Americans Want to Move on From COVID

public hermit said:

What about the common good? What about putting others before yourself? What about considering the interests of others before your own? These are all biblical principles, but you seem to want to sacrifice them for some idea of personal freedom.

Click to expand...

Right, when he already has freedom.

ThisIsMe123 said:

Right, when he already has freedom.

Click to expand...

I don't think any notion of freedom worth the claim can entail freedom from concern for others. Certainly, Christian freedom does not. What I have seen during this pandemic is a conscious effort to put the common good to the side for the sake of some kind of individual freedom. We are not islands floating around in our own little oases. Our individual flourishing depends on a cooperative effort towards the good of the whole while not sacrificing the individual in the process. The goal is to ensure the space for individual freedom. Our lack of cooperation during this pandemic, perhaps, has ensured that all of our individual freedoms were curtailed in ways avoidable if we had functioned for the sake of the whole.

But for this insistence on some faux freedom to be led by so many Christians is absurd. It is a surface faith that claims individual freedom trumps the good of others. But what did so many Christians do? They balked at wearing masks. They whined about vaccines. It wasn't that they all had a hard time breathing in masks or that some had health issues that advised against the vaccine; it became a matter of principle. What principle? Well, some faux notion of freedom that has absolutely nothing to do with loving others as Christ loved us.

public hermit said:

I don't think any notion of freedom worth the claim can entail freedom from concern for others. Certainly, Christian freedom does not. What I have seen during this pandemic is a conscious effort to put the common good to the side for the sake of some kind of individual freedom. We are not islands floating around in our own little oases. Our individual flourishing depends on a cooperative effort towards the good of the whole while not sacrificing the individual in the process. The goal is to ensure the space for individual freedom. Our lack of cooperation during this pandemic, perhaps, has ensured that all of our individual freedoms were curtailed in ways avoidable if we had functioned for the sake of the whole.

But for this insistence on some faux freedom to be led by so many Christians is absurd. It is a surface faith that claims individual freedom trumps the good of others. But what did so many Christians do? They balked at wearing masks. They whined about vaccines. It wasn't that they all had a hard time breathing in masks or that some had health issues that advised against the vaccine; it became a matter of principle. What principle? Well, some faux notion of freedom that has absolutely nothing to do with loving others as Christ loved us.

Click to expand...

Someone showed up at work to donate some items...but apparently, those items didn't meet policy, so I had to tell him we couldn't take those specific items, because it was due to safety concerns.

He had a Trump hat on by the way, and he got a little irritated with me and chalked up as typical government BS. He said he used to work for the same organization that I did a few years ago, and got fired for breaking policy because of some personal belief.

I just nodded and thought, "Why doesn't that surprise me" and maintained my professionalism.

He was willing to sacrifice his employment for "freedom' or some personal hang up or belief. Chances are he probably had a pattern regarding his attitude his entire life that led him to a life of unemployment or underemployment.

Brihaha said:

Yeah, we all want to move on from the pandemic. Vaccinated and unvaccinated alike. Yet one of those groups are not willing to help America recover and are prolonging this coronavirus mess for years. If you think this pandemic is nearing its end you may be wishful thinking. I think we likely have more variants surging thru America for a few more years. Estimates report only around 25% of Americans have caught covid so far. And vaccinations aren't high enough to establish herd immunity. Suffering will continue and much of it could be avoided if Americans were willing to unite as a team to protect each other by getting vaccinated. It's just an interesting fact some choose to ignore.

Click to expand...

Herd immunity is only possible with vaccine preventable disease, which the current COVID vaccine's are not, because immunity prevents community spread.

"Herd immunity (or community immunity) occurs when a high percentage of the community is immune to a disease (through vaccination and/or prior illness), making the spread of this disease from person to person unlikely. Even individuals not vaccinated (such as newborns and the immunocompromised) are offered some protection because the disease has little opportunity to spread within the community." Herd immunity - APIC

Our current COVID vaccine's don't prevent spread, as we are now finding out:

"A prospective cohort study in the UK by Anika Singanayagam and colleagues regarding community transmission of SARS-CoV-2 among unvaccinated and vaccinated individuals provides important information that needs to be considered in reassessing vaccination policies. This study showed that the impact of vaccination on community transmission of circulating variants of SARS-CoV-2 appeared to be not significantly different from the impact among unvaccinated people.2, 3 The scientific rationale for mandatory vaccination in the USA relies on the premise that vaccination prevents transmission to others, resulting in a “pandemic of the unvaccinated”.4
Yet, the demonstration of COVID-19 breakthrough infections among fully vaccinated health-care workers (HCW) in Israel, who in turn may transmit this infection to their patients,5 requires a reassessment of compulsory vaccination policies leading to the job dismissal of unvaccinated HCW in the USA. Indeed, there is growing evidence that peak viral titres in the upper airways of the lungs and culturable virus are similar in vaccinated and unvaccinated individuals.2,3,5–7"

DEFINE_ME

People will be waiting until Jesus' second coming to aquire herd immunity, even if the population has a 100% vaccination rate with the current COVID vaccine's on offer.

Hazelelponi said:

Herd immunity is only possible with vaccine preventable disease, which the current COVID vaccine's are not, because immunity prevents community spread.

"Herd immunity (or community immunity) occurs when a high percentage of the community is immune to a disease (through vaccination and/or prior illness), making the spread of this disease from person to person unlikely. Even individuals not vaccinated (such as newborns and the immunocompromised) are offered some protection because the disease has little opportunity to spread within the community." Herd immunity - APIC

Our current COVID vaccine's don't prevent spread, as we are now finding out:

"A prospective cohort study in the UK by Anika Singanayagam and colleagues regarding community transmission of SARS-CoV-2 among unvaccinated and vaccinated individuals provides important information that needs to be considered in reassessing vaccination policies. This study showed that the impact of vaccination on community transmission of circulating variants of SARS-CoV-2 appeared to be not significantly different from the impact among unvaccinated people.2, 3 The scientific rationale for mandatory vaccination in the USA relies on the premise that vaccination prevents transmission to others, resulting in a “pandemic of the unvaccinated”.4
Yet, the demonstration of COVID-19 breakthrough infections among fully vaccinated health-care workers (HCW) in Israel, who in turn may transmit this infection to their patients,5 requires a reassessment of compulsory vaccination policies leading to the job dismissal of unvaccinated HCW in the USA. Indeed, there is growing evidence that peak viral titres in the upper airways of the lungs and culturable virus are similar in vaccinated and unvaccinated individuals.2,3,5–7"

DEFINE_ME

People will be waiting until Jesus' second coming to aquire herd immunity, even if the population has a 100% vaccination rate with the current COVID vaccine's on offer.

Click to expand...

The vaccine would have worked and provided immunity pre-Delta, but people decided not to vaccinate which led us to Delta and beyond.

nm

Bramblewild said:

A claim without one ounce of support. But, hey, if finger pointing makes you feel good, or superior...

Click to expand...

We could start in the beginnings with fools refusing to wear masks in indoor spaces back in 2020. The unmasked getting into confrontations with front desk people, or still gathering in large groups, unmasked...or didn't you keep up with this in 2020? They too were part of the problem and continued the spread.

public hermit said:

What about the common good? What about putting others before yourself? What about considering the interests of others before your own? These are all biblical principles, but you seem to want to sacrifice them for some idea of personal freedom.

Click to expand...

What about God? There’s too much focus on the virus and politics. It’s almost obsessive. I don’t know about you but we aren’t discussing it. No taps on the shoulder about the virus, vaccine, or political parties.

This isn’t His first rodeo and won’t be the last. We’re expected to keep our eyes on Him in spite of what’s happening around us. When you physically lift up your head to the heavens you’ll grasp a lot of the verbiage in the psalms. Your vision is dominated by holy sight. The rest shrinks and is barely visible.

If we cast our care there’d be little to complain or worry about. This is becoming a hobby for some. There are more important issues we could focus on that display our faith.

Like the food shortages. How can you aid your neighbors and those in need? What skills can you share or teach that will increase their self-suffiency? Are you willing to learn some too?

Rising inflation has a domino effect. Tent cities are growing. We’re needed. But we’re too busy debating and taking sides to notice. Many have moved on or were forced to due to circumstances. They’re not pondering this. They have real life concerns to worry about.

We should follow suit. Get back to doing the things that distinguished us from the rest.

This isn’t directed to you of course.

bèlla said:

What about God?

Click to expand...

I don't think focus on God and concern for the common good are mutually exclusive. To the contrary, if we are focused on God, concern for the interests of others should flow from that.

bèlla said:

There’s too much focus on the virus and politics. It’s almost obsessive.

Click to expand...

Agreed.

bèlla said:

Like the food shortages. How can you aid your neighbors and those in need? What skills can you share or teach that will increase their self-suffiency? Are you willing to learn some too?

Rising inflation has a domino effect. Tent cities are growing. We’re needed. But we’re too busy debating and taking sides to notice. Many have moved on or were forced to due to circumstances. They’re not pondering this. They have real life concerns to worry about

Click to expand...

Exactly. This all falls under the umbrella of concern for the interests of others and the common good. If Christians are going to be focused on themselves and their freedom to disregard the lives of those around them, none of these issues will be helped by us either. The church in this country presents just like the rest of the country with the exception of some claimed beliefs, but we are too often exacerbating our common problems instead of bringing change and hope into a world we've been tasked to serve by proclaiming Christ in word and deed.

There is no doubt that many individual Christians are getting it right. But we are disorganized, partisan, and leave little to admire and seek as a group. And, it's our own fault. Too many American Christians still haven't figured out that America isn't the Kingdom of God, and their Christian and national allegiances are not identical. Since we didn't make the proper distinctions ourselves, they're being made for us, which is painful and unfortunate. All we need is some good old fashioned repentance, as you say, turn to God; do it once again and be the church.

bèlla said:

Get back to doing the things that distinguished us from the rest

Click to expand...

Agreed.

bèlla said:

This isn’t directed to you of course

Click to expand...

Oh, no worries. I always appreciate your insight.