Abortion song

[bornagainhippy]

I just heard a song on the radio called "Why did you kill me mommy". I can't of anything that has made feel as sick in the guts as this song did.

If the song was to support the cause of stopping mothers from killing their 2 yr old plus children, then I could see some relevance, but about abortion????

Yeah yeah, blahdy blahdy blah life begins at conception and all that - if that's what you wanna believe.

Pretending that an unborn baby has concious awareness is silly enough but this song is just plain sick.

 

[EnemyPartyII]

I just heard a song on the radio called "Why did you kill me mommy". I can't of anything that has made feel as sick in the guts as this song did.

If the song was to support the cause of stopping mothers from killing their 2 yr old plus children, then I could see some relevance, but about abortion????

Yeah yeah, blahdy blahdy blah life begins at conception and all that - if that's what you wanna believe.

Pretending that an unborn baby has concious awareness is silly enough but this song is just plain sick.

Hey, nothing derails rational, fact based discussion like an appeal to emotion!

I mean, imagine what the world would be like if people went around making decisions based only on facts and empirical evidence... my goodness, we'd be up to our armpits in people who hadn't been killed in secular conflicts, and who hadn't died due to easily treatable medical conditions in the 400 years or so that religion crippled genuine scientific enquiry!

 

[bornagainhippy]

Hey, nothing derails rational, fact based discussion like an appeal to emotion!

I mean, imagine what the world would be like if people went around making decisions based only on facts and empirical evidence... my goodness, we'd be up to our armpits in people who hadn't been killed in secular conflicts, and who hadn't died due to easily treatable medical conditions in the 400 years or so that religion crippled genuine scientific enquiry!

Well said. If I could afford it, I'd throw some blessings your way. But alas, I don't even own enough blessings to get myself a real picture. Maybe oneday I'll meet a nice person with lots (7000+ maybe) of blessings who will help me get rid of my pig.

 

[Chrono Traveler]

lil markie(the one who sings that song) scares me o.o

i think its actually called "diary of an unborn child".

 

[Ryal Kane]

I'm pro-choice but I still find the song Happy Birthday by Flipsyde to be a very powerful piece about regret.

Abortion's can be very difficult on people. Some people regret them and some people don't. It's about that choice. But I see it as the regret of what might have been rather than anything like killing a conscious being.

 

[bornagainhippy]

I'm pro-choice but I still find the song Happy Birthday by Flipsyde to be a very powerful piece about regret.

Abortion's can be very difficult on people. Some people regret them and some people don't. It's about that choice. But I see it as the regret of what might have been rather than anything like killing a conscious being.

Yeah, well, put that way (reflecting on what mighta been), that makes a bit a sense. I hadn't thunked of that. Still think the song is disgusting but.

 

[jayem]

I haven't heard that song.

But I don't really have a problem with abortion opponents using persuasion to encourage people not to choose abortion voluntarily. Even if their exhortations are overbearingly, mawkishly, sentimental. Now if they're outright lying to people, that's something else. But maudlin is OK. Tasteless, but OK.

 

[Renton405]

I just heard a song on the radio called "Why did you kill me mommy". I can't of anything that has made feel as sick in the guts as this song did.

If the song was to support the cause of stopping mothers from killing their 2 yr old plus children, then I could see some relevance, but about abortion????

Yeah yeah, blahdy blahdy blah life begins at conception and all that - if that's what you wanna believe.

Pretending that an unborn baby has concious awareness is silly enough but this song is just plain sick.

But if abortion didn't bother you at all you wouldn't feel sick now, would you?..

Do you think the reason why you felt the way you did is because there is actual truth behind that song and it is hitting your moral conscious that you've supressed for so long??

I mean, imagine what the world would be like if people went around making decisions based only on facts and empirical evidence... my goodness, we'd be up to our armpits in people who hadn't been killed in secular conflicts, and who hadn't died due to easily treatable medical conditions in the 400 years or so that religion crippled genuine scientific enquiry!

And yet, some of the biggest scientists were Christian. Sir Issac Newton, Kepler, Boyle, Pascal, Copernicus, Faraday, and Maxwell all want their ideas back that you stole ..since christians, you know..supressed science for so long *cough*

And since Christians built this country and Europe you live in. You can leave that too

 

[Futuwwa]

Pretending that an unborn baby has concious awareness is silly enough but this song is just plain sick.

It would depend on what stage of the pregnancy we talk about. While it definitely has no measure of sentience at conception, it's kind of silly to pretend that a baby suddenly switchs to sentience when it passes out of the womb and is born.

 

[StarCannon]

And since Christians built this country and Europe you live in. You can leave that too

Deists built this contry. Atheists formed a lot of the institutions that europe uses to govern itself. Think for a moment, if Napoleon WASN'T irreligous.

 

[Futuwwa]

And yet, some of the biggest scientists were Christian. Sir Issac Newton, Kepler, Boyle, Pascal, Copernicus, Faraday, and Maxwell all want their ideas back that you stole ..since christians, you know..supressed science for so long *cough*

Except that Newton was an arch-heretic who rejected the trinity

 

[Renton405]

Except that Newton was an arch-heretic who rejected the trinity

Well, he didn't totally reject the Trinity. He had more an eastern orthodox view of it

 

[KalithAlur]

Also, wasn't the penalty for not being a Christian often to suffer excruciating torture to the point of being willing to confess to anything regardless of whether or not it was true, then die to go on to an eternity of far worse torture (at least in the eyes of the people responsible for your earthly torture and death)?

If you were smart enuf to re-vo-lutionize society and science, most likely you'd lie if you weren't a Christian.

but people seem to me misinformed about the whole abortion thing. it isn't ridiculous to claim fetal awareness. We basically don't know how sentient the fetus is because there's no way short of telepathy to communicate with said entity about internalizations... and nobody'd have any reason to believe a telepath's reports on fetal awareness.

there does seem to me to be ample evidence *(warning: don't believe me, do your own research. not all my resources are pro choice, many don't offer an opinion either way, but they did all come from the ever-questionable internet) to support the conclusion that the fetus possesses some level of awareness after 20 weeks, including at least the ability to feel pain, and my own opinion is that the fetus as it develops gains the capacity to feel comfort/discomfort safety/threat, fear and physical pain, comfort and physical pleasure,

but little if anything beyond that.

i don't have any idea at what stage conscious memories start being manufactured.

 

[bornagainhippy]

But if abortion didn't bother you at all you wouldn't feel sick now, would you?..

Do you think the reason why you felt the way you did is because there is actual truth behind that song and it is hitting your moral conscious that you've supressed for so long??

Not at all. Abortion doesn't bother me.

And yet, some of the biggest scientists were Christian. Sir Issac Newton, Kepler, Boyle, Pascal, Copernicus, Faraday, and Maxwell all want their ideas back that you stole ..since christians, you know..supressed science for so long *cough*

And since Christians built this country and Europe you live in. You can leave that too

Is your reference to the Christian scientists above meant to mean that you do not think that, over the course of history, the church surpressed science???? Have you ever heard of tiny piece of history, often referred to as "TheDark Ages"? Not just the christians though. Some ancient Greeks got in a bit of trouble a long time ago for suggesting that epilepsy was caused by brain dysfunction rather than evil spirits.

 

[quatona]

But if abortion didn't bother you at all you wouldn't feel sick now, would you?..

Speaking for myself, I do have mixed feelings about abortion, but what actually makes me feel sick about this are attempts to replace reasonable discussion by cheesy appeals to emotions.

Do you think the reason why you felt the way you did is because there is actual truth behind that song and it is hitting your moral conscious that you've supressed for so long??

Oh, you have a diploma in armchair psychology? Congratulations!

Anyways - now it turns out that killed unborns can write successful songs some of my problems with abortion were pointless.

And since Christians built this country and Europe you live in.

 

[Robbie_James_Francis]

But if abortion didn't bother you at all you wouldn't feel sick now, would you?..

Do you think the reason why you felt the way you did is because there is actual truth behind that song and it is hitting your moral conscious that you've supressed for so long??

Anyone could create a poem or song telling the sorrow of a tree being cut down...does her or his power of persuasion reveal an underlying realisation that killing trees is wrong?

Argument from propaganda is simply untenable.

 

[KalithAlur]

" Argument from propaganda is simply untenable."

This is a problem I'v given some thought.

Since propaganda seems to me to represent the word "persuasion" only in an uglier light, the problem with not using propaganda to make a point is merely by striving to prove your point you'r resorting to persuasion!

I spent some time looking for solutions. What I'v come up with:

1) You could try to examine the issue from many angles in your posts, admitting how things seem to you and why without resorting to emotions at all to prove your point. In other words, write in an objective robot-like tone of voice.

After all, even if, without making emotional appeals concerning the issues, a certain jovial (ect) personality shines thru your posts, some people might tend to agree with you because they like you, disagree because they don't like you (ect), all without realizing their emotions are manipulating their opinions.

2) Alternatively, you could try pointing out how folly-filled a thing it would be to take your word for anything, without attracting so much distrust the reader becomes super-skeptical... The key seems to me to be to inspire the Objective Skeptic (the, "just the evidence, m'am," type).

3) You can include in your posts actual techniques for seeing thru such propaganda techniques as repetition and emotional manipulation.

Things like, "Now, one manner of examining this evidence would be from the spectacles of a Christian Scientist. It might be interesting to "role play" the personality of a Christian Scientist, and examine this evidence from that perspective. One might invent all sorts of hypothetical personalities, and examine this data from these alternate perspectives, carefully noting the many reasons why the evidence might appear differently in different kinds of situations."

4. Aside from helping the reader identify personal bias, emotional triggers, and the tendency of repetition to concentrate one's focus on the repeated idea (even subconsciously concentrate on the repeated idea), and believe things just because I'v said them twice (perhaps I'v said them twice by accident so don't get paranoid), you might help the reader overcome personal emotional situational slavery (having emotions that respond to situational triggers regardless of what you DeSiRe to feel) by teaching techniques to those willing to listen which allow, thru prolonged effort of concentration, the reader's ability to manipulate his/her own emotions merely by willing them.

Such a technique might be as follows: Spend around 6 months taking 1 hour out of every day to meditate in the exact same still position in a quiet dark inactive unsmelly non-touchy (non-sensory) setting, so that one's thoughts gain an approximation of perfect stillness. After six months of serious dedication to this technique, begin spending that time meditating on the emotion joy (or love hate fear ect) expanding inside your mind until the emotion consumes you (but don't risk losing control, such as by meditating on very intense hate to the point of exploding), until you are satisfied you have created the desired emotional state, then move onto another emotional state.

5. Anything might help which inspires the reader to think for the reader's self. Can you think of more anti/(non)-propaganda techniques?

 

[Voegelin]

I just heard a song on the radio called "Why did you kill me mommy". I can't of anything that has made feel as sick in the guts as this song did.

If the song was to support the cause of stopping mothers from killing their 2 yr old plus children, then I could see some relevance, but about abortion????

Yeah yeah, blahdy blahdy blah life begins at conception and all that - if that's what you wanna believe.

Pretending that an unborn baby has concious awareness is silly enough but this song is just plain sick.

So that the criteria? OK to end someone's life if they are not concious of what you are doing to them? Congressional testimony of a person who was not concious when her mother and an abortionist tried to abort her but is conscious now:

Gianna Jessen

 

[Robbie_James_Francis]

So that the criteria? OK to end someone's life if they are not concious of what you are doing to them? Congressional testimony of a person who was not concious when her mother and an abortionist tried to abort her but is conscious now:

Gianna Jessen

'I do not consider myself a by-product of conception, a clump of tissue, or any other of the titles given to a child in the womb'

Because she is none of those things, she is a 19 year old woman. We were all a clump of tissue at one point, that doesn't mean we always will be.

 

[KalithAlur]

yet i suppose it brings up the point, "would a sentient human in the womb consent if you had a method of asking him/her, and if not, would that denial of consent even matter, since the baby is still attached to the mother's body?"