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Okay.The two greatest None Divine Theologians in the Bible are Moses and Paul. Both are referred to by name. It is common to read the Torah and say... In Moses, or to read the 13 epistles of Paul and say... when reading Paul.
Both of these men are highly esteemed by YH-H. Of all the things they said, to say, what defining characteristic did they say that made them special in God's eyes, what did they say?
I would be cursed and cutoff from You God, if you would just Save these people. God says: "For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.”
I once knew a woman that esteemed her salvation above others. I feared for her.
Yes, Satan's never ran things or had complete control. God's only allowed him, for a time, the freedom to spread evil, just as He allows us to wallow in it, or, in our case, to choose good instead as He shows that to us.And Jesus came up and spoke to them, saying, “All authority has been given to Me in heaven and on earth. Go therefore and make disciples of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and the Son and the Holy Spirit, teaching them to keep all that I commanded you; and behold, I am with you always, even to the end of the age.”
— Matthew 28:18-20
Hopefully this clears up the confusion that Satan is currently running things.
Do you believe that God' has a single thing to do with Satan's evil (Did God do that evil through Satan?), other than God's blessed Provision of Individual Autonomous Free Moral Agency to Creation?Yes, Satan's never ran things or had complete control. God's only allowed him, for a time, the freedom to spread evil, just as He allows us to wallow in it, or, in our case, to choose good instead as He shows that to us.
What will happen to me if I don't Repent (Change my Mind) from the ways of my Carnal understanding to the Provisions of God?Example:
Our judicial system, Police and courts, are the ultimate authority in our society. That doesn't mean people do not break the law - nor does it mean when someone breaks the law it is ordained by the authority.
God is and always has had all authority in heaven and earth. From the very beginning men were disobedient to God's Authority.
Starting in the Garden itself -
Romans 5:19 19 For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous.God's design and will for mankind was not that he would fall - but He did make plans if he did.
Time and time again throughout the Old Testament we see God's Authority being completely disobeyed.
Deut 28:15 “But it shall come to pass, if you do not obey the voice of the Lord your God, to observe carefully all His commandments and His statutes which I command you today, that all these curses will come upon you and overtake you:In other words - if you do not follow the authority of God - this is what is going to happen
| 3341. metanoia ► |
| Strong's Concordance metanoia: change of mind, repentance Original Word: μετάνοια, ας, ἡPart of Speech: Noun, Feminine Transliteration: metanoia Phonetic Spelling: (met-an'-oy-ah) Definition: change of mind, repentance |
There are two threads on that subject already - please post there.What will happen to me if I don't Repent (Change my Mind) from the ways of my Carnal understanding to the Provisions of God?
3341. metanoia ►
Strong's Concordance
metanoia: change of mind, repentanceOriginal Word: μετάνοια, ας, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: metanoia
Phonetic Spelling: (met-an'-oy-ah)
Definition: change of mind, repentance
It was a rhetorical question. Not meant to confuse, but bolster your point. :Fwouny Face:There are two threads on that subject already - please post there.
No moral evil, aka "sin", the worst kind, could ever exist unless God granted free will to certain created beings. That particular good: freedom, is the source of evil. There exists no such evil in God and the only sane reason for Him allowing evil is for us to finally come to hate it as we come to identity and value, and so choose, with that same freedom, good instead, good over evil. To choose Him instead, the ultimate Good.Do you believe that God' has a single thing to do with Satan's evil (Did God do that evil through Satan?), other than God's blessed Provision of Individual Autonomous Free Moral Agency to Creation?
fhansen, my friend... I fully agree with you.No moral evil, aka "sin", the worst kind, could ever exist unless God granted free will to certain certain created beings. That particular good: freedom, is the source of evil. There exists no such evil in God and the only sane reason for Him allowing evil is for us to finally come to hate it as we come to identity and value, and so choose, with that same freedom, good instead, good over evil. To choose Him instead, the ultimate Good.
You’ve already indicated that you don’t believe God can stop sin, which means you don’t believe He can intervene in any real sense. So we may just be too far apart in our views.Example:
Our judicial system, Police and courts, are the ultimate authority in our society. That doesn't mean people do not break the law - nor does it mean when someone breaks the law it is ordained by the authority.
God is and always has had all authority in heaven and earth. From the very beginning men were disobedient to God's Authority.
Starting in the Garden itself -
Romans 5:19 19 For as by one man’s disobedience many were made sinners, so also by one Man’s obedience many will be made righteous.God ordained that man would live in the garden - not fall from grace
Time and time again throughout the Old Testament we see God's Authority being completely disobeyed.
Deut 28:15 “But it shall come to pass, if you do not obey the voice of the Lord your God, to observe carefully all His commandments and His statutes which I command you today, that all these curses will come upon you and overtake you:God ordained that man be obedient to him - not that man would live in disobedience.
Exo 5:5 Afterward Moses and Aaron went in and told Pharaoh, “Thus says the Lord God of Israel: ‘Let My people go, that they may hold a feast to Me in the wilderness.’ ”2 And Pharaoh said, “Who is the Lord, that I should obey His voice to let Israel go? I do not know the Lord, nor will I let Israel go.”In other words he is doing the OPPOSITE of what God's authority - God ordained His people to be set free - not held hostage
Matt 23:7“O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, the one who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, but you were not willing!God ordained His children gathered together - His Children did the opposite of what God ordained.
I can continue - there are hundreds of instances where what God ordained was not accomplished.
Okay, who was responsible for the destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD?Often or usually or at this point, it is not one isolated statement .......
rather it is the sum total, the overall gist of your content ...... the purpose is not clear to me, and some of the underlying appearances , whether right or wrong thus needed clarifying,
are of a trying to defend or to promote a doctrinal way that is man's way/ device
and not ...... not 'other' ....... I have not a word for here yet.....
Then please show in scripture any place where it contextually show that God prevented sin. I believe with all my heart God intervenes - but He never circumvents man's will. If He did - we would still be in the garden.You’ve already indicated that you don’t believe God can stop sin, which means you don’t believe He can intervene in any real sense. So we may just be too far apart in our views.
Now Abraham journeyed from there toward the land of the Negev, and settled between Kadesh and Shur; then he sojourned in Gerar. Abraham said of Sarah his wife, “She is my sister.” So Abimelech king of Gerar sent and took Sarah. But God came to Abimelech in a dream of the night, and said to him, “Behold, you are a dead man because of the woman whom you have taken, for she is married.” Now Abimelech had not come near her; and he said, “Lord, will You slay a nation, even though blameless? Did he not himself say to me, ‘She is my sister’? And she herself said, ‘He is my brother.’ In the integrity of my heart and the innocence of my hands I have done this.” Then God said to him in the dream, “Yes, I know that in the integrity of your heart you have done this, and I also kept you from sinning against Me; therefore I did not let you touch her.Then please show in scripture any place where it contextually show that God prevented sin. I believe with all my heart God intervenes - but He never circumvents man's will. If He did - we would still be in the garden.
Are these just random, or do they pertain to the OP in some way?A couple verses come to mind
Psalm 131:131 Lord, my heart is not haughty, Nor my eyes lofty. Neither do I concern myself with great matters, Nor with things too profound for me.
1 Corinthians 4:3 But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged by you or by a human court. In fact, I do not even judge myself.
4 For I know of nothing against myself, yet I am not justified by this; but He who judges me is the Lord. 5 Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord comes, who will both bring to light the hidden things of darkness and reveal the counsels of the hearts. Then each one’s praise will come from God.
Ecclesiastes 12:1 And moreover, because the Preacher was wise, he still taught the people knowledge; yes, he pondered and sought out and set in order many proverbs.
10 The Preacher sought to find acceptable words; and what was written was upright—words of truth.
11 The words of the wise are like goads, and the words of scholars are like well-driven nails, given by one Shepherd. 12 And further, my son, be admonished by these. Of making many books there is no end, and much study is wearisome to the flesh.
13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter:
Fear God and keep His commandments,
For this is man’s all.
14 For God will bring every work into judgment,
Including every secret thing,
Whether good or evil.
I thought I would add them for consideration for the discussion. It's not aimed at anyone in particular. I think we get sidetracked with the wrong speech and judgment sometimes. For example, and this isnt aimed at you, people slander politicians but according to Romans 13 and Titus 3 this slander is wrong. In that example we got involved in the wrong speech.Are these just random, or do they pertain to the OP in some way?
I don’t see their relevance to the discussion. What am I missing?I thought I would add them for consideration for the discussion. It's not aimed at anyone in particular. I think we get sidetracked with the wrong speech and judgment sometimes. For example, and this isnt aimed at you, people slander politicians but according to Romans 13 and Titus 3 this slander is wrong. In that example we got involved in the wrong speech.
Here’s another example of God using His authority.
Now the Spirit of Yahweh departed from Saul, and an evil spirit from Yahweh terrorized him.
— 1 Samuel 16:14
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