Able Danger

[Smoke Screen]

Gorelick and Reno made it more difficult for foreign intel to share information with the FBI because the DNC had taken money from the PRC. The funding by Riady, Ng Lap Seng, Charlie Trie, John Huang, Chen Kai Kit and others had been exposed. Democrats didn't want the FBI to find out from the CIA and military Intel any more about the corruption.

This goes back to Carter, Turner and Church. At that time the New Left was on the payroll of the Soviets. Democrats found the radicals useful and did not want them exposed. Hence Carter's firing over over 1,000 CIA field agents and 300 or so FBI counterintel agents.

We can even go back to WWII. The Army's Venona exposed several hundred Soviet agents in the US government. Hoover heard about it. Truman knew about it. But Democrats denied Alger Hiss, Harry Dexter White and others were spies. Only after the KGB archives and the Venona transcripts were made public in the 1990s did we finally have the conclusive proof of what everyone (those who denied it and those who did not) knew was true.

That was history. This is the present. The neo-cons have sent nearly 1900 soldiers to their deaths because of their pre-planned war. They lied their way into an invasion ignoring international law. They sent American troops into combat understaffed. They sent American troops into combat with outdated armor. They cut Veterans benefits for injured soldiers. They put our country so far into debt my childrens grandchildren will be paying on it. Dead soldiers children will be paying off the national debt for a war based on lies and false hopes.

 

[arnegrim]

Speaking of lies and misinformation.

 

[marshlewis]

The only way to clear this up is to have an Independant non-partisan investigation of 9-11. They should have the power to sopena anyone they need and the power to force people to tell what they know.
Who thinks 9-11 is not important enough to justify doing this?

 

[mnphysicist]

The only way to clear this up is to have an Independant non-partisan investigation of 9-11. They should have the power to sopena anyone they need and the power to force people to tell what they know.
Who thinks 9-11 is not important enough to justify doing this?

Subjecting Gorelick, Berger, and crew to torture and or other extreme interrogation techniques just to find fault is going too far. While doing so to prevent an imminent attack might be somehow justifiable, doing so on a fault finding mission is not.

 

[Borealis]

Simple.

No nuance?

Why did 9/11 occur? US-imposed medical sanctions on Iraq killing children.

HOLD IT! RIGHT THERE!

I thought Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11? And they were UN-imposed sanctions, thank you very much.

Making Israel's treatment of its indigenous population possible.

You mean allowing them to live as free citizens and vote because they weren't sending their children to blow up schools and who weren't publicly praying for a new holocaust on Israel? Yeah, those Israelis had some nerve, didn't they?

Maintaining military bases in Saudi Arabia.

Did the Saudi government send the hijackers? No. So this excuse is as useless as the others.

Did Clinton try to stop these things? No. Did Clinton encourage these things? Yes. Was he warned of consequences of his crimes? Yes.

Um...do we get to drink too, now?

Therefore, Clinton is responsible for 3000 dead on 9/11. Not Bush. Bush is responsible for over 100,000 dead in Iraq, and any deaths in the inevitable next successful attack on the US.

If it's so inevitable, why hasn't it happened yet? The attacks are happening in Europe and Iraq and other parts of the world, but amazingly enough, not in America.

Can't imagine why.

 

[Borealis]

That was history. This is the present.

Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

The neo-cons have sent nearly 1900 soldiers to their deaths because of their pre-planned war.

Apart from the Downing Street Memos, which apparently are being misinterpreted almost as much as the Vatican II documents, can you furnish any proof of this fantasy?

They lied their way into an invasion ignoring international law. They sent American troops into combat understaffed. They sent American troops into combat with outdated armor.

Thanks to Democrat Senators who shall remain nameless (although one of them did run for President recently) voting against virtually every defense funding bill that came down the pike...

They cut Veterans benefits for injured soldiers. They put our country so far into debt my childrens grandchildren will be paying on it.

Oh, please. FDR started you on that road. Don't blame the relief pitcher when the starter gives up eight runs in the first inning.

Dead soldiers children will be paying off the national debt for a war based on lies and false hopes.

I'm impressed. That was, let's see...five, six...seven Democrat talking points in one post! Congratulations. The Brave Little Tailor himself could not have done better.

 

[Smoke Screen]

Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.

I agree! Have you seen the thread titled "Fascism Anyone?" If you definately feel this way, you should check it out: http://www.christianforums.com/t2020778-fascism-anyone.html

Apart from the Downing Street Memos, which apparently are being misinterpreted almost as much as the Vatican II documents, can you furnish any proof of this fantasy?

Sure. http://www.newamericancentury.org/RebuildingAmericasDefenses.pdf

http://icasualties.org/oif/

Thanks to Democrat Senators who shall remain nameless (although one of them did run for President recently) voting against virtually every defense funding bill that came down the pike...

This has nothing to do with what you quoted me as saying...

Oh, please. FDR started you on that road. Don't blame the relief pitcher when the starter gives up eight runs in the first inning.

FDR does not run the country now (either does Clinton). Nice try.

I'm impressed. That was, let's see...five, six...seven Democrat talking points in one post! Congratulations. The Brave Little Tailor himself could not have done better.

Thanks! With all the corruption involving the Bush Admin and the Iraq war, it's quite easy to throw in a talking point or two or three in a post! LOL!

 

[Borealis]

I agree! Have you seen the thread titled "Fascism Anyone?" If you definately feel this way, you should check it out:[/b][/color] http://www.christianforums.com/t2020778-fascism-anyone.html

I've seen a couple of dozen 'Fascism' threads that claim that the Bush Administration is just this side of the Nazis. I'll answer you in the same way I answer all of them: Hitler was a left-wing extremist, and the Nazi platform could easily be mistaken for the Democrat Party's platform.

This has nothing to do with what you quoted me as saying...

Oh, yes it does. If the Democrats, such as John Kerry, had actually supported the troops in ways other than meaningless words and voted to fund them properly (for example, proper body armor), the troops wouldn't have to deal with such issues now.

FDR does not run the country now (either does Clinton). Nice try.

I haven't even begun. See, up here in Canada we have this thing called the Liberal Party. For forty years, that party has driven this country into horrendous debt through massive deficit spending to support their social agenda (stop me if you've heard this proposed before). When Conservative governments were elected, they spent a good chunk of their time trying to control the utter economic mess left by their socialist predecessors, only to be blamed for being cruel and heartless. However, without the efforts of those Conservatives, the Liberals of the past ten years would never have been able to get the deficit down. Of course, they haven't let the newfound surplus go to their heads; they're still taxing the living hell out of us, even leaving in taxes that were supposed to be temporary measures to deal with the deficit.

Liberals spend taxpayers' money like there's no tomorrow. Bush is doing something similar, but instead of blowing it on stupid social programs that are proven to have failed each and every time they are tried, he's spending money on a war to spread democracy to a land that's never had it, to fighting terrorism across the globe, and to making real changes in the world instead of mouthing pathetic platitudes that never accomplish anything except temporary feel-goodness.

Thanks! With all the corruption involving the Bush Admin and the Iraq war, it's quite easy to throw in a talking point or two or three in a post! LOL!

The problem is, they are just that: talking points. They are quick soundbytes designed to grab people's attention, but they have no substance or, more importantly, truth to them. They are just empty platitudes designed to appeal to the political base, not to say anything meaningful.

 

[Voegelin]

We don't need an "independent" investigation. When Democrats ran the House they, rightly, did not call for them all the time. The job of Congress is oversight. We elect House members every two years so if they don't do proper oversight, we can kick them out. Congress is shirking it's duty when it appoints "independent" commissions.

The very idea that any commission will be "independent" is a joke anyways. Look at Volcker and the UN. Or the commission which is the subject of this thread--the "independent" 911 commission which had Gorelick and Ben-Veniste, fierce partisans, on it.

Better to put our congress critters themselves on TV holding hearings so we can see how they do and hold them accountable if they do not do the job they should.