ancient civilizations

[dad]

There are ancient civilizations that predate a young earth.

Give one example, compplete with the dating basis and method..

 

[Jazer]

you can read about science as much as you like but you will not understand it.

I will be glad to match my reading comprehension scores against yours anyday. Bring it on.

 

[Nostromo]

At least that is what Science tells us. Adam was the first Hebrew. Right now they believe that Adam, Noah & Abraham all had identical y-DNA until then find out different.

Does it really need pointing out that a book by a Rabbi isn't science?

 

[USincognito]

You should have checked your facts before you commented. Nimrod is mentioned outside of the Bible.

Why are you merely asserting this? Why don't you give us the supposed source?

 

[USincognito]

*heavy sigh* For the record, this is for the onlookers of this sad farce, as you have bluntly stated in the past that you cannot learn anything.

To start with, we need to define 'civilization'. Are the tribal hunter/gardeners of South America a civilization? Were the Native Americans a civilization when the colonists arrived? Were the builders of Stonehenge part of a civilization? Is a city a necessary component to a civilization? What about agricultural civilizations?

Archaeologically, when we say a 'civilization', we are referring to a society of people united by a combination of culture, spiritual beliefs, politics, law, and technological development. The upper paleolithic, for instance, saw the birth of religion, art, construction, and human society. The earliest villages and towns can be found from this time period, built of bones and hides. The oldest are over 25000 years old. Sites were inhabited either continuously or (more often) seasonally. We have evidence for leadership through graduated burial practices, and of culture we have both cave paintings and hand carved statues and monuments.

I admit that I worded my sentence awkwardly--'cities' in the sense that we would think of them today did not exist 12,000 years ago, but civilizations definitely did. (Cities existed over 6000 years ago. It's easy to get mixed up about which erroneous number I'm arguing about from person to person.)



Because you have started with assumptions that you will never let go of, you can read about science as much as you like but you will not understand it.

Faith24, you'd do well not to pay any attention to AV's nonsense or Jazer's wild claims. Jade just summed it all up with this post.

 

[Jazer]

Faith24, you'd do well not to pay any attention to AV's nonsense or Jazer's wild claims. Jade just summed it all up with this post.

I am not making any wild claims. I am only doing a little research to report what science has to say about it. Perhaps you think that science makes wild claims. Perhaps you think that science is untrustworty. You maybe right, but all I can do is tell you want science says if you want to reject science that is up to you.

 

[Faith24]

I am not making any wild claims. I am only doing a little research to report what science has to say about it. Perhaps you think that science makes wild claims. Perhaps you think that science is untrustworty. You maybe right, but all I can do is tell you want science says if you want to reject science that is up to you.

Show that Nimrod exist outside the bible.

 

[AV1611VET]

Well, Nimrod doesn't mention in the Sumerian writings - no evidence he exist outside of the bible.

Keep looking.

 

[AV1611VET]

Show that Nimrod exist outside the bible.

Why do I get the feeling it wouldn't matter if he could or not?

 

[Jade Margery]

I will be glad to match my reading comprehension scores against yours anyday. Bring it on.

Y'know, awhile ago I addressed most of your erroneous claims of bible/science fraternization. I did so in great detail with much thought, and I was completely ignored. If you would like to match your comprehension to mine, you could start by responding, thoughtfully and in detail, to my refutations of your assertions here.

You can do so either in that thread, in a new thread, or by PM if you'd like to. Until that happens, I don't see much point in debating you directly, but I will address misinformation that you are spreading to others.

 

[Faith24]

Keep looking.

Are you saying he is Gilgamesh? Or anyone of the Sumerian gods? That is speculations.

 

[Split Rock]

Archaeologically, when we say a 'civilization', we are referring to a society of people united by a combination of culture, spiritual beliefs, politics, law, and technological development. The upper paleolithic, for instance, saw the birth of religion, art, construction, and human society. The earliest villages and towns can be found from this time period, built of bones and hides. The oldest are over 25000 years old. Sites were inhabited either continuously or (more often) seasonally. We have evidence for leadership through graduated burial practices, and of culture we have both cave paintings and hand carved statues and monuments.

I thought the most common definition of civilization included things like a writing system and monumental architecture? The way I would say it is that human culture and societies existed 25,000 years ago, rather than civilization.

From wikipedia:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cradle_of_Civilization
"The earliest signs of a sedentarization process can be traced back to the Levant to as early as 12000 BC, when the Natufian culture became sedentary and evolved into an agricultural society by 10000 BC.[10] The importance of water to safeguard an abundant and stable food supply, due to favourable conditions for hunting, fishing and gathering resources including cereals, provided an initial wide spectrum economy that triggered the creation of permanent villages.[11]

The earliest proto-urban settlements with several thousand inhabitants emerge in the Neolithic, while the first cities to house several tens of thousands were Memphis and Uruk, by the 31st century BC (see Historical urban community sizes)."

 

[Split Rock]

Give one example, compplete with the dating basis and method..

Read a book on Archaeology.

 

[Faith24]

Why do I get the feeling it wouldn't matter if he could or not?

Well Jazer brought it up. Not me.

And you said keep looking so I assume you are agreeing with Jazer that Nimrod exist out of the bible.

So where's the textual evidence for that?

 

[Jazer]

So where's the textual evidence for that?

You could do a google search. A good place to start would be Wiki.

Nimrod (Hebrew: נִמְרוֹד, Modern Nimrod Tiberian Nimrōḏ Aramaic: ܢܡܪܘܕ‎ Arabic: نمرود&#8206 is, according to the Book of Genesis and Books of Chronicles, the son of Cush and great-grandson of Noah and the king of Shinar. He is depicted in the Tanakh as a man of power in the earth, and a mighty hunter. Extra-Biblical traditions associating him with the Tower of Babel led to his reputation as a king who was rebellious against YHWH. Several Mesopotamian ruins were given Nimrod's name by 8th century Arabs[1] (see Nimrud).

Josephus wrote about Nimrod and there are others that wrote about him.

 

[Faith24]

Fair enough, Faith -- you want to bring DNA into the picture?

Let's take the Sumerian empire as an example.

According to the Bible, the Sumerian empire was started by Nimrod, Noah's great grandson: Noah → Ham → Cush → Nimrod → Sumerians.

Please show me DNA evidence that shows the Sumerians came from some other line.

I don't have any DNA evidence for this claim. I wasn't making the claim to bringing DNA into this issue at all. I was just using an example that we shouldn't disregard something because we weren't there. You asked if I was there.

Alright, so the Sumerians was started by Nimrod. What's your point?

 

[Faith24]

You could do a google search. A good place to start would be Wiki.

Nimrod (Hebrew: נִמְרוֹד, Modern Nimrod Tiberian Nimrōḏ Aramaic: ܢܡܪܘܕ‎ Arabic: نمرود&#8206 is, according to the Book of Genesis and Books of Chronicles, the son of Cush and great-grandson of Noah and the king of Shinar. He is depicted in the Tanakh as a man of power in the earth, and a mighty hunter. Extra-Biblical traditions associating him with the Tower of Babel led to his reputation as a king who was rebellious against YHWH. Several Mesopotamian ruins were given Nimrod's name by 8th century Arabs[1] (see Nimrud).

Josephus wrote about Nimrod and there are others that wrote about him.

Ok, he is mentioned outside the scripture. That's fine.

So he rebelled against YHWH. Why do other people think he is a Sumerian god, like Gilgamesh? And if that's true what does that tell you about the story? A Copy? Not really sure if I'm getting this right though.

 

[AV1611VET]

So he rebelled against YHWH. Why do other people think he is a Sumerian god, like Gilgamesh? And if that's true what does that tell you about the story? A Copy? Not really sure if I'm getting this right though.

Nimrod, Noah's great grandson, started out being a...

Genesis 10:9 He was a mighty hunter before the LORD: wherefore it is said, Even as Nimrod the mighty hunter before the LORD.

... but something went wrong, and he turned his back on the LORD.

(I take it he was an excellent hunter, but his real love was masonry.)

He then broke away from the rest of his kindred and formed his own empire, with its own set of scriptures.

This is what we call diabolical mimicry, or diabolical plagiarism.

In any event, I'm sure Nimrod and Shem got into quite a few heated discussions.

I can even see Shem saying to Nimrod -- concerning the Flood -- "You weren't there! I was!"

 

[Jazer]

Why do other people think he is a Sumerian god, like Gilgamesh?

The sons of God were the decendants of Adam.

 

[USincognito]

Josephus wrote about Nimrod and there are others that wrote about him.

Josephus wrote about him in the History of the Jews using... the Tanakh as a source.

Try again.