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Accountable for our beliefs
- Thread starter sjstudy
- Start date
EverlastingMan
Regular Member
Well that is not for sure, but is we assume that we have no control over our beliefs then I don't think anyone would disagree with me when I say that of course we cannot be held responsible.
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Soul Searcher
The kingdom is within
Good question, the way I see it there are two ways to look at this.sjstudy said:
One, the way many religions look at it which is that you must believe a certian thing or suffer for it. This I disagree with, It makes no sense that one would be held in contempt for not believing something that sounds unbelievable to that person, especially when that person has not been provided with solid evidence that could prove beyond a doubt that the assertion is factual.
Two, holding true to what we actually do believe. If we believe that it is wrong to do something then we should not do it, nor should we teach others to do it. In this case it seems perfectly reasonable to be held accountable for our beliefs.
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You've had this done in many other threads in this forum where your refutations were either absent or lacking.Lilly of the Valley said:
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FSTDT
Yahweh
What does this even mean? Are you saying its possible for a person to will the things they believe in, like flipping a lightswitch on an off to say "well now I believe in fairies, now I don't, now I do, now I don't" and so on.Lilly of the Valley said:
I don't know about you, but I have no memory of ever having chosen a belief, just like I've never chosen which foods I find delicious or chosen which kind of jokes I find funny or chosen the women who I find attractive.
Its incoherent to talk about "choosing" a belief.
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A person chooses to accept Christ as their savior. Nothing makes them or forces them into this decision. Nothing commands them to do this. Not even experiences make you choose to serve God or believe in Him as your savior or even believe His words. This is choosing a belief.
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No response to FSTDT?Lilly of the Valley said:
If you have a choice in believing in christ then you should have a choice in believing in other things as well.
Why don't you try and see if you can make yourself truly believe in unicorns, dragons, and leprechauns. If belief is a choice then this should be easy.
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FSTDT
Yahweh
I don't know what you're talking about.Lilly of the Valley said:
I could never "choose" to accept Christ as my personal savior without consciously trying to decieve myself, because I'm not a superstitious person and I have no beliefs in miracles.
Keep in mind, I was a theist at first because I was raised to be one, then I lost my theism because I was incapable of holding on to it. It was as if my theism was a brick wall, and every so often the force of reason would knock a brick from the wall, until eventually there were so many holes in the wall that it collapsed under its own weight. Its not as if I made a "choice" to let go of theism, but it just happened. And I could never make a choice that would suddenly shift my whole psychology to a belief in theism ever again... if I ever became a theist again, it would be because I found an argument for theism persuasive enough that I couldn't rationally find it untrue, but I really don't think such an argument exists.
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Lilly of the Valley said:
Believing in the supernatural has everything to do with superstition, and if i'm not mistaken, god is a supernatural being.
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Lilly of the Valley said:
How many times has this been explained to you? You can no more choose your beliefs than you can choose what makes you happy.
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Bottom line for me, my mind will never change on the 'choice' issue. Never. Thus, until somehow I figure out another argument or more holes or whatnot in the opposing argument, I'll try to avoid 'choice' threads w/ those I've already debated it w/...not w/ people I haven't.
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Blackguard_
Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos.
Well it should. The Bible says we don't have a choice. Faith is by grace and not works, which a choice would be.
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Blackguard_ said:
That's false. We choose to serve God or not or even to recieve His grace and love. That is a choice. Bottom line. Also, saying there is no choice is saying God creates people for hell on purpose, wants people to go down there and gets pleasure from it and that He purposely grieves Himself and plans/intends for us to sin and rebel against Him and etc.....all unbiblical. The Bible says and shows that we do indeed have a choice.
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Lynden1000
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Lilly of the Valley said:
Then I think the bible is wrong about that. I don't think we choose what we find believable or unbelievable, any more than we can choose to find someone sexually attractive when we don't, or choose to really like the taste of something that we don't like.
I can't stand the taste of mayonnaise, but I would love to be able to choose to like the taste of mayo. It would make things *so* much easier. I wouldn't have to special order all my burgers at McDonalds, and I could eat potato salad and coleslaw and all the other things you find at family barbecues. But, alas, I can't seem to choose to find it delicious no matter how much I *choose* to.
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EverlastingMan
Regular Member
It says salvation rather than faith if I remember correctly. Faith is something we choose to have, it would be decidedly odd if it wasn't, if not unfair. How much in the bible relies on faith? Miracles answer to prayer salvation itself. We cannot blame people for a lack of a faith if they cannot choose to have it in the first place.Blackguard_ said:
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EverlastingMan
Regular Member
THe examples you give don't quite apply. She wasn't saying that we choose to believe or not believe everything, just somethings-like salvation.Lynden1000 said:
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