Adding to the Word?

mva1985 · Dec 20, 2007

Jeremiah 18:18
"Then they said, Come and let us devise plans against Jeremiah; for the law shall not perish from the priest, nor counsel from the wise, nor the word from the prophet. Come and let us attack him with the tongue, and let us not give heed to any of his words.

mva1985 · Dec 20, 2007

freeindeed2 said:
IOW, believe that her 2000+ 'visions' (how many did Daniel and John have combined? ) or you're wrong, because she said you are.

There needs to be a more careful reading of the quote that I provided that is not exactly what she said.

freeindeed2 · Dec 20, 2007

mva1985 said:
There needs to be a more careful reading of the quote that I provided that is not exactly what she said.

But it is the gist of what she said, isn't it?

mva1985 · Dec 20, 2007

"Some, I was shown, could receive the published visions, judging of the tree by its fruits. Others are like doubting Thomas; they cannot believe the published Testimonies, nor receive evidence through the testimony of others, but must see and have the evidence for themselves. Such must not be set aside, but long patience and brotherly love should be exercised toward them until they find their position and become established for or against. If they fight against the visions, of which they have no knowledge; if they carry their opposition so far as to oppose that in which they have had no experience, and feel annoyed when those who believe that the visions are of God speak of them in meeting, and comfort themselves with the instruction given through vision, the church may know that they are not right."

--Testimonies, vol. 1, pp. 327-329.

RC_NewProtestants · Dec 20, 2007

mva1985 said:
There needs to be a more careful reading of the quote that I provided that is not exactly what she said.

That would be found in the application of the quote. Free is right in what the quote says. The application is that once anyone has rejected Ellen Whites testimonies, whether one or a hundred. we can Know they are not right. So what do we do with these people who are not right? Well since they are not right we can't have them teaching or preaching.

I do love that quote as it is so condescending
If they fight against the visions, of which they have no knowledge

Well of course how can they have any knowledge of someone else's visions. People can't think about what someone says we must just believe everyone who says they have had a vision because only that person has knowledge of the visions. Of course only people with no knowledge will fight against the visions so we can know they are not right. But we will suffer with the questioners as long as they waffle between believing and not believing. Once they stop waffling and agree with us that they are visions of God they will be accepted if they disagree then they are not right and we have to limit the activities of those who are not right of course.

mva1985 · Dec 20, 2007

Evangelism page 260
"Judged by Their Fruits.--Let the Testimonies be judged by their fruits. What is the spirit of their teaching? What has been the result of their influence? All who desire to do so can acquaint themselves with the fruits of these visions. . . . {Ev 260.1}
God is either teaching His church, reproving their wrongs, and strengthening their faith, or He is not. This work is of God, or it is not. God does nothing in partnership with Satan. My work . . . bears the stamp of God, or the stamp of the enemy. There is no halfway work in the matter. The Testimonies are of the Spirit of God, or of the devil.--Testimonies, vol. 5, p. 671. (1889) {Ev 260.2}"

mva1985 · Dec 20, 2007

"I saw the state of some who stood on present truth, but disregarded the visions--the way God had chosen to teach in some cases, those who erred from Bible truth. I saw that in striking against the visions they did not strike against the worm--the feeble instrument that God spake through--but against the Holy Ghost. I saw it was a small thing to speak against the instrument, but it was dangerous to slight the words of God. I saw if they were in error and God chose to show them their errors through visions, and they disregarded the teachings of God through visions, they would be left to take their own way, and run in the way of error, and think they were right, until they would find it out too late. Then in the time of trouble I heard them cry to God in agony, "Why didst Thou not show us our wrong, that we might have got right and been ready for this time?" Then an angel pointed to them and said, "My Father taught, but you would not be taught. He spoke through visions, but you disregarded His voice, and He gave you up to your own ways, to be filled with your own doings."

--Broadside, To Those Who Are Receiving the Seal of the Living God, Jan. 31, 1849.

NightEternal · Dec 20, 2007

EGW being used as a sledgehammer against others. If I've seen it once I've seen it a thousand times.

mva1985 · Dec 20, 2007

Interesting that even herself she says the work is of God or of Satan. So who do you think it originated with?

mva1985 · Dec 20, 2007

"One thing is certain: Those Seventh-day Adventists who take their stand under Satan's banner will first give up their faith in the warnings and reproofs contained in the Testimonies of God's Spirit."

freeindeed2 · Dec 20, 2007

mva1985 said:
"One thing is certain: Those Seventh-day Adventists who take their stand under Satan's banner will first give up their faith in the warnings and reproofs contained in the Testimonies of God's Spirit."

Is this a reference to EGW's 'Testimonies'? Who equated them with the testimony of the Holy Spirit?

mva1985 · Dec 20, 2007

"It is Satan's plan to weaken the faith of God's people in the Testimonies. Next follows skepticism in regard to the vital points of our faith, the pillars of our position, then doubt as to the Holy Scriptures, and then the downward march to perdition. When the Testimonies, which were once believed, are doubted and given up, Satan knows the deceived ones will not stop at this; and he redoubles his efforts till he launches them into open rebellion, which becomes incurable and ends in destruction."

mva1985 · Dec 20, 2007

Testimonies for the Church Volume 5
Chap. 82 - The Nature and Influence of the "Testimonies"

freeindeed2 · Dec 20, 2007

mva1985 said:
"It is Satan's plan to weaken the faith of God's people in the Testimonies.

'Testimonies', as in EGW's writings? Satan's plan is focussed on the writings of EGW in her 'Testimonies'?

Next follows skepticism in regard to the vital points of our faith, the pillars of our position, then doubt as to the Holy Scriptures, and then the downward march to perdition.

IOW, if you don't believe what SDAism believes, you're bound for hell.

When the Testimonies, which were once believed, are doubted and given up, Satan knows the deceived ones will not stop at this; and he redoubles his efforts till he launches them into open rebellion, which becomes incurable and ends in destruction."

So, any SDA who once believed the 'Testimonies' of EGW but no longer does, yet believes in the testimony of the Holy Spirit (who testifies of Jesus Christ INSIDE the believer), is headed for 'open rebellion' that ends in going to hell (destruction). So, belief in EGW becomes more important that believing in Jesus Christ...hmmm...

Is Jesus not good enough? We have to believe in Jesus AND EGW?

Rather odd...

In Christ alone...

mva1985 · Dec 20, 2007

If you go back and read one of the quotes I provided you will see that striking against the instrument is no big deal, but in essence you are striking out against God not EGW.

Mankin · Dec 20, 2007

Oh brother. All I see you doing is using EGW as a sledgehammer.

Mankin · Dec 20, 2007

So by striking out against EGW you strike out against God? Sorry but that makes no sense.

freeindeed2 · Dec 20, 2007

mva1985 said:
If you go back and read one of the quotes I provided you will see that striking against the instrument is no big deal, but in essence you are striking out against God not EGW.

But she has equated disagreement with her writings AS 'striking out against God'. That's what I COMPLETELY disagree with.

Is Jesus enough?

(***mva, I know we disagree on this, so please know that this is not personal for me, rather ONLY for discussion purposes! I'm sure you feel the same, but just making sure. )

mva1985 · Dec 20, 2007

Mankin said:
Oh brother. All I see you doing is using EGW as a sledgehammer.

That line has already been used.

So no one has answered the question that I posed. EGW says that her work is either of God or of the enemy. What say you?

freeindeed2 · Dec 20, 2007

mva1985 said:
That line has already been used.

So no one has answered the question that I posed. EGW says that her work is either of God or of the enemy. What say you?

I say she was right (and we who are led by the Holy Spirit are free to follow what HE convicts us of), and that Jesus IS ENOUGH!

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