An abortion scenario

[loriersea]

There is a story in the news about a woman who found out she had cancer when she was in her first month of pregnancy. She decided not to abort, and thus couldn't get chemotherapy. Her son was born two months early, but is doing okay, and she died a week after his birth. She has three other children from a previous marriage.

Is it moral for a woman to decide to die and leave three children without a mother rather than abort an embryo that is 3 or 4 weeks old?

 

[loriersea]

I have been trying not to judge this woman, but it is hard for me not to. I think she was wrong, and I think she was selfish, and as a mother what she does makes me so so so angry at her. If she had not had other children, I would think she did a noble thing. However, she did have other children, and yet she decided that a three week old fetus was worth more than their well-being.

I see what she did as little better than committing suicide, and I could never think that a parent committing suicide and leaving their children without a parent was anything less than entirely selfish and wrong.

I've been thinking about it, and to me a parallel example would be if someone was carrying a frozen embryo in their purse, and they were stopped by someone with a gun. And, the person said to them, either you destroy that embryo, or I'll shoot you. If I shoot you, then I won't destroy the embryo (and let's say this woman knows that the embryo will be implanted in someone, so it WILL develop into a person). And, the woman being asked as three kids at home. I can't see any situation in which it would be okay to value that embryo over her own life, when her life is so intimately connected to the well-being of her children.

Like I said, I'm trying hard not to judge this woman. I'm sorry she died. I just feel so much anger at the choice she made, and it saddens me to think that anyone is applauded her choice.

 

[sethad]

funny how those who advocate for choice then turn around and bite people in the back for the choice they made...

 

[loriersea]

I'm sorry, did I say anywhere she shouldn't have had the legal right to make the choice she did? Nope, I didn't. I think she should. I just think her choice was wrong. But, it *is* possible think someone is doing something wrong and selfish, but not want to make the option to do it illegal.

 

[sethad]

I'm sorry, did I say anywhere she shouldn't have had the legal right to make the choice she did? Nope, I didn't. I think she should. I just think her choice was wrong. But, it *is* possible think someone is doing something wrong and selfish, but not want to make the option to do it illegal.

she made her choice. that is what pro-choicers advocate for isnt it? choice.

I never said anything about legal either.

She made her choice. Let her be.

 

[loriersea]

she made her choice. that is what pro-choicers advocate for isnt it? choice.

I never said anything about legal either.

She made her choice. Let her be.

So it's not okay to question the morality of reproductive choices? Because I have no problem with that. Question the morality of different reproductive choices all you want, I don't care. I only care when people try to pass laws to revive the back-alley abortion industry.

 

[sethad]

So it's not okay to question the morality of reproductive choices?

It is. pro-lifers will say that abortion in general is immoral or that abortion for any reason but a medical reason is immoral etc. but pro choicers advocate for choice whether the women decides to abort or not to abort correct?

she made her choice. she didnt want to abort. that is what pro choicers advocate for. or, they claim to. maybe they have double standards?

 

[Ampoliros]

It is. pro-lifers will say that abortion in general is immoral or that abortion for any reason but a medical reason is immoral etc. but pro choicers advocate for choice whether the women decides to abort or not to abort correct?

she made her choice. she didnt want to abort. that is what pro choicers advocate for. or, they claim to. maybe they have double standards?

She can (and did) make her choice. That is my position, and the position of other pro-choicers. However, we do not necessarily have to agree with her decision just because we support her ability to make a decision. Similarly, I support your ability to speak what you want, but I don't agree with everything you say.

Simple.

 

[sethad]

She can (and did) make her choice. That is my position, and the position of other pro-choicers. However, we do not necessarily have to agree with her decision just because we support her ability to make a decision. Similarly, I support your ability to speak what you want, but I don't agree with everything you say.

Simple.

Never said otherwise. However, if you are going to allow someone a choice then dont bash them for the choice they made, even if you dont agree with it.

 

[loriersea]

As I said, I'm not trying to bash her. I don't think that someone who thinks a woman who had an abortion made a wrong choice is bashing her. In this case, as a mother, it is very, very hard for me not to be angry at this woman, because the idea of leaving my son without a mom because I valued a 3 week old fetus more than his growing up with a mother bothers me, a lot. I was curious what other people thought.

Do you think that what she did was morally okay? That was the question. Her right to make that choice was never in question.

I don't think that every woman who has an abortion is making the right choice. I have a friend who was telling me about a woman she knew who was in her 30s and financially secure, and decided to have an abortion because she had been sleeping with a married man and didn't want to embarass him. I thought, and still do think, that that was an awful reason for an abortion. I don't think she made the right choice. I still think she should have had the legal right to make it.

 

[sethad]

I dont know. I've never been in her situation however I'd probably very willingly give up my own life to save one of my kids, even though it would be hard for them to grow up without a dad.

I dont think I could sit there and watch my kid die just so I could stay on the earth longer.

 

[kimber1]

someone mentioned she had other children, okay did they not have a father to take of them? she sacrificed her life to save her childs. how is that wrong? she gave her other 3 children a sibling to grow up with as well.

 

[loriersea]

How about the hypothetical, then? Is it right for a woman with children to decide that a frozen embryo of hers that will be implanted in someone else should be saved and she should die?

I just think that being a parent is about making hard choices. Of course this woman didn't want to have an abortion, but sometimes parents have to make sacrifices in order to do what's right. This woman chose not to sacrifice a pregnancy she wanted in order to be there for her kids. She decided that continuing the pregnancy she wanted was more important than being there for her kids. To me, that was a selfish choice, and taking the easy way out. Doing the hard thing would have been having the abortion, and grieving it, and then surviving so that her kids had a mom.

 

[TeddyKGB]

However, if you are going to allow someone a choice then dont bash them for the choice they made, even if you dont agree with it.

You are half-right. I support free speech out of enlightened self-interest: even though I might disagree with what someone says, I hold the principle higher than the content of their speech, because someone else probably disagrees with me just as much.

Thus, my only recourse (by design) is to oppose the speech with which I disagree with contravening speech of my own.

Similarly, I hold the principle of reproductive freedom high even though I might disagree with individual choices.

 

[wanderingone]

There is a story in the news about a woman who found out she had cancer when she was in her first month of pregnancy. She decided not to abort, and thus couldn't get chemotherapy. Her son was born two months early, but is doing okay, and she died a week after his birth. She has three other children from a previous marriage.

Is it moral for a woman to decide to die and leave three children without a mother rather than abort an embryo that is 3 or 4 weeks old?

I would say she made her choice.. and that's exactly what she should be free to do. I would also say she didn't choose to die, she chose to live her last days the way she wanted to.. another choice I fully support... and no I find nothing immoral about making the choice she did. I'm not sure what I personally would do but I find nothing unethical about this woman's choice.

 

[sethad]

How about the hypothetical, then? Is it right for a woman with children to decide that a frozen embryo of hers that will be implanted in someone else should be saved and she should die?

I just think that being a parent is about making hard choices. Of course this woman didn't want to have an abortion, but sometimes parents have to make sacrifices in order to do what's right. This woman chose not to sacrifice a pregnancy she wanted in order to be there for her kids. She decided that continuing the pregnancy she wanted was more important than being there for her kids. To me, that was a selfish choice, and taking the easy way out. Doing the hard thing would have been having the abortion, and grieving it, and then surviving so that her kids had a mom.

Did she know for sure she would die if she didnt abort?

and it is a tough choice. parenting is full of that. she obviously thought it was the right choice.

as for implanting the embryo in someone else...that would work if it could be done and done safely. Are there instances where people can do that? if so it's news to me. If not...perhaps they should be finding ways to develop that.

 

[wanderingone]

Doing the hard thing would have been having the abortion, and grieving it, and then surviving so that her kids had a mom.

There's no guarantee she would have survived.

 

[DieHappy]

Indeed. The evidence suggests people survive cancer in spite of chemo, not because of it. She made the right choice, and she probably didn't have to die.

 

[katautumn]

Yes, she made a choice, but being a martyr isn't exactly a noble thing. I could never leave behind a husband and other children who need me just to prove a point.

 

[sethad]

Yes, she made a choice, but being a martyr isn't exactly a noble thing. I could never leave behind a husband and other children who need me just to prove a point.

who said anything that this women did it to prove a point? and to become a martyr?