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What justifies punishing the rape victim twice? What justifies involuntary servitude?
I really don't have one. But then so far no anti-abortionist has been able to defend their beliefs. I stated quite clearly that I had none and therefore would not tell women what they had to do with their bodies. Since you want to tell others what they do with their bodies the burden of proof is upon you.What is your definition of "fully human."
This is pasted from Section IX, of the majority opinion in Roe v. Wade:
"All this, together with our observation, supra, that throughout the major portion of the 19th century prevailing legal abortion practices were far freer than they are today, persuades us that the word "person," as used in the Fourteenth Amendment, does not include the unborn."
http://caselaw.findlaw.com/us-supreme-court/410/113.html
At least in the context of abortion, the unborn are not persons with 14th Amendment Constitutional rights. I'm not a lawyer, but I don't think this precludes a state from considering a fetus as a person in other situations. Like if a pregnant woman is assaulted, and suffers a miscarriage as a result, a state can bring a homicide (I think feticide might be a better term) charge against the perp. But a properly done abortion, to which she gives consent, is not a crime. I can understand how this may seem contradictory, but nothing says that every law in all jurisdictions must be perfectly consistent.
God aborts something like 65-80% of pregnancies. Calling abortion wrong is calling God a sinner. If that is the case then Christianity makes no sense. We are called to be holy as He is holy so the question isn't is abortion wrong, it can't be because God does it, but what percentage of pregnancies should a woman abort to meet God's standard of holiness. One cannot be a Christian and be against abortion.
I really don't have one. But then so far no anti-abortionist has been able to defend their beliefs. I stated quite clearly that I had none and therefore would not tell women what they had to do with their bodies. Since you want to tell others what they do with their bodies the burden of proof is upon you.
Do you understand this? There are claims that I make that I am willing to support with evidence. Here I "win" simply because the other side cannot justify the changes that they want to institute.
They can define it that way, but they cannot justify that definition. And I don't hold Ron Paul in very high regard at all.You must have missed the volumes of posts where Christians clearly define their positions that human life begins at conception. As such this newly created and distinct human life must be protected.
Dr. Paul a libertarian said it best:
http://www.ronpaul.com/on-the-issues/abortion/
They can define it that way, but they cannot justify that definition. And I don't hold Ron Paul in very high regard at all.
The problem is that you use an equivocation error to make your case. That is also why you lose. I am trying to point out the weaknesses in your arguments. If you want to change the law you have to do it in an appropriate manner. Majority rule isn not the "law of the land". Minority rights are key too. You need to be able to justify the changes you want and so far you have not been able to.The pro life view can be defined. It is very easy to find scientific evidence that at conception a new human life is created.
It's not a baby:
ba·by
ˈbābē/
noun
The idea of a first trimester fetus being "innocent" of anything is silly. A first trimester fetus has no mechanism to be "innocent" or "guilty" of anything. It's just one more case of emotional rhetoric.
- 1.
a very young child, especially one newly or recently born.
"his wife's just had a baby"
synonyms: infant, newborn, child, tot, little one; More
In the US, this is not the case at all. Wider availability to birth control and comprehensive sex education has seen a steady drop in teen pregnancy since 1990.
I spent half a night once talking someone out of suicide have you?
It may be a common argument but is jumping to conclusions that people who use it favor abortion a good thing?
So the law that legalised abortion in the USA was from God?As scripture states: all laws are from God. That is all folks!
Most abortions are preformed in the first trimester of pregnancy. A heart beat does not determine life. If it did there would be no such thing as heart transplants today. Arms fingers toes also are no indication of life . Brain activity scientifically determines life and a fetus has none until close to five months of pregnancy. Therefore it is not alive, a person, or a baby, and it cannot be murdered or killed since it is not alive. There you go. It's very simple really. Truth and facts never did sit well with you anti abortion people who even want to force rape victims to have children by their rapists while then calling yourselves Christians. Disgusting and ungodly anyway you look at it. Go figure... BTW, God will never allow the law to be changed on abortions until rape, incest, and other rare medical conditions are accepted as reasons to have an abortion. As scripture states: all laws are from God. That is all folks!
Most abortions are preformed in the first trimester of pregnancy. A heart beat does not determine life. If it did there would be no such thing as heart transplants today. Arms fingers toes also are no indication of life . Brain activity scientifically determines life and a fetus has none until close to five months of pregnancy. Therefore it is not alive, a person, or a baby, and it cannot be murdered or killed since it is not alive. There you go. It's very simple really. Truth and facts never did sit well with you anti abortion people who even want to force rape victims to have children by their rapists while then calling yourselves Christians. Disgusting and ungodly anyway you look at it. Go figure... BTW, God will never allow the law to be changed on abortions until rape, incest, and other rare medical conditions are accepted as reasons to have an abortion. As scripture states: all laws are from God. That is all folks!
I'm pretty sure that is called moving the goalposts...As soon as you point out the truth about the life of the unborn, they simply move to the "yeah? Well what about rape" question. But even if you granted them abortion in the case of rape, and incest, and the life of the mother, they'd jump to another objection. The so-called prochoice crowd jumps all over the place in these discussion. And they drag along plenty of false information with them.
A fetus at any stage is not a baby. You just performed an equivocation fallacy.Hallo Todd. I did not ask for your opinion as there are a hundred more out there which one could justify depending on your worldview. What I did was to state the words of prominent abortionists who saw the outcome of their work. This is particularly relevant when the abortion is botched and a live baby is born and then turfed into a bin to die. A live baby is a live baby regardless what a dictionary says.
We are not talking about a first trimester baby. We are talking about abortion and as every abortion kills a baby according to the experts, that baby is innocent of any crime to deserve such a death.
I was not talking about the USA. I was talking about the country I live in and where I served on a committee advising the government.
No, what Papazoom just did was a strawman argument. Moving the goal posts is an error that creationists do. Now someone may point out the injustice of making a rape victim birth the child of her attacker, but that is not why they advocate that person's right to an abortion. That was merely an appeal to emotions, it was not moving the goal posts. They are not arguing that a fetus from a rape is less human than a human from consensual sex.I'm pretty sure that is called moving the goalposts...
It could be legitimately argued that that is the case. Look at how the Bible says that slaves are supposed to love their masters and work happily. The Bible makes some pretty crazy claims about authority. That one is supposed to obey the government seems to be one of them.So the law that legalised abortion in the USA was from God?
Maybe you should go back and read all the other recent abortion threads and you'll see what is being referred to...No, what Papazoom just did was a strawman argument. Moving the goal posts is an error that creationists do. Now someone may point out the injustice of making a rape victim birth the child of her attacker, but that is not why they advocate that person's right to an abortion. That was merely an appeal to emotions, it was not moving the goal posts. They are not arguing that a fetus from a rape is less human than a human from consensual sex.
I'm pretty sure that is called moving the goalposts...
The zygote carries within its single cell continuing threads in the immemorial lifespan of the human race, as well as the mixed-and-matched microscopic material from which will stem the intricacies common to all human bodies, yet with the remarkable uniqueness of a particular person.
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