Amway, Alticor, Quixstar, Multi level marketing

[Egghead]

I get the suspiscion that Egghead just likes to argue while seldom having a rational, arguable position. Must be a testosterone thing.

huh.
Where were YOU when the other poster was telling me not to speak about things I dont know about AFTER I have made it VERY clear that I HAVE looked into Amway, and very heavily ?

How about you keep your childish comments to yourself and stick to the topic of the thread

 

[Egghead]

What are the chances that one of your employees will ever make more money than you?

As soon as employees put in the money that I invested in equipment, are willing to deal with the extra paperwork, willing to accept the risks of losing ones shirt if the business fails, want to deal with insurance, workers comp, taxes, etc, etc, etc......then they are free to go out and do so and make whatever they feel they can.

Amway is NOT like a normal business.
NORMAL sales employees either make a SALARY PLUS commission or they make quite a bit more than 2-3% per sale.

Not one that Ive met has ever done anything but lost money, constanty putting in thier own cash to make it to the ''next level''

Now you tell me, how many people ACTUALLY make it to where they are being supported COMFORTABLY just by Amway income?

And Ill expect actual verifiable data to back any assertions you make just so we know you have a "rational, arguable position"

 

[ScottBot]

huh.
Where were YOU when the other poster was telling me not to speak about things I dont know about AFTER I have made it VERY clear that I HAVE looked into Amway, and very heavily ?

How about you keep your childish comments to yourself and stick to the topic of the thread

I like my childish comments, thank you very much. And for the most part, I have kept my comments on point, or haven't you been reading.

 

[ScottBot]

As soon as employees put in the money that I invested in equipment, are willing to deal with the extra paperwork, willing to accept the risks of losing ones shirt if the business fails, want to deal with insurance, workers comp, taxes, etc, etc, etc......then they are free to go out and do so and make whatever they feel they can.

Amway is NOT like a normal business.
NORMAL sales employees either make a SALARY PLUS commission or they make quite a bit more than 2-3% per sale.

Not one that Ive met has ever done anything but lost money, constanty putting in thier own cash to make it to the ''next level''

Now you tell me, how many people ACTUALLY make it to where they are being supported COMFORTABLY just by Amway income?

And Ill expect actual verifiable data to back any assertions you make just so we know you have a "rational, arguable position"

Where do you want me to send my 1099's so you can "verify" them? Or would you just like the name and phone number of my accountant so he can prove it to you?

I will give you this. If you treat your Quixtar business like a real, legitimate business, you will probably succeed. If you treat it like a hobby, you will fail miserably and end up being one of those pathetic crybabies on the internet who say that your upline fleeced you. It is what you make of it.

 

[Egghead]

Where do you want me to send my 1099's so you can "verify" them? Or would you just like the name and phone number of my accountant so he can prove it to you?

Thats it, dodge the question

let me repeat it for you...

"Now you tell me, how many people ACTUALLY make it to where they are being supported COMFORTABLY just by Amway income?"

Give us an ACCURATE and VERFIABLE percentage of members totally supported and ''comfortably'' by Amway alone.

Then I wonder what percent of people work real jobs who make enough to live comfortably.

I will give you this. If you treat your Quixtar business like a real, legitimate business, you will probably succeed.

Everyone I have known personally in Amway, approximately 20 people, have never made any money in it.

two of these are men who are the most motivated individuals Ive ever met.

The one put his all into Amway.....nothing.
So he bought the same kind of equipment I had, he purchased one of my machines, and within 60 days was looking to expand.
He now does very little with amway, but has his own business, has hired 4 salepeople, and is making as much money as our old employees, if not more.

Amway relys too heavily on those people beneath you being motivated to buy from themselves AND find new members.
When you cant find enough motivated people to fall under you, you make only a couple percent off an occasional sale of Nikes.

Amway is nothing like a normal job or business.
It offers promises of wealth to all that only a few end up making.
Those few at the top feed off those at the bottom.
That is a fact whether you admit it or not.

If you treat it like a hobby, you will fail miserably and end up being one of those pathetic crybabies on the internet who say that your upline fleeced you. It is what you make of it.

wrong.
If it were ONLY based on YOUR motivation, then it might succeed.
Its not.
It is based on the success and motivation of every person below you.
If they fail, you fail.
If my employees didnt want to work, Id just do all the work myself.....just as I always did.

 

[ScottBot]

Thats it, dodge the question

let me repeat it for you...

"Now you tell me, how many people ACTUALLY make it to where they are being supported COMFORTABLY just by Amway income?"

Give us an ACCURATE and VERFIABLE percentage of members totally supported and ''comfortably'' by Amway alone.

Then I wonder what percent of people work real jobs who make enough to live comfortably.




Everyone I have known personally in Amway, approximately 20 people, have never made any money in it.

two of these are men who are the most motivated individuals Ive ever met.

The one put his all into Amway.....nothing.
So he bought the same kind of equipment I had, he purchased one of my machines, and within 60 days was looking to expand.
He now does very little with amway, but has his own business, has hired 4 salepeople, and is making as much money as our old employees, if not more.

Amway relys too heavily on those people beneath you being motivated to buy from themselves AND find new members.
When you cant find enough motivated people to fall under you, you make only a couple percent off an occasional sale of Nikes.

Amway is nothing like a normal job or business.
It offers promises of wealth to all that only a few end up making.
Those few at the top feed off those at the bottom.
That is a fact whether you admit it or not.


wrong.
If it were ONLY based on YOUR motivation, then it might succeed.
Its not.
It is based on the success and motivation of every person below you.
If they fail, you fail.
If my employees didnt want to work, Id just do all the work myself.....just as I always did.

That's okay, you and your friends are beholden to the S quadrant. Most S quadrant business owners are scared to death of the B quadrant. It's a control thing. I get it. What happens to your business if you become incapacitated?

 

[Egghead]

Amway reminds me of the 401K plan my old boss signed us up for.

These guys come in and set up their charts and graphs to impress us how much money wed have when we retire.

All their info was based on a single year, and only presented the best investments they had made a return on.

The on area had somehow managed to double everyones money in it this particular year. So they use that as a selling point.

What they neglected to say was that this was a VERY high risk area to invest ones money and anyone with any intelligence at all would never stick much money at all there.

They also forgot to mention that this particular investment area in EVERY other year for the previous decade, other than that one in question, had lost money every time.
Again, no one with a brain would have put money in there.

So we all put money in each week.
The boss matched our dollars.
At the end of the year, with my investments greatly diversified (about 7 different areas), I had managed to lose about 8 % of what we had put in.

They promised us wealth at retirement, but it was a sham.
Only if I got lucky and put all my money in the right investment at the right time could it make as much as they were pushing.

I do better with metals.
At least there *I* control when I buy and sell, and if I lose money.

Most people might make money with a real business.
*MOST* are not going to make much money with Amway.
The way its structured makes it pretty much an impossibility

 

[Egghead]

That's okay, you and your friends are beholden to the S quadrant. Most S quadrant business owners are scared to death of the B quadrant. It's a control thing. I get it. What happens to your business if you become incapacitated?

hmmm.
Dodged my question yet again

 

[ScottBot]

hmmm.
Dodged my question yet again

Do most people fail to make respectable income in Multi-level marketing. Yes. Do most traditional businesses fail in the first 5 years of operation. Yes. What's your point?

 

[Egghead]

Do most people fail to make respectable income in Multi-level marketing. Yes. Do most traditional businesses fail in the first 5 years of operation. Yes. What's your point?

the point is in a REAL business you know the risks.
Rarely are you promised wealth.

Take my mom for instance.
She loves arts and crafts.

She has taken classes to do Ballon Decor and Event Decorating, not much investment there at all.
She bought a helium tank, a bow machine (to make gift bows), lots of craft stuff, etc, etc.

Ive seen this woman take one day, make a few balloon beauquets, do a little running to set them up, add a few decorations, and gross $4000 for one day.
Minus her help and material she ended up putting $2800 in her pocket.
She paid her help, one person who only did deliveries that day, $200.

She took cheap classes on doing professional wedding cakes, as well.

When she decorates a wedding, not including the cake, she averages $800-1000 for a day.
That is her take home after paying for help and material.

When she does shows, making her crafts stuff, if she was really prepared, she makes, after material, over $2000 for a two day weekend.

This is all without ANY advertising and no storefront.

My mother ''fails'' because she has no motivation, no consistancy.
She has shown many times she can make a LOT of money doing what she does, but cant keep it up for losing interest.

With her tho, she knows where she stands.
No one promised her riches, and she knows if she doesnt work, she wont make any money.

With Amway, you can put your heart and blood into it and if you cannot find motivated people, and the people you find cant find more motivated people willing to put their own money out to get to the ''next level'' each month, then you most likely arent going to make squat.

At a REAL job you clock in, you work, you get paid.
Amway is more like the lottery, some win, most dont.

 

[Egghead]

Do most people fail to make respectable income in Multi-level marketing. Yes. Do most traditional businesses fail in the first 5 years of operation. Yes. What's your point?

Ill ask again and hope you can answer this time....


"Now you tell me, how many people ACTUALLY make it to where they are being supported COMFORTABLY just by Amway income?"





.

 

[ScottBot]

the point is in a REAL business you know the risks.
Rarely are you promised wealth.

Take my mom for instance.
She loves arts and crafts.

She has taken classes to do Ballon Decor and Event Decorating, not much investment there at all.
She bought a helium tank, a bow machine (to make gift bows), lots of craft stuff, etc, etc.

Ive seen this woman take one day, make a few balloon beauquets, do a little running to set them up, add a few decorations, and gross $4000 for one day.
Minus her help and material she ended up putting $2800 in her pocket.
She paid her help, one person who only did deliveries that day, $200.

She took cheap classes on doing professional wedding cakes, as well.

When she decorates a wedding, not including the cake, she averages $800-1000 for a day.
That is her take home after paying for help and material.

When she does shows, making her crafts stuff, if she was really prepared, she makes, after material, over $2000 for a two day weekend.

This is all without ANY advertising and no storefront.

My mother ''fails'' because she has no motivation, no consistancy.
She has shown many times she can make a LOT of money doing what she does, but cant keep it up for losing interest.

With her tho, she knows where she stands.
No one promised her riches, and she knows if she doesnt work, she wont make any money.

With Amway, you can put your heart and blood into it and if you cannot find motivated people, and the people you find cant find more motivated people willing to put their own money out to get to the ''next level'' each month, then you most likely arent going to make squat.

At a REAL job you clock in, you work, you get paid.
Amway is more like the lottery, some win, most dont.

This is a bunch of horse poo. If you are a good salesmen, there is plenty of good money to be made just retailing products. I know a guy who makes over $100,000 a year just marketing cleaning products to janitorial and cleaning companies. He has NO ONE in his downline. Amway is a blank slate, you can make what you want out of it and the nice thing is that because you can drop ship products within days to anywhere in the country, you don't need employees or carry a large inventory. I carry lots of sample, but I seldom keep a large stock of products to sell outright. You checked out Amway and didn't like it. I checked it out and did like it. YOu claim that people can't make money with it, but I DO make great money with it. I've never lied about it, misrepresented it, or taken advantage of anyone. I've never forced anyone to do anything they didn't want to do, or go anywhere they didn't want to go, or buy anything they didn't want to buy.

 

[Egghead]

This is a bunch of horse poo. If you are a good salesmen, there is plenty of good money to be made just retailing products. I know a guy who makes over $100,000 a year just marketing cleaning products to janitorial and cleaning companies.

As I said, some win, most lose.

Ill ask once again..


"Now you tell me, how many people (%) ACTUALLY make it to where they are being supported COMFORTABLY just by Amway income?"

He has NO ONE in his downline. Amway is a blank slate, you can make what you want out of it and the nice thing is that because you can drop ship products within days to anywhere in the country, you don't need employees or carry a large inventory.

And how much product do you need to sell to make say $1000 per week ?
You alone doing sales? How much?

When I sale a RPG, I make 30% (I end up with $30 for a $100 item).
Do you make 5%?
4% ?
3% ?
2?..........

Thats a LOT of sales to make any money.

You say you ''know'' one guy ?
You KNOW him personally?
How many others do you know personally who make that kind of money?

You checked out Amway and didn't like it.

Uh no, I checked out Amway, wasnt sure, then did more homework with people I know in Amway.
I made them answer the questions they dont want to....like the one youve dodge 3 times.
I spent about 3 months on it before I told the guy i wasnt interested in handing him over $150 to join up.

YOu claim that people can't make money with it, but I DO make great money with it.

when did I say ''cant''
Please stop putting words into my mouth.
I said SOME DO, MOST DONT......and Ill add ''NEVER WILL"

The structuring of the pyramid wont allow EVERYONE to make that kind of money.

I've never lied about it, misrepresented it, or taken advantage of anyone.

I had one amway guy even tell my ''I got saved last night'' because he knew I was christian and figured hed get my attention that way.

I told him to take a hike

I've never forced anyone to do anything they didn't want to do, or go anywhere they didn't want to go, or buy anything they didn't want to buy.

Did you ever pressure anyone to pay their startup fees?
Honestly?

 

[Egghead]

You checked out Amway and didn't like it.

Uh no, I checked out Amway, wasnt sure, then did more homework with people I know in Amway.
I made them answer the questions they dont want to....like the one youve dodge 3 times.
I spent about 3 months on it before I told the guy i wasnt interested in handing him over $150 to join up.

 

[guardianspirit]

If you haven't been in this business or at least thoroughly checked it out, it would be better not to comment on something you don't know about.

I DID check it out quite extensively.

so next time you spout something out here, make sure YOU know what youre talking about.....thanks

My bad.

You cant rely on salesmanship like in other businesses, you have to rely on those under you purchasing from themselves on the order of approx $200 a month

As far as the products go, a lot of the products are essentials such as toilet paper, soap, shampoo, & laundry detergent. They also sell a lot of food such as cereal, spaghetti, microwavable dinners, rice, soups, and canned vegetables. So it's not high-pressure sales. Your just asking people to buy the stuff from Quixtar instead of Wal-mart, Costco, Shopco, and the grocery store (you would obviously still need to buy dairy, meats, and produce from the grocery store).

So all your doing is "convincing" them to buy "$200 a month" of stuff they already buy from themselves instead of another business.

 

[ScottBot]

Bottom line YOu have your OPINION as an outsider who never even tried to build a business. I have spent the last 5 actually building one. Who gives a fart what the statistics are. I got it, did what I was advised to do, and now I make money. That's the only statistic I care about. My upline was making good money, and he said, do this, take my advise, let me council you and if you don't argue with me, you will make it too. I did, and now I make great money. Statistics are just ammunition for people who can't make it to justify their inability. You think I'm dodging, go right ahead. I could care less. I am making it, and I have several people in my group who are making it. The ones that aren't doing well are the ones who either don't have the gumption to do the thinks I advise them to do, or think they are smarter than the system. All I know is that If I pass away or become incapacitated, everything transfers to my wife, and the money will continue to come in. So for all your pet theories and demand for statistics, I say who gives a fart. I did it, it works. I have the bank account and residual income to prove it. That's my last statement on the matter. End of the discussion IMO. Keep badmouthing it, that's what critics do, and seems to be your forte based on discussions in other forums. HAve a nice day.

As I said, some win, most lose.

Ill ask once again..



Did you ever pressure anyone to pay their startup fees?
Honestly?

No, people who want to register ask me to do it. I'm not in the business of chasing people around and begging them to make money.

 

[daveleau]

Woops. It appears I've been added to GT staff. I saw the "General" in the PM title and assumed GA.

reopened.

 

[Ceris]

Mod Hat On

This thread has been moved from General Theology to Business & Economics.


Mod Hat Off

 

[rosenherman]

I know enough about Amway already.

Here's the thing. Ignore that it's pitched as a business for a moment, and compare it to the way cults are run. Amway strongly encourages people who aren't doing well to stay quiet, and people who are doing well to brag, creating the false impression that people are doing pretty well at it.

With all of the various "network marketing" schemes, the products are, in fact, not worth what you pay; if they were, there wouldn't be the profit margin that allows for all the "success stories".

Amway "succeeds" (I use the term loosely) through very aggressive pushes that don't actually make most of the people involved any money at all, and competes through tactics such as disseminating specific calculated slanders of other companies through their corporate voice-mail system to make sure all Amway reps tell the same lies; for instance, that P&G's old logo was Satanic, or that Tide is made from old peanut shells and clogs your drain.

I've got to disagree, I use amway's laundry detergent and their liquid cleanser. I've not found anything to work as well, and the price is comparable to any other quality product.

 

[MoodyBlue]

I know of two gentlemen in the area where I live who are generally believed to have experienced some success with Amway - both are at the top of the pyramid, and have been for over 20 years. I am not aware of any others who claim any measure of success. I have been invited to join Amway on several occasions. Usually it was some vague aquaintance who out the blue would invite me out to lunch or call me at home. They were never upfront about the purpose for the call or lunch invitation. In every instance the recruiter was very careful not to mention the word "Amway", until absolutely forced to do so. I found the practice deceptive and it has certainly influenced my feelings about the organization.