.

 

[Monica child of God 1]

[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]The following is from a pastoral letter issued by St. Raphael Hawaweeny in 1912 while bishop of Brooklyn.

"I am convinced that the doctrinal teaching and practices, as well as the discipline, of the whole Anglican Church are unacceptable to the Holy Orthodox Church. I make this apology for the Anglicans whom as Christian gentlemen I greatly revere, that the loose teaching of a great many of the prominent Anglican theologians are so hazy in their definitions of truths, and so inclined toward pet heresies that it is hard to tell what they believe. The Anglican Church as a whole has not spoken authoritatively on her doctrine. Her Catholic-minded members can call out her doctrines from many views, but so nebulous is her pathway in the doctrinal world that those who would extend a hand of both Christian and ecclesiastical fellowship dare not, without distrust, grasp the hand of her theologians, for while many are orthodox on some points, they are quite heterodox on others. I speak, of course, from the Holy Orthodox Eastern Catholic point of view. The Holy Orthodox Church has never perceptibly changed from Apostolic times, and, therefore, no one can go astray in finding out what She teaches. Like Her Lord and Master, though at times surrounded with human malaria—which He in His mercy pardons—She is the same yesterday, and today, and forever (Heb. 13:8) the mother and safe deposit of the truth as it is in Jesus (cf. Eph. 4:21)."

Read the whole letter here.
[/FONT]

 

[EricTheRed]

Is it likely that many orthodox anglican parishes will move over to Orthodoxy if the Anglican church continues to go left?

 

[gzt]

several have done so. others may go Catholic. the more Evangelically-minded would probably just go independent.

 

[Monica child of God 1]

Is it likely that many orthodox anglican parishes will move over to Orthodoxy if the Anglican church continues to go left?

An Episcopal priest and his family were chrismated last year at my parish. He is preparing to go to seminary in the fall, I believe. Additionally we have loads of former Episcopal laity coming in.

M.

 

[ThePilgrim]

An Episcopal priest and his family were chrismated last year at my parish. He is preparing to go to seminary in the fall, I believe. Additionally we have loads of former Episcopal laity coming in.

M.

A former Continuing Anglican bishop and his entire parish were received as catechumens on March 5th.

Grace and peace,
John

 

[Dewi Sant]

Is it likely that many orthodox anglican parishes will move over to Orthodoxy if the Anglican church continues to go left?

It is a most wonderful and feasable assumption.

The Anglican church (church of England) which I attend with my non-orthodox mother is extremely Eastern in its approach.

There are icons.
Theotokos icons even!
Candles.
All male choir, oftenly unnacommpianied.
Processions of the Gospel, similar to the small entrance of the Orthodox church.

This church in particular is 900 years old and was becomming almost liberal, but with the new clergy it is moving backwards towards the roots.

I just have to see the vicar about the filioque, which I was dissapointed to see was used in the Easter mass....sorry, I mean liturgy....sorry again, Anglicans call it "service" .




The Orthodox church in England seems somewhat underground and if it wasn't for a friend telling me that they worship in a hired hall, I would probably, never have found it.
Once our community has a building, everything will be different!


The Anglican may have to split as said earlier.
The "High Church" will probably shift to Orthodoxy, though some may remain Church of England
because of reluctant parishoners and clergy.
The Low, or "evangelical" churches will probably carry on as protestant churches. Independantly run, as many are, claiming to be "non-denominational".



I don't think we can expect a re-union soon. But with the Orthodox church in England growing rapidly, things can only be getting closer.

Bishop Kallistos Ware said in an interview (which is archived on the Goarch website) that he has nothing against Women Priests, but he doesn't agree with the ordination of women Priests.
To me, this appears to be a stance towards a hopeful re-union with the CofE and Orthodox.

 

[Dewi Sant]

Of course.
Apart from the odd church in Manchester, Liverpool and London. There are few established Orthodox churches.
(built for and by immigrants)

We are probably the first main generation of the Orthodox growth in England.

These are exciting times in Church history,

 

[EricTheRed]

The Anglican church (church of England) which I attend with my non-orthodox mother is extremely Eastern in its approach.

Feel free to "inform" them about the Orthodox Church and how they should join...NOW

 

[Dewi Sant]

My mum is very much a lay Christian and though I would like her to come to the Orthodox Church, she won't go.

I'm giving it time.
I don't like to force her into anything.
I have done that so often in my past and I know it doesn't work.

Though, on the 6th of July (I think it is) we have the Archbishop coming over! Archbishop Gregorius. I am sure my mum will at least come for the barbecue afterwards.

 

[InnerPhyre]

When I speak to people who declare themselves Anglo-Catholic, I feel like I'm speaking to Western Orthodox Christians. I can discern no difference between their faith and mine. But their church has no way of enforcing orthodoxy. It seems that they don't listen to their bishops....and things have gotten completely out of control.