All authority

[Hammster]

I have. Who handed Jesus over to the Romans?

Maybe you didn’t read further.

When they came to the place called The Skull, there they [the Romans] crucified Him and the criminals, one on the right and the other on the left. But Jesus was saying, “Father, forgive them; for they do not know what they are doing.” And they cast lots, dividing up His garments among themselves.
— Luke 23:33-34

The Romans carried out the crucifixion.

 

[Aviel]

Not against the rules.

It not against the rules to post whatever theology you want.. to post../??

Is there any theology that is not allowed here?

It was still about the Romans.

Jesus was not sent to the Romans, as they are gentiles.
He (Jesus the Jew).... was sent to house of Israel.... = the Jews.

Will be. Not are. In the end, all those in Israel will be believers. But not today.

Not all Gentiles are believers.
No all Jews are Messianic.

This is the New Covenant.

The New Covenant, is the New Testament.
This is literally "The Cross of Christ" as The Blood Atonement.

 

[Grip Docility]

Maybe you didn’t read further.

When they came to the place called The Skull, there they [the Romans] crucified Him and the criminals, one on the right and the other on the left. But Jesus was saying, “Father, forgive them; for they do not know what they are doing.” And they cast lots, dividing up His garments among themselves.
— Luke 23:33-34

The Romans carried out the crucifixion.

Can you show me a text that forensically assigns the Romans and not the Jews who handed Jesus over to be Crucified that reveals the Mind of Christ when He spoke those words?

 

[Hammster]

Can you show me a text that forensically assigns the Romans and not the Jews who handed Jesus over to be Crucified that reveals the Mind of Christ when He spoke those words?

This isn’t discussing who handed Him over. It’s discussing who carried out the crucifixion. It’s right there in the text. If you want to make a textual argument that the Jews carried out the crucifixion, I’ll entertain it.

 

[Grip Docility]

This isn’t discussing who handed Him over. It’s discussing who carried out the crucifixion. It’s right there in the text. If you want to make a textual argument that the Jews carried out the crucifixion, I’ll entertain it.

This would be a unique passage of scripture because Paul has bound the work on the cross to all humanity and beyond, per Colossians 1:20. Can you forensically rebut Paul's statement, thus reducing the scope of the Crucifixion to only the people present at the crucifixion?

 

[Hammster]

This would be a unique passage of scripture because Paul has bound the work on the cross to all humanity and beyond, per Colossians 1:20. Can you forensically rebut Paul's statement, thus reducing the scope of the Crucifixion to only the people present at the crucifixion?

That’s outside the scope of this thread.

 

[Grip Docility]

This isn’t discussing who handed Him over. It’s discussing who carried out the crucifixion. It’s right there in the text. If you want to make a textual argument that the Jews carried out the crucifixion, I’ll entertain it.

I can forensically bind Jesus statement to the Jews, from Acts. I was wondering if you would manifest the passage.

Acts 3:17 “Now, fellow Israelites, I know that you acted in ignorance, as did your leaders. 18 But this is how God fulfilled what he had foretold through all the prophets, saying that his Messiah would suffer. 19 Repent, then, and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped out, that times of refreshing may come from the Lord,

"They know not what they do".

 

[Grip Docility]

That’s outside the scope of this thread.

"All authority" OP title. Mercy is God's Highest form of "Exercising" Authority.

I disagree. It is demonstrating God's mercy, which would be His Highest self proclaimed act of Authority. This thread is about God's authority. Is mercy not an act of "Authority"? Jesus says; He desires "Mercy" not Sacrifice. He contrasts the Judgmental and Merciless hearts of the Christ rejecting Pharisees, though some accepted Him, with His very precepts. He calls the Hateful towards humanity Pharisees "Murderers".

Christ is given all Judgment, yet states that He judges no one, though if He did, it would be righteous. I would say that this is within the scope of "Authority". Unless, you don't recognize God's Mercy as an act of authority?

 

[Hammster]

I can forensically bind Jesus statement to the Jews, from Acts. I was wondering if you would manifest the passage.

Acts 3:17 “Now, fellow Israelites, I know that you acted in ignorance, as did your leaders. 18 But this is how God fulfilled what he had foretold through all the prophets, saying that his Messiah would suffer. 19 Repent, then, and turn to God, so that your sins may be wiped out, that times of refreshing may come from the Lord,

"They know not what they do".

So nothing from the actual text?

 

[Hammster]

It is demonstrating God's mercy, which would be His Highest self proclaimed act of Authority.

Where do you get that from?

 

[Grip Docility]

So nothing from the actual text?

Should we then surmise that only the people at Christ's crucifixion are saved?

 

[Hammster]

Should we then surmise that only the people at Christ's crucifixion are saved?

I’ll take that as a no.

 

[Grip Docility]

Where do you get that from?

Matthew 9:13 Cross Ref

Mark 12:29 “The most important one,” answered Jesus, “is this: ‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one.[e] 30 Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’[f] 31 The second is this: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[g] There is no commandment greater than these.”

1 Corinthians 13

James 2

The parable of the Sheep and Goats.

 

[Grip Docility]

I’ll take that as a no.

Reduction of statement intended audience within the Crucifixion is what is being done by saying that Jesus only meant that towards the Romans. This, then, logically means that any statement at the Cross is reduced to only people present at the specific passage. By this logic, "It is Finished", "Debt paid in full", would only be towards the people present at the cross.

If a specific logic is applied to demonstrate one's idea, that logic must hold from all angles. An example was my usage of the word election. You demonstrated the direct Greek word to Gentiles, so, I recognized the Logic in my argument being faulty. The scope of logic that you, yourself are using, should consistently hold from all directions, when applied to your specific argument, should it not?

 

[Hammster]

Matthew 9:13 Cross Ref

Mark 12:29 “The most important one,” answered Jesus, “is this: ‘Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God, the Lord is one.[e] 30 Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.’[f] 31 The second is this: ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’[g] There is no commandment greater than these.”

1 Corinthians 13

James 2

The parable of the Sheep and Goats.

I’m not seeing the self-proclaimed part.

 

[Hammster]

Reduction of statement within the Crucifixion is what is being done by saying that Jesus only meant that towards the Romans. This, then, logically means that any statement at the Cross is reduced to only people present at the specific passage. By this logic, "It is Finished", "Debt paid in full", would only be towards the people present at the cross.

If a specific logic is applied to demonstrate one's idea, that logic must hold from all angles. An example was my usage of the word election. You demonstrated the direct Greek word to Gentiles, so, I recognized the Logic in my argument being faulty. The scope of logic that you, yourself are using, should consistently hold from all directions, when applied to your specific argument, should it not?

The argument was that it was towards the Jews. The text says otherwise.

 

[Grip Docility]

I’m not seeing the self-proclaimed part.

Jesus is God, proclaiming this. Do we disagree in respects to this matter? Is not Jesus, the Incarnation of God, Speaking as the Word that was with God, was God and became flesh?

 

[Grip Docility]

The argument was that it was towards the Jews. The text says otherwise.

Again, you are now establishing that all words spoken at the cross, out loud by Jesus, were only intended to the audience of the cross. Do you desire to apply this logic to all spoken words, from Jesus, at the cross?

 

[Hammster]

Jesus is God, proclaiming this. Do we disagree in respects to this matter? Is not Jesus, the Incarnation of God, Speaking as the Word that was with God, was God and became flesh?

I don’t see Him saying what you say He says, ie that mercy is His highest self-proclaimed act of authority.

 

[Hammster]

Again, you are now establishing that all words spoken at the cross, out loud by Jesus, were only intended to the audience of the cross. Do you desire to apply this logic to all spoken words, from Jesus, at the cross?

Are you sure this is where you want to go with this argument? I’ll let you think about it for a minute.