Alcohol

[Philpy1976]

Under the old covenant the children of Israel were actually told to drink wine (or other fermented drink) as part of the tithe, to celebrate the Lord.

Now, if God never changes, why would he frown upon it now?

To me, it all comes down to motive. Drowning sorrows, escapism, hedonism, deliberate self harm, are all reasons that people (especially youngsters) get drunk every weekend and this is obviously not good.
But a joyful celebration and a sensible attitude to what is consumed is a different matter entirely.

 

[TheDag]

Under the old covenant the children of Israel were actually told to drink wine (or other fermented drink) as part of the tithe, to celebrate the Lord.

Now, if God never changes, why would he frown upon it now?

this has got to be one of the most misquoted verses in the bible ever. The passage says God does not change. It does not say God does not change the rules. Think about it if rules don't change we should still be sacrificing animals and avoiding all other kinds of things. As pointed out already in this thread God changed the way eucharist is done because of the problems that were happening with the way it was. Sure the use of alcohol most certainly is not forbidden which is easily noticeable when Paul tells Timothy to have a little wine for his stomach. Just don't use that verse to justify it.

 

[Philpy1976]

TheDag

You are right, but I only meant that if God had a problem with alcohol, He would never have instructed it's use in celebration to begin with.

 

[.Iona.]

I wish I could avoid it. I think a little is the way to go.

 

[Cactus Jack]

All things in moderation.

 

[jimbattle]

Why would a spirit-filled Christian want the poison called alcohol in their body? And why would they want to even get a slight buzz off of it? I can't imagine Jesus or the apostles getting a little high on alcohol to relax and feel good. Can you?

Isa 65:8 ¶ Thus saith the LORD, As the new wine is found in the cluster, and one saith, Destroy it not; for a blessing is in it: so will I do for my servants' sakes, that I may not destroy them all.

If it's still in the "cluster" of grapes, then it's grape juice. But the Bible called it "wine". So this verse proves that the word "wine" in the Bible is not always talikng about an alcoholic beverage.

Feel free to contact with with any further questions at The Truth about Addictions & Programs.

Jim Battle

 

[jimbattle]

Why would a spirit-filled Christian want the poison called alcohol in their body? And why would they want to even get a slight buzz off of it? I can't imagine Jesus or the apostles getting a little high on alcohol to relax and feel good. Can you?

Isa 65:8 ¶ Thus saith the LORD, As the new wine is found in the cluster, and one saith, Destroy it not; for a blessing is in it: so will I do for my servants' sakes, that I may not destroy them all.


If it's still in the "cluster" of grapes, then it's grape juice. But the Bible called it "wine". So this verse proves that the word "wine" in the Bible is not always talikng about an alcoholic beverage.


Feel free to contact with with any further questions at The Truth about Addictions & Programs.


Jim Battle

 

[CalebTumanako]

I think the reason why is because there are problems or hurts in that person's life and like any addiction, it is a temporary band-aid, I struggle with one to pain killers, but I'm learning to take it one step at a time and to love myself, knowing that my deliverance is happening and knowing that God is going to heal me all through His grace. A lack of understanding and compassion can hurt a believer, it says in the Word that we all must carry each other's burdens and also knowing that it's that person's choice, we can only pray about it for our flesh is weak but our spirits are willing enough.

Sometimes, we just have to say 'no' but some of us need help through the encouragement of others, I know I do as I look at hard times as discipline but it could be also why anyone turns to anything is because of a lack of love in that person's life. The Word says

Love is patient, love is kind. It does not envy, it does not boast, it is not proud. 5 It does not dishonor others, it is not self-seeking, it is not easily angered, it keeps no record of wrongs. 6 Love does not delight in evil but rejoices with the truth. 7 It always protects, always trusts, always hopes, always perseveres.

And I have to be strong some times, we all do through the grace of God.

 

[TheDag]

Why would a spirit-filled Christian want the poison called alcohol in their body? And why would they want to even get a slight buzz off of it? I can't imagine Jesus or the apostles getting a little high on alcohol to relax and feel good. Can you?

It isn't clear if Jesus had any wine to drink at the wedding. It is harder to believe he didn't than to believe he did. Without proof of Jesus not drinking any wine at the wedding you simply can not make the conclusions you have.

Isa 65:8 ¶ Thus saith the LORD, As the new wine is found in the cluster, and one saith, Destroy it not; for a blessing is in it: so will I do for my servants' sakes, that I may not destroy them all.

If it's still in the "cluster" of grapes, then it's grape juice. But the Bible called it "wine". So this verse proves that the word "wine" in the Bible is not always talikng about an alcoholic beverage.

It proves no such thing. Using this logic would lead to so many dodgy beliefs if applied to other passages. Need something more solid that that.

 

[Rudolph Hucker]

I think that USA should bring back prohibition. It was so successful last time.

It would have two other advantages:

1). Consumption of alcohol would increase reducing unemployment in the criminal sector and
2). More of the Good Stuff would left for the ROW.

 

[seashale76]

I think that USA should bring back prohibition. It was so successful last time.

It would have two other advantages:

1). Consumption of alcohol would increase reducing unemployment in the criminal sector and
2). More of the Good Stuff would left for the ROW.

True story: Two of my great-uncles were competing bootleggers in the same dry county. They both wound up getting arrested around the same time and did a stint in the county jail- where another one of my great-uncles was the County Sheriff. He'd let them out to have dinner with his family and then put them back behind bars.

One time, when my dad was a kid, he was with one of his uncles when he was on a bootlegging run. And- another time- he was with my grandparents when his uncle decided to stop and buy ill-gotten alcohol. The state troopers decided to arrest my grandfather even though he didn't buy any that time and wasn't driving. Apparently- when they got back to my great-grandmother's house- she sighed- took her purse- and went to the jail to bail him out.

She also ran off a guy she caught setting up a moonshine still on her property once. He threatened her and she just went to get the authorities.

There are still dry counties- and they make more money being dry. The bootleggers are right there with everyone at the local First Baptist voting against the issue every time it comes up. My parents' county recently voted against being dry- and now they have the grand total of one liquor store. The guy who owns it used to go to their church- but he got enough flak from some that he left- and likely goes to the Methodist church out there now.

My mom even knows a lady who went on a distillery tour (we live in the land of many bourbon distilleries) who then proceeded to give everyone the stink eye who drank the samples at the end. Who does that? Honestly!

And- some sad news- somebody recently stole sixty-five cases of Pappy Van Winkle 20-year-old bourbon. One ounce goes for fifty dollars- so someone out there is making an illegal fortune out of their ill-gotten goods.

 

[Jeffwhosoever]

Alcohol is not sinful if you can truly use it in moderation, and obey all laws such as not serving underage youth, not drinking and driving, etc. However, I will say in my experience, most drinkers turn into alcoholics of some degree. It's like anything else with a high addiction potential. I think most people are better off avoiding it, but I base that on empirical observation through college and almost 50 years of life, not based on Scripture. And, if you honestly assess the health benefits vs. risks, you'll also conclude that it isn't worth the risks it brings.

 

[Cactus Jack]

If someone wants to drink, that's fine by me. Leave me out of it. But if they commit a crime in which a person is injured, I feel they should be punished triple. If a vehicular assault gets a person 6 years, they get 18. Is it extreme? I dunno. Tell me how much the victim can now enjoy life. They can't 'cause they're dead. So who is on the losing end? Who paid dearly? When you compare it, is 18 years too long, now?

 

[TheDag]

If someone wants to drink, that's fine by me. Leave me out of it. But if they commit a crime in which a person is injured, I feel they should be punished triple. If a vehicular assault gets a person 6 years, they get 18. Is it extreme? I dunno. Tell me how much the victim can now enjoy life. They can't 'cause they're dead. So who is on the losing end? Who paid dearly? When you compare it, is 18 years too long, now?

So a person not drunk kills a person and gets 6 years and you think that is reasonable? How do you figure? To be a fair comparison I assume death occours in both scenarios.

I think the point your probably trying to make is that the law will sometimes consider a drunk person as having diminished responsibility but you think they should be held accountable for making the decision to drink. Something I agree with generally speaking. Or have I misunderstood?

 

[All Souls]

What are your thoughts on alcohol + faith? Thank you

Jesus turned water into wine, and not the cheap stuff either!

 

[andy b]

alcohol + faith = man with no faith

 

[Emil Rez52]

alcohol + faith = man with no faith

Yeah, let's go back to the 18th and 19th century days of prohibition. If it wasn't the gay marriage, abortion, secular entertainment, Obamacare tirade, it would be something along those lines. Heck, even if Christians lived in a perfectly morally pure world, there would still be religious wars and disputes over doctrine.

 

[Cactus Jack]

So a person not drunk kills a person and gets 6 years and you think that is reasonable? How do you figure? To be a fair comparison I assume death occours in both scenarios.

I think the point your probably trying to make is that the law will sometimes consider a drunk person as having diminished responsibility but you think they should be held accountable for making the decision to drink. Something I agree with generally speaking. Or have I misunderstood?

I'm using the time frame as an example. It is certainly no more justified, being sober or intoxicated. However, a person that is sober really has a less chance of killing someone than one that is intoxicated/stoned.

 

[Inkachu]

What are your thoughts on alcohol + faith? Thank you

Very few people can handle their alcohol intake in a mature, controlled, wise manner. Is it wiser to walk the edge of a cliff, hoping you don't fall off, or is it wiser to just stay away from the edge to begin with?

I'm a teetotaler (don't drink at all, ever). My husband has the occasional craft beer or glass of wine when we're at a restaurant (never at home). So I do not flip out over people who drink responsibly, like my hubby. I just personally prefer to leave the stuff alone.