Am I doomed?

Hey guys I am unable to answer your responses now, but I will get back on the computer some time this week and answer them. I'm not on my computer now, and I don't have the time to devote to this conversation. I'm not ignoring you. I will get back to this discussion.

Thanks,
Boomygrrl

Ok good...glad to see you are still around...hope to hear from you soon.

Boomygrrl said:

I became a Christian when I was 7 years old. I was raised Southern Baptist. I used to believe Jesus was my savior, that he died on the cross for my and our sins, I asked Jesus to be my lord and savior, and asked God to forgive me. Ten years later, I started reading apologetics to try to convert my then boyfriend, who was atheist. The more I started thinking about Christianity, studying it more, reading the apologetics for it, the more I started to doubt it and became very skeptical. Throughout the years, I've been studying it more and praying, but ironically I've drifted further and further away. Instead of being more sure, I'm more confused. I am now almost 35 years old and have been struggling with this for over half my life. I went from full faith, loving God, dedicated...to confused, skeptical. I don't believe that Jesus is God or my savior anymore and I have doubts about God, although I wouldn't say I'm atheist. Perhaps there is a higher power that created us.

That's my background info. I've been searching and searching and haven't gotten closer to God in the process. I'm getting to the point of giving up, because it isn't looking better, it's looking worse (in the perspective of re-converting to Christianity). So, here's my question:

Would the following prayer be good enough for God?

"Dear God, I'm not so sure if you really exist. I wish I knew. If I knew you existed, I would want to get to know you and follow your plan for me. I'm not sure if there is a plan for me--to follow Christ, to follow Mohammed, to follow someone else. I wish I could follow my heart, but it leads me nowhere. If I follow my brain, as I now perceive things to be, then I cannot believe/follow you. If you are out there, please give me some guidance and direction. If you are real, then I hope you know me better than I know myself and can touch me in a way that will leave me no doubt what to believe and what to do. Thank you."

If this prayer isn't good enough, then I am doomed. I cannot believe what I do not believe.


Boomygrrl

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I agree with newlamb. If there was no hope for you, you wouldn't be concerned that there is no hope for you.

All of us have doubts and all of us have crises in our faith at sometime in our lives. Now, it's just your turn.

I backslid for several years before I came back to God. In that time, I can't say that I didn't believe in God, but I certainly wasn't living for Him. In fact, in a lot of ways, I was actually worse than before I got saved in the first place.

The good news for people like me and you is that our lives and our salvation don't depend on our faith, but on God's faithfulness and He is faithful.

Can I give you seven reasons why you can be confident that God still holds you in His hands?

1. Nothing can separate you from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus your Lord.

For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come, Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. (Romans 8:38-39)
Neither death nor anything that happens after death, or anything that happens while you're living can separate you from God's love. If there were no other verse in the Bible that deals with eternal security, this one covers the base.


2. When you are saved, you are made perfect forever.

For by one offering He [Jesus] hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified. (Hebrews 10:14)
When Jesus died on the cross, He saved you forever. Jesus offered one sacrifice for sin forever. If you ever lost your salvation, in order for you to be saved again, Jesus would have to die again. By one offering He has perfected forever those who were sanctified.


3. Our Lord always finishes what He begins.

Being confident of this very thing, that He [God] which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ. (Philippians 1:6)
Let me tell you what the Holy Spirit of God does for your salvation. First, He convicted you of sin. Second, He converted you. And the Convictor and the Converter is also the Completer. If God fails to finish what He's begun God has failed and He cannot fail.


4. You are predestined to be like Jesus.

For whom He [God] did foreknow, He also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of His Son, that He might be the firstborn among many brethren. (Romans 8:29)
God saw you before this world was put in space. He saw you repent of your sin and ask Jesus to save you. And when God saw that, not only did He foreknow it, but also He predestinated it. If it is settled in eternity how can it be undone in time?


5. You are in Christ.

Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new. (2 Corinthians 5:17)
You are in Christ just like Noah was in the ark. The ark was a picture of Jesus and when Noah went into that ark God shut the door. Noah may have fallen down a lot of times in that ark, but he never fell out of it. Your security is not in a place, it is in a Person and His name is Jesus. And if you're in Jesus, you're secure and if you're not in Jesus you're not secure.


6. You already have eternal life.

Heareth My word, and believeth on him that sent Me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life. (John 5:24)

Everlasting life is not something you get when you die. Everlasting life is something you get when you receive Jesus. If I have everlasting life, when can it end? Suppose I had it 10 years and it ended. Did I have everlasting life? No, I had a 10-year life. Whatever you have, if you ever lose it, whatever it was it wasn't everlasting.


7. The Lord Jesus Christ is ever interceding for you.

I pray for them: I pray not for the world, but for them which thou hast given Me; for they are Thine. (John 17:9)
Jesus also prayed: "I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil...Neither pray I for these alone, but for them also which shall believe on me through their word" (John 17:15, 20). Say your name in that verse because Jesus prayed for you! Has Jesus ever prayed a prayer that wasn't answered? No, not one (see John 11:42 and Hebrews 7:25).

You say that you were a Christian. Did you know that God has promised us that the work He started in you when you were seven years old will be made complete?

I believe that's what is happening to you now. I believe that God is nudging you to let Him finish that work.

Now, you say that you're searching for God and it's obvious that you are diligently seeking God.

In what ways are you seeking God? What are you doing to find God in your life?

I hope that you will feel welcome to PM me if you'd like to talk privately.

John 6:39-40 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. 40And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day.

Boomygrrl, Jesus said He would not lose even one person that God had given Him. So at the time that you excepted Jesus as your Savior you became one of Jesus people that He would never lose. So even through you are back sliding at the moment you still belong to Him.
Think of this, if a parent truly loves their child, do they disown that child everytime they act up. No they do not. They love the child and never would think about letting them go.
I also think you are trying too hard with your apologetic studies. As Jesus says:

Rev. 2:4 Nevertheless I have somewhat against thee, because thou hast left thy first love.

Go back to your first love. Go back and remember what first made you fall in love with Christ and give yourself to Him.
Besides maybe being an apologetist is not your gift. Jesus may have given you another gift (see Romans 12:6-8).
I too thought I could be an apologetist and as hard as I tried I just couldn't do it. But I have found that I am a good encourager and very empathetic to the moods of others so now I spend most of my endevors in those areas and have found myself growing closer to God everyday.

I hope this helped.
May God bless you and enlighten you path,
Glen

newlamb said:

I don't think you're doomed, Boomygrrl - you ask too many questions and are seeking too hard to be doomed.

Sometimes we let our heads get too wrapped in apologetics. Have you, for instance, tried reading a book by a Christian author about some subject you might be interested in. There are several good writers out there and instead of reading from a critical viewpoint, read about an issue from a faith perspective. My stepdaughter has found this to be helpful. She kept complaining about her lack of faith, but insisted on reading authors like Crossen, Spong, et. al. I invited her to read some books by Charles Stanley and her faith is increasing.

Fill your mind with stuff that's helpful, not skeptical stuff. Don't worry about your prayer yet. Just tell God that you're looking around, you haven't rejected him, could he please help you to increase your knowledge of him that leads to faith.

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Thank you for your kind words. I am hoping that God will take into consideration that I am really trying.

Yes, I have read books by Christian authors.

Boomygrrl

£amb said:

Here's another prayer I just thought of on the spur of the moment:
God, I am having a hard time with my doubts. Help me with my unbelief. I do not know what plan you have for my life, but I am willing to put in your hands and into your will. I have tried to follow my own wisdom, and it's not leading me to where I need to be. I am willing to put my trust into you and ask for you to give me the knowledge and wisdom I need at this moment. God, I ask that you take me and mold me into the person you want to use me for. I can not do this on my own so I ask that you guide me into the direction you want me to go.

And no, you're not doomed. You're reaching out.

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Thank you.


Boomygrrl

hlaltimus said:

Quote: "...If you are out there, please give me some guidance and direction. If you are real, then I hope you know me better than I know myself and can touch me in a way that will leave me no doubt what to believe and what to do. Thank you."

This is a real good prayer, but think back when we were all kids. If we had a need that only a being superior to us could meet, (our Mom or Dad,) we just cried out for them to come to our aid. This worked most of the time, but not always. Eventually we learned that if we really wanted Mom's help then we would just have to track her down and find out what room she was in and then, in the place where she was, be able to present our petition to her. If you want God to manifest Himself to you, He may truly grant this in a gracious way right where you are now as He is a gracious God. If after a lengthy period of time you seem to be speaking to yourself, think back what you would have done when you were a little girl. You must go to the particular place, then, where He can be found. He is there, there are just too many millions of answers to otherwise impossible prayers that became possible for it to be accounted for by any other explanation. Get up from where you are and go to the kind of place in which the God of Truth would be found. If He is the God of Truth, then you will never find Him in a lie.

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Thank you. I've been trying to find God for 17 years now.
Any suggestions on "the kind of place in which God of Truth would be found"? I've read the bible a lot, gone to church, talked to Christians, prayed, listened to Christian radio, read apologetics. Any other ideas?


Boomygrrl

thepianist said:

...The problems you have had with doubting your salvation, Jesus, God, etc., are definitely something the devil loves. After all, if you don't know for sure what is going on with your spiritual life - then there is absolutely no way you can be a witness for the Lord. If you will just look back and rely on that faith you stepped out on as a little girl, you will be much better off. One thing I have learned is that the more we use our 'little' brains to try and figure God out, the worse things can become for us. Also, like I said, the kind of problem you have been trying to deal with completely destroys anything we could try to do for the Master.

My prayer is that God's spirit will prick your heart, help you realize that you still belong to Him and that you will get your life back on the right track.

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Thanks for the prayer. I also have doubts about the devil. I like using my "little" brain...it gave me a 4.0 in graduate school and has kept me from getting into a lot of trouble. I am an analytical person...it's just me.


Boomygrrl

dws391 said:

Perhaps your doubts and struggles are maybe just maybe the Holy Spirit convicting you and showing you that God is still there and wants you to come back to him. The Prodigal son went away and wasted what his father had given him but when he finally returned he found a loving father still there, welcoming him back and giving him more.

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If that's true, then I long for my reunion.

Thanks,
Boomygrrl

food4thought said:

You sound like you have read tons of stuff about the faith, but have you really dedicated yourself to studying the source of our faith? Your answers won't be found in apologetics, but in the Bible. If you will spend time prayerfully studying what God has wrote about Himself as opposed to what others have wrote about Him, you will be far more likely to reach the type of communication with Him that you need.

I hope this helps.

Hebrews 11:6 "But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him."

Don't seek what others have to say about Him, seek what He has to say about Himself!!!

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Thanks for the advice. I have read the bible, and a lot. When I was age 7 to 16, I read with faith. Now, I read with skepticism. I wish I had that faith. I have difficulty believing the bible is the word of God.


Boomygrrl

whitestar said:

I guess I would have to ask you...what excatly is it that made you doubt in the first place? Some lack of evidence that the bible is God's word? Lack of evidence in Jesus...what? There is so much evidence now for the bible and for Jesus and what He did...I don't see how that could cause any doubts.

Or was it something else? Some scriptures you have struggled with? There was some 'key' moment at that time in your life back then, then did something to you...try to remember what it was and post it. Something happened, didn't it, that shook your faith?

Maybe it was something as simple as seeing alot of people on the news that died in an earthquake..and your unbelieving boyfriend saying...If there was a God, why would He let something so horrible like this happen?"

Or reading the OT...the wrath of God and not understanding why...but something clicked to 'off' and you are struggling to get it back on...right?

I know excatly how you feel if that is it...

God bless
WhiteStar

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I haven't found evidence to suggest that the bible is the word of God. People tell me it is, but that's not evidence. Is there evidence? I'd love to read about it.

I remember that when I was a Christian (and thereafter when I read the bible), I really hate much of the anti-woman rhetoric from Paul. That bothered me, but that's not what made me lose my faith. I was willing to ignore what Paul had to say about women's roles and still maintain my faith. Whether that was a good thing or not, I don't know.

Apologetics lead me away from my faith and using critical thought. The more I read about the arguments for Christianity, the more I could see holes in the arguments, which made me question it more. The more I questioned, the more I realized that the answers were not there or they were not well thought out. I lost my faith by questioning, that's for sure. I sometimes wish that I just had the faith...it's so much easier. The lifestyle wasn't easier, as I went to church several times a week, prayed at least once a day but usually more, read the bible everyday. But I also had faith that God was watching over me and loved me, and I had great fellowship with Christians (friends/family/youth group/choir/mission trips). My brain is working over time now, trying to figure things out; whereas before I had just believed...that simple. So, that's what I mean by things were much easier.


Boomygrrl

whitestar said:

...Maybe it was something as simple as seeing alot of people on the news that died in an earthquake..and your unbelieving boyfriend saying...If there was a God, why would He let something so horrible like this happen?"

Or reading the OT...the wrath of God and not understanding why...but something clicked to 'off' and you are struggling to get it back on...right?

I know excatly how you feel if that is it...

God bless
WhiteStar

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No, I didn't give much thought to what was going on in the news back then. Earthquakes and such didn't cross my mind that God was doing something or not doing something about it. My unbelieving boyfriend was about as unaware of events back then as I was. We were teenagers, carefree.

The Old Testament wrath of God didn't make me lose my faith at the time. I didn't really give much thought to it. I saw the Flood story as God protecting Noah and the animals and didn't give much thought to the women, children, and babies who drowned. When I got older, I reread the bible and actually at that time I read the whole bible. This was after I lost faith and it helped seal the deal for awhile that this God, if he exists, cannot be loved and worshipped. But I pretty much thought he didn't exist. Instead I was wondering why people would believe this about their God.

Boomygrrl

Johnnz said:

Feel free to PM if you have any questions about Christianity that are really bothering you.

Have you read some good Christian apologists Francis Schaeffer, Ravi Zacharias, C S Lewis, James Sire, os Guiness are some?

Apologetics is a valid presentation of the reasonableness of a Christian worldview. It is one component of a reasonable and reasoned belief. Christian evidence, testimony, the reliability of the scriptures and its message are other bases for Christian belief to supplement the apologetic approach.

John
NZ

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C.S. Lewis...yes, I've read his "Mere Christianity."
I've heard a little about Zacharias. I haven't heard of Francis Schaeffer, James Sire, or Guiness. Thanks for the referrals.


Boomygrrl

Key said:

Ok I am impressed.
Now, please work with me a moment.
You have read these books, and yet they lead to you loosing faith?

Or was your "Loss of Faith" triggred by something out side of "Study"?



Church never brought be Closer to Christ, Church gave me a place to Go, to feel like I belong to a "Body"
I grew Close to Christ in a Private relationship.



Wow, Quite some family there.
What do you think yoru father would say?
Now I am not asking you to ask your father, but I am asking you, if I was to say what you said to your father, what do you think he would have said to me?



Well that is a Good Foundation.
Funny, I am a Believer, and yet if you asked what My Religion is really, I do not think for the life of me, I could even explain it.
I think the Idea of "Christanity" or the Chatch phases that go with it, are really lacking in the depth of what the belief is. It's more then a Book, and a Man, and some obscure places.

It's Life.



Funny how people like to .. as it said "Bounce the Ball in the other persons court"

basicly, the idea, "If I don't believe, it's all Gods Fault" now I am not saying that you are saying that word for word, but the idea as it's core is the same.

Ok, Lets talk a moment now.

You have read the Apologetics books. So, truth be told, can we be, if God is not?

Really, can we?

I am not talking about any "One Religion" I am talking about a "God" can, we be, if there is no "Creator" really. From what you have learned and gained in your life, can it be?

I would love to hear your responce and then we can talk about that.

But still, as a Former Believer, if I Asked you the same question your OP asked me.

What would you have said?

I look foward to your responce as always.

God Bless
Key.

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I explained that apologetics didn't help me. It's not your fault. My response to someone else's post was not up when you wrote this. Please refer to that post.

In the past, I thought I did have a private relationship with Jesus Christ, with the whole trinity. I really did.

I'm not bouncing the ball, I am just about to give up...that's all.

Can we be if God isn't? Sure. But it is nice to think there is a God that started this off, but I wasn't there when the world came to be. I am not a science expert, and I really don't want to debate evolution in this thread.

I'm not sure I'm understanding what I'm supposed to ask my father and what he would say. Also, I don't understand what I'm supposed to answer from the OP that I asked you.

Boomygrrl

Boomygrrl said:

No, I didn't give much thought to what was going on in the news back then. Earthquakes and such didn't cross my mind that God was doing something or not doing something about it. My unbelieving boyfriend was about as unaware of events back then as I was. We were teenagers, carefree.

The Old Testament wrath of God didn't make me lose my faith at the time. I didn't really give much thought to it. I saw the Flood story as God protecting Noah and the animals and didn't give much thought to the women, children, and babies who drowned. When I got older, I reread the bible and actually at that time I read the whole bible. This was after I lost faith and it helped seal the deal for awhile that this God, if he exists, cannot be loved and worshipped. But I pretty much thought he didn't exist. Instead I was wondering why people would believe this about their God.

Boomygrrl

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Ok...so would you say you just drifted away from God then? I guess I am confused because the way you posted it sounded like your faith was well grounded, then one day poof, it was gone...which made me think something had happened.

What was it you were wondering why people would believe what about God? I didn't understand that part of your reply there...sorry...

And why do you say God cannot be loved or woshipped? He obivously is. Or are you saying people shouldn't love or woship Him?

mylittlelambs said:

Some people over think things. It is good to be curious but seems you talked yourself out of believing in God. Maybe you should rethink your relationship with an Athiest. Maybe the Devil is trying to take you down. Just keep praying and you will see the truth.

Samantha

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My relationship with the atheist boy was when I was 17. I'm no longer dating him now. I'm almost 35 years old. I am now dating a nice Roman Catholic boy...er, man. He believes in God and Jesus. He's a Christian but I wouldn't call him devout.
Not so sure I believe there is a devil.

Boomygrrl

Edial (from post 20)

Sorry for not responding back in a timely manner. you're right, that if all I did was ask questions and not try to actively answer my questions, then that wouldn't be good. I have talked to mature Christians. I had repented to Jesus when I was younger. I still ask God for forgiveness during those moments I think there is a God and that he might be listening to me. I am not perfect, that's for sure. Usually, I try to work out my "sinful" side by learning from my mistakes, asking people who I have wronged to forgive me, and find better ways to solve my problems that doesn't involve hurting people. I'm actually a goody-two shoes for the most part. I won't lie...I'm not "perfect," and I have done wrong, but this isn't about pride, if that's what you're implying.

I'm not trying to search other religions. I just want to believe in reality. I made the remark about Mohammed, because if Islam is true, then yes, I want to believe it. I seriously doubt it's true. I did investigate Unitarianism for awhile...I didn't like it. I was hoping it would be like it's founders in the 1800's. Instead, it was an "anything goes" type of religion. I didn't like that I went to a church that didn't pray to God...that didn't make sense.

Never implied Christ lied. In fact, the "Lord, Liar, Lunatic" argument isn't convincing. Perhaps the writers of the bible lied or embellished. That comes closer to what I believe, actually. Jesus said some great things, most of it at least. I have no problem with Jesus, by the way. But, as of now, I do see him as a man, not God.


Boomygrrl

whitestar said:

Ok...so would you say you just drifted away from God then? I guess I am confused because the way you posted it sounded like your faith was well grounded, then one day poof, it was gone...which made me think something had happened.

What was it you were wondering why people would believe what about God? I didn't understand that part of your reply there...sorry...

And why do you say God cannot be loved or woshipped? He obivously is. Or are you saying people shouldn't love or woship Him?

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17 or so years ago (when I was 17...I'm almost 35 now), I started questioning Christianity. It wasn't overnight. In fact, I am still trying to figure things out. It was/still is a slow process. I haven't made any decisions, such as "there is no God," or "Christianity has to be wrong." I just seriously doubt it. I want to know for sure. I don't think there really is a way to know one way or the other. So, I studied, analyzed, came to conclusions, maybe good ones, maybe bad ones, but I have given this almost 18 years of thought...believe me.
I was wondering why people would want to worship a God who tortured and killed everyone (except Noah and his family). I don't understand how people can look at how God's behaviors are depicted in the bible (concerning many of the OT atrocities) and think this is good. That is actually for another debate, and I don't want to debate it...as that wasn't what made me question God originally...that came much later, after I thought "if there is a God, I don't think the bible depicted him well at all."


Boomygrrl

Thanks to all who have replied. I hope my replies will help engage this discussion even further. I apologize for my slow responses, and then for my many responses in a row. Unfortunately, my access to my computer is very limited (due to work, bad internet connections, and I do want a social life from time to time). So, I will continue with the discussion. Please forgive me in advance if I take longer than a day or two to respond.
I look forward to your responses.


Boomygrrl

Thanks to all who have replied. I hope my replies will help engage this discussion even further. I apologize for my slow responses, and then for my many responses in a row. Unfortunately, my access to my computer is very limited (due to work, bad internet connections, and I do want a social life from time to time). So, I will continue with the discussion. Please forgive me in advance if I take longer than a day or two to respond.
I look forward to your responses.


Boomygrrl