An atheists world

[RedRover]

So you went through most of your childhood without a bicycle?

Yeah, pretty much. I was the youngest so I got some hand me downs every now and then from someone somewhere. In fact thanks for reminding me because once my brother gave me a bicycle that did not have any brakes on it. I should ask him what that was all about You know what they say about sometimes we just can not get a break in life. It would have been cheaper to buy me a bicycle because I had to drag my feet to stop and I wore out a pair of shoes.

 

[HitchSlap]

You betchum!

Hebrews 9:22b and without shedding of blood is no remission.

Now you get the idea why God respected Abel's sacrifice over Cain's.

I do not consider blood lust to be moral. Nor do I consider it moral for one person to be condemned for another person's actions.

 

[toolmanjantzi]

Ask yourself this . . .

Let's say that your child was sick, and all he needs is some antibiotics to get better. If your child does not get those antibiotics, your child dies.

Do you give your child antibiotics? Yes or no?

Yes.

By giving your child antibiotics, are you taking that child's free will away? Yes or no?

Yes, the child did not make the decision. I did.

By revealing your existence to your child, are you taking away their free will? Yes or no?

I do not believe so.

Even more importantly, would you create the deadly bacteria that is killing your child and allow it to infect your child to begin with? Yes or no?

Yes and No. ANTIBODIES are formed when small amounts of the deadly bacteria enter the body and can cause it to become stronger, by the body being forced to make them.

My child would be stronger then your child. So yes I would. But I can see why you think it's unethical because I am to assume if the child dies there is no afterlife in your world. My God sent his only son to be the antibody for sin in sinners, and if you knowing science can not comprehend how much love is involved by doing that, then can there be any hope for YOU. The very things you study teach you what God did.

 

[Lethe]

ANTIBODIES are formed when small amounts of the deadly bacteria enter the body and can cause it to become stronger, by the body being forced to make them.

Thanks for the garbled biology lesson. You omitted the part where it is trial and error. The error being it can kill you.

 

[toolmanjantzi]

You know, for a christian, you are not very good at this analogy thing, are you. You missed so much here. Are you even capable of abstract thinking?

1a: I am talking about teaching the parents, not teaching the children while the parents do nothing. Isn't that more than obvious?

1b: You don't know what instinct and sub conscience mean, do you. Good lord, man, get a dictionary. Your comment here is meaningless.

1c: Solomen was a fictional character in a fictional story, so not a good basis for example. Also, you have to take all four of these parts together, one of them alone is not necessarily enough.

1d: No, since I would teach them how to live and teach them not to waste any time worshiping me, it would be obvious that hucksters are, well, hucksters. Reading comprehension is your friend.

And yes, it is still easy to be better than god.

Once again why the Solomon story is there, is so people don't make the same mistakes.

 

[toolmanjantzi]

What watch theory? I don't know of any such thing.

If I found a watch on top of your mountain. Does it mean over millions of years a watch formed, or does it mean I found SOMEONE'S WATCH that was made by obviously very intelligent blonde and blue eyed Swiss watch makers.

 

[toolmanjantzi]

Nonsense.

Simple rules obviously give rise to complex, even completely unpredictable behavior.

An example of a hard, but still deterministic simple rule set would be Go or Chess. The rules are simple, the implications for strategy and board position explode.

You don't need to be a genius to invent chess or go or to learn the rules, but it's not possible to know all outcomes.

Right. Because you believe God is like
corruptible you.

 

[Lethe]

Right. Because you believe God is like
corruptible you.

Non-sequitur. Completely irrelevant response.

 

[toolmanjantzi]

So he already knew that millions of children would die agonizing deaths due to disease before he even started?

And be present with him.

 

[EternalDragon]

God created Adam and Eve, and according to you God knew that they would do the very things they did do before God even created them. An omnipotent God, by definition, could have created the world so they would not have sinned and that would have prevented the pain and suffering of billions, according to your beliefs.

That would have created a puppet world with no free will.

Also, when was the last time anyone gave the death penalty to a child because of something their great-grandfather did? How is that anywhere close to being moral?

Death penalty? That was one of the results of sin. Not a penalty from God. Besides I think any Christian knows that your body dies and then there is the judgement. You, yourself do not die.

Of course. If your child were suffering and you could easily stop their suffering, isn't it your moral duty to stop that suffering? Don't we put parents in jail for neglecting their children?

Yes, that is why God became a man, Jesus.

Besides, you make a poor analogy there. I trained my child to drive and sent him on his way when he got his regular license. Now he drives on his own and can speed or drive drunk and get killed even though I told him not to do it. Is that me neglecting my child? Can I go to jail for that? Your analogy is ridiculous.

If history is any indication, it will only increase suffering.

Only sin increases suffering. But wait a minute! If we all just evolved from fish then what does suffering matter anyways? Why are you arguing against suffering? You do realize you are using biblical morals and purpose to make your argument?

 

[Cheeky Monkey]

That would have created a puppet world with no free will.

If god created the world with full knowledge of everything that will ever happen then he already created a puppet world, it just happens to be one where the puppets get to suffer.

 

[Juvenal]

Left up to Mother Nature, the odds of life occurring on its own in the universe is 10[sup]40,000[/sup].

Given that 10[sup]50[/sup] is sufficient to say that something cannot happen: evolution is mathematically impossible.

SOURCE

I've tried that before, they still want evidence. They have the opportunity to put their theory to practice.

Aha! Now I know how to put 10[sup]50[/sup] into a sentence.

I tried the mathematical approach as well. I think someone stated that math does not fit in with evolution or something along those lines. Or they will say that the start of life is not part of evolution theory.

Or perhaps they'll say "learn some math."

The odds against any one lay-down of a standard 52-card deck are 1 in 80658175170943878571660636856403766975289505440883277824000000000000. Exactly.

That's 8 x 10^67.

Claims must be backed up by real evidence.

If you don't want to be laughed at I would suggest that you avoid creationist sties that are well know for their lying.

They're generally bad about counting, too.

As ever, Jesse

 

[toolmanjantzi]

For a start, I wouldn't send my previous {ha,ha} perfect creation that rebelled against me down to the planet I created my other perfect life, just so he can tempt and mislead said perfect life into doing things I don't like.

Thumbs. That is smart. But your saying then that creation would deal with rape, murder and child sacrifice. What about the supposed innocent humans?

 

[Skaloop]

The odds against any one lay-down of a standard 52-card deck are 1 in 80658175170943878571660636856403766975289505440883277824000000000000. Exactly.

That's 8 x 10^67.

Holy crap and OhEmGee, that means I've done the mathematically impossible several times in my life!!!

 

[AV1611VET]

I do not consider blood lust to be moral.

Nor do I consider it blood lust.

 

[AV1611VET]

that means I've done the mathematically impossible several times in my life!!!

Anyone can do a random lay-down and attribute it to mathematical odds.

Now try a specific lay-down that produces life -- and produces life so that we are made in the image and likeness of another Life.

 

[toolmanjantzi]

Yeah, no evil if I was god. See how simple that was?

You made people who knew no evil. What kind of judge is that?

 

[toolmanjantzi]

That doesn't make sense.

Because you lack God.

 

[toolmanjantzi]

Is He now?

Perhaps He operates on another set of standards and a higher knowledge base than you?

Didn't that atheist/scientist (no name?) say he thought it unusual that we search for an intelligent being out in space, yet if they are so intelligent, exactly what would we have to offer them, being in comparison like sheep. Which makes us food on the food chain.

 

[toolmanjantzi]

Lee Iacocca never claimed to be omnipotent and omniscient. If he were he could have created an automobile that could never be stolen, would never be in an accident, and would never break down. If Iacocca were omnipotent we could blame him for every GM car that was stolen.

How so? you are, that no good car.