Al Franken. Status: Still the best Senator in America

[Zoooma]

Tort reform is in the bill, but don't let facts get in the way of your rhetoric.

What pages? Can you please point it out?

Why no answer to my questions?

Where's tort reform in the new health care law?

 

[EdwinWillers]

"I'm going to die homeless, penniless, and 30 pounds overweight."
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]- Al Franken (as Stuart Smalley) [/SIZE][/FONT]

 

[CaptainNemo1138]

Mr. Willers, I don not believe we have met. Please allow me to introduce myself, I am a man of wealth and taste. And I simply must ask what is so amusing about a woman being raped and then shoved into a shipping container?

 

[rambot]

"I'm going to die homeless, penniless, and 30 pounds overweight."
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]- Al Franken (as Stuart Smalley) [/SIZE][/FONT]

uhm... you know TV isn't real life right?

 

[EdwinWillers]

uhm... you know TV isn't real life right?

LOL - you telling me that's not Al Franken in the photo?

 

[JustOneWay]

LOL - you telling me that's not Al Franken in the photo?

Here is the clue:

"as Stuart Smalley"

I am not sure you see the separation....

 

[CaptainNemo1138]

Again, Edwin, just what is so funny about being raped and shoved in a shipping container?

 

[Voegelin]

All we need to make this complete is Pee Wee Herman in as Senate parliamentarian.

 

[CaptainNemo1138]

All we need to make this complete is Pee Wee Herman in as Senate parliamentarian.

If Senator Herman is willing to defend rape victims, then more power to him.

 

[EdwinWillers]

Here is the clue:

"as Stuart Smalley"

I am not sure you see the separation....

So, it *is* Al Franken *as* Stuart Smalley! Gee - who'd a thunk?

 

[EdwinWillers]

All we need to make this complete is Pee Wee Herman in as Senate parliamentarian.

Actually, Pee Wee Herman would probably do a much better job as Senator than most in this administration these days. He might even find his bicycle somewhere in the deeper recesses of the Senate...

 

[CaptainNemo1138]

I find it sad that people would disregard common human decency in favor of party politics.

 

[Gawron]

Posted by CaptainNemo1138:

"And I simply must ask what is so amusing about a woman being raped and then shoved into a shipping container?"

This case was never as cut and dry as you make it sound.

To begin, I suppose I must point out that rape is a terrible crime and no woman victimized by this crime should ever be denied due recourse. Perpetrators of this crime should be held accountable. That said, the information provided so far is incomplete, and what follows is provided to address that gap.

1. Opposition to the original Franken Amendment by Republican Senators was not a vote in favor of KBR gang rapists. You did not make this claim, but this claim has been made. Senator Sessions did voice his concern with the amendment.

Quote:

“On the Senate floor, Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-AL) spoke against the amendment, calling it "a political attack directed at Halliburton." Franken responded, "This amendment does not single out a single contractor. This amendment would defund any contractor that refuses to give a victim of rape their day in court."

In the end, Franken won the debate. His amendment passed by a 68-30 vote, earning the support of 10 Republican senators including that of newly-minted Florida Sen. George LeMieux. "He did what a senator should do, which was he was working it," LeMieux said in praise of Franken. "He was working for his amendment."

End Quote. Link: http://www.topix.com/forum/city/welc...FBNII6CKRVQ33M

The same quote can be found here:

http://thinkprogress.org/2009/10/07/...ken-amendment/

However, bring up the actual amendment, and you find the following.

Quote:

Statement of Purpose: To prohibit the use of funds for any Federal contract with Halliburton Company, KBR, Inc., any of their subsidiaries or affiliates, or any other contracting party if such contractor or a subcontractor at any tier under such contract requires that employees or independent contractors sign mandatory arbitration clauses regarding certain claims.

End Quote. Link: http://senate.gov/legislative/LIS/ro...n=1&vote=00308

Halliburton is specifically named, in contrast to Franken’s claim to the contrary.

2. Halliburton and KBR and not the same entity.

KBR was a formerly a subsidiary of Halliburton, which acquired Brown & Root in December of 1962 and merged it with Kellogg in 1998. In April of 2007 Halliburton announced that it had broken ties with KBR and began to sell its stock in KBR on the New York Stock Exchange.

Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/KBR_(company)

Jones original claim originated in 2005, when KBR was a subsidiary of Halliburton, but none of the articles cited or found via search claimed that the employees, or “John Doe rapist”, in question worked for Halliburton. Jones herself worked for KBR, and not Halliburton. All of the allegations were targeted at KBR. In comparison, New Line Cinema is a subsidiary of Time Warner. If an employee at New Line Cinema is raped by employees at New Line Cinema, is Time Warner to blame, or justifiably targeted with legislation prohibiting how it operates? This is not a defense of Halliburton concerning any other issue which people may have with Halliburton, it is rather a legitimate question.

3. Details of the case.

Jones filed her arbitration complaint in February of 2006. At that time the complaint stated she “was placed in an all-male dorm for living arrangements, and a co-worker sexually assaulted her.” The EEOC credited the allegation of sexual assault.

Fifteen months later the allegations were amended to include charges of gang-rape and placement in a container. The EEOC found that KBR “provided immediate medical treatment and safety and shipped her home immediately.”

Jones lawyer filed his brief against not only KBR, but against Halliburton and the United States of America. It may be standard practice to name not only the primary defendant but all affiliated companies and the parent company in a lawsuit, but given the venom associated with the name Halliburton, this does raise an eyebrow or two. KBR apparently wanted to transfer the venue for hearing the case to Houston, and her lawyer disagreed.

Link: http://docs.justia.com/cases/federal...295/103217/22/

Halliburton, as a named defendant, did attempt to keep the case in arbitration. But note that arbitration does not preclude a court case, only that arbitration occur first.

Source: http://static.uspirg.org/consumer/ar..._of_gangr.html

This was utilized by many on various blogs to make the claim that Halliburton and company were attempting to “cover up” the entire affair. But according to an ABC news story filed in December of 2007, Jones was interviewed by 20/20.

Quote:

“"It felt like prison," says Jones, who told her story to ABC News as part of an upcoming "20/20" investigation. "I was upset; I was curled up in a ball on the bed; I just could not believe what had happened."

End Quote. Link: Victim: Gang-Rape Cover-Up by U.S., Halliburton/KBR - ABC News

Halliburton, as a named defendant, was apparently trying to protect its arbitration clause, and not “cover up” the story.

4. The EEOC did back up her claims of sexual assault, but not her entire story.

Here is a link to Jones’ testimony to the House Judiciary Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorisn and Homeland Security, as presented on December 19th or 2007.

Link: http://www.halliburtonwatch.org/reports/Jones071219.pdf

Note the follow up documents from the EEOC, which states:

“there were approximately 25 other females assigned to the same barracks as Ms. Jones.”

And that:

“respondent provided medical assistance, placed her in a secure location, and transported her back to the United States.”

As previously stated, the EEOC did maintain that a sexual assault had taken place, and that the investigation was “inadequate”.

5. The Military Extraterritorial Jurisdiction Act of 2000

As sated previously, arbitration does not preclude a court case, only that arbitration occur first. In addition, cases like this are already covered by the above named act, which states:

Criminal offenses committed by certain members of the Armed Forces and by persons employed by or accompanying the Armed Forces outside the United States.

Whoever engages in conduct outside the United States that would constitute an offense punishable by imprisonment for more than 1 year if the conduct had been engaged in within the special maritime and territorial jurisdiction of the United States—

‘‘(1) while employed by or accompanying the Armed Forces outside the United States; or

‘‘(2) while a member of the Armed Forces subject to chapter 47 of title 10 (the Uniform Code of Military Justice), shall be punished as provided for that offense.

Source: http://www.pubklaw.com/hi/pl106-523.pdf

Jones would have had recourse in response to the sexual assault regardless of whether she went to arbitration or not. No-one denies that some sexual assault occurred, but as stated by the EEOC, her story contained inaccuracies and apparent false statements. Franken, however valid defense of rape victims may be, had more than one agenda in promoting this amendment. The assault occurred while KBR was a subsidiary of Halliburton, but the amendment was advanced after Halliburton had divested itself of KBR. But by specifically listing Halliburton in the amendment, Franken assures himself of a high profile moment, and the adulation of hoards of liberals who foam at the mouth anytime the name Halliburton is mentioned.

 

[CaptainNemo1138]

Jones would have had recourse in response to the sexual assault regardless of whether she went to arbitration or not.

Such as?

No-one denies that some sexual assault occurred, but as stated by the EEOC, her story contained inaccuracies and apparent false statements.

Again, such as? Forget this is Senator Franklin's Amendment, and forget it's Republican opposition. This is a bill allowing rape victims to seek justice against their rapists, corporate policy be damned. That seems pretty righteous to me, party politics or no.

 

[JustOneWay]

"I'm going to die homeless, penniless, and 30 pounds overweight."
[FONT=Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif][SIZE=-1]- Al Franken (as Stuart Smalley) [/SIZE][/FONT]

Well, what are you trying to say here , poster? Apparently nobody is able to read your mind.

Does it have any point whatsoever?

 

[rambot]

Here is the clue:

"as Stuart Smalley"

I am not sure you see the separation....

[high five]

 

[Gawron]

Posted by CaptainNemo1138:

"Again, such as?"

This goes back to your original post. The EEOC investigation determined that her claim of being thrown into a shipping container was unfounded, no evidence could be found to support this part of her story. Yet any time this subject is raised, someone always cites this as fact to be used as part of the indictment against anyone who questions Franken or his motives.

Read the entire transcripts posted and other inconsistencies in her story are highlighted.

 

[chaz345]

I find it sad that people would disregard common human decency in favor of party politics.

You mean like Franken did when he proposed this amendment in the first place?

It was a purely political move, it was attached to something that he know the Repubs were against so when they voted against it, political hay could be made out of the fact that they voted against helping a rape victim.

Same game being played with the viagra for sex offenders thing in the health care bill.

 

[EdwinWillers]

Well, what are you trying to say here , poster? Apparently nobody is able to read your mind.

Does it have any point whatsoever?

I'm fairly confident that while you may profess otherwise, most people here don't need me to articulate the point.

A picture being worth a thousand words; why expound further?

Perhaps the point is that you don't want to acknowledge the point? :shrug:

 

[JustOneWay]

I'm fairly confident that while you may profess otherwise, most people here don't need me to articulate the point.

A picture being worth a thousand words; why expound further?

Perhaps the point is that you don't want to acknowledge the point? :shrug:

You cant post your point because there is no point. That is what I thought....