A wierd sort of question

[PrincessFromOz]

My Bible college lecturer bought up a really interesting question the other day... it sort of ties your brain in knots...

"Do we worship our worship?"

In many churches I have noticed that sometimes we idolize our worship, and glorify the experience of worship, rather than glorifying the object of our worship - our wonderful God.

I always hear people say "what an awesome time of worship that was!", instead of "what an awesome God we worship!". But I don't think it's just to do with words - I think that sometimes we get hyped up with the emotion and feelings that we have during worship rather than seeking to honour and bless God. I mean, it's great to have a wonderful time of worship (don't get me wrong, I love to worship God), but worship itself is not the end, it's just the means. God is the end - he alone is all that matters, and he is the only one who should capture our hearts.

The question got me thinking anyway. What do you guys think?

 

[KleinerApfel]

Don't ever let anybody stop you enjoying your relationship with your Lord!

Our very reason for living is to commune with Him, He lay down His life to make the way for us to do that.

He enjoys the relationship - as we come into His presence through worship we give Him joy, and since the joy of the Lord is our strength, we are edified as He overflows that joy of His into us.

We begin by gazing in adoration at Him, and suddenly we find that He is gazing at us with a greater and purer love than we ever knew could exist.

As you say - He captures our hearts.
So doesn't your lecturer think it is normal to experience some kind of emotional response to having your heart captured?

God bless you, love Sue

 

[Jillymac]

I honestly think that many churches are in this exact situation. Songs can so often touch our emotional side. We then mistake high emotions for a move of God or God's power. This definitely happens in our church, my worship leader recently experienced an eye-opener in his life that made him realise this and he actually chose to not sing songs like "How Great is our God" very often because although they are magnificent worship songs with cracking lyrics, they seemed to stir up human emotion rather than a true experience of God. So people got mistaken that what they were feeling was God when it was actually their own emotions.

I'm praying for a real move of God.

 

[KleinerApfel]

Well yes, it's probably highly likely that some worship is askew, but how would I decide if anyone else around me has their heart in the right place when my own needs attention?

All of us can only do our best with what we have. Offer ourselves to God in the moment; that's all He wants.
We might get it "wrong" sometimes, but we have to take a risk and pour out our hearts anyway.

I'd much rather be among a worshippers who get a little over-emotional sometimes, (however we might define that for ourselves!), than in a place where emotional responses are either not expressed because of fear and repression and a stiff-upper-lip, or even worse, where there is no heartfelt response to God to be expressed.

Jilly - maybe your worship leader would like to write some new songs that are solemn and sedate and don't deal with anything that might stir the heart?
Spatch's lecturer might like those too.
Could narrow the options for worship a bit though...

Keep on worshipping as you love to, and allow yourself to enjoy it, knowing that God loves it too.
It's a major way of us keeping in touch with Him and receiving encouragement.


God bless, love Sue

 

[Mark2010]

It seems like emotion is an integral part of worship.

 

[PrincessFromOz]

No hang on don't misunderstand me guys... I wasn't talking about emotion in worship - I'm a huge believer in showing emotion - if we're not feeling something, then our heart isn't involved. That's not what i mean...

What I mean is, do some people idolise the experience of worship above God? It's important that we have great, amazing, worship times where people are sincerely on their faces in love with God, but it's important that we do not just desire the sessions of worship, but desire the God we worship.

I think we should be just as happy to worship God in our car with no music or out in a forest with no band, just as much as we are happy to worship him at a planetshakers conference or in church, when there's noone else around, and it's just us and God.

It's just one of those wierd questions that make me stop and think I guess... I always want to be sincere in my worship of God, and never to put anything (not the band... not the speaker, not the worship leader, or even the worship itself) before him.

 

[PrincessFromOz]

I honestly think that many churches are in this exact situation. Songs can so often touch our emotional side. We then mistake high emotions for a move of God or God's power. This definitely happens in our church, my worship leader recently experienced an eye-opener in his life that made him realise this and he actually chose to not sing songs like "How Great is our God" very often because although they are magnificent worship songs with cracking lyrics, they seemed to stir up human emotion rather than a true experience of God. So people got mistaken that what they were feeling was God when it was actually their own emotions.

I agree with you that sometimes we mistake high emotions for a move of God or God's power... especially as music is powerful; it tends to get adrenaline pumping (not to mention jumping around etc) more than any other form of communication.

HOWEVER, I don't think that this means we need to change to less emotional songs... Because we need to use our best songs that help us connect with God. So what should we do?

I guess when I worship God I always like to pull myself up if I'm not sincere... sometimes I'll find I'm singing with my eyes closed but my mind is somewhere else... I think the preparation for worship is important - we should stop and lay aside the things that happened in our day and other distractions and focus on what we are doing - worshipping God.

You know what I reckon the main issue is? Fear of God, or lack thereof. If we realised the immensity of the God we are worshipping, and his magnificence and power, I'm sure we would worship him with sincere hearts. But so often people are just going through the motions, singing the songs, and not really thinking about the awesome God they are worshipping.

I think if we all strove constantly to be people who worship Him "in Spirit and in truth", we might see God move in our worship even more.

 

[Jillymac]

Oh I agree, I wouldn't personally take away the songs, but I would try and emphasize that we shouldn't get caught up in the music but remember the words that we are singing and mean them with all our hearts. I love singing, i get lost in worship. I think the best way is to really forget everything else that is around us, and concentrate and focus as much as possible on God alone. Also it shouldn't matter what we're singing along to, we should still strive to be lost in worship to Him even if we're singing along to someone bashing a set of bongos! A lot of people in our church don't like the newer style of music, and will only sing to hymns, but that should not make any difference at all.

Also like you mentioned, we need to have the reverential fear of God, we need to let our spirits remind us when we're not paying attention or focusing on God.

 

[Citizen of the Kingdom]

I may be way off track, but there`s a song by Bob Carlyle called "feather in my cap" and it`s about how he does things right and is very humble about it but his actions produced feelings of pride in his right actions,and "a feather in his hat" The song goes wild and kinda spirals, showing how it`s a hard cycle to escape.
Do something right, act in proper fashion, pride in humility. Anywhere near the subject?

 

[lismore]

I always hear people say "what an awesome time of worship that was!", instead of "what an awesome God we worship!".

If it was a good time of worship then its good to share because~ if you dont comment the same atmosphere might not be brought again. Someone else might lead worship, a person without the same anointing. Some people also cannot sense in the same way. So I think its important to say if something worked well.

But I don't think it's just to do with words - I think that sometimes we get hyped up with the emotion and feelings that we have during worship rather than seeking to honour and bless God.

maybe the emotions do bless God? Look at David stripping off and dancing about? Or the woman who broke a jar of perfume on Jesus feet and then cried on them?

 

[janny108]

My Bible college lecturer bought up a really interesting question the other day... it sort of ties your brain in knots...

"Do we worship our worship?"

In many churches I have noticed that sometimes we idolize our worship, and glorify the experience of worship, rather than glorifying the object of our worship - our wonderful God.

I always hear people say "what an awesome time of worship that was!", instead of "what an awesome God we worship!". But I don't think it's just to do with words - I think that sometimes we get hyped up with the emotion and feelings that we have during worship rather than seeking to honour and bless God. I mean, it's great to have a wonderful time of worship (don't get me wrong, I love to worship God), but worship itself is not the end, it's just the means. God is the end - he alone is all that matters, and he is the only one who should capture our hearts.

The question got me thinking anyway. What do you guys think?

I understand your point and I think some folks do get a bit "carried away" with the dynamics of worship IN ITSELF.
Jan

 

[franky67]

My Bible college lecturer bought up a really interesting question the other day... it sort of ties your brain in knots...

"Do we worship our worship?"

In many churches I have noticed that sometimes we idolize our worship, and glorify the experience of worship, rather than glorifying the object of our worship - our wonderful God.

I always hear people say "what an awesome time of worship that was!", instead of "what an awesome God we worship!". But I don't think it's just to do with words - I think that sometimes we get hyped up with the emotion and feelings that we have during worship rather than seeking to honour and bless God. I mean, it's great to have a wonderful time of worship (don't get me wrong, I love to worship God), but worship itself is not the end, it's just the means. God is the end - he alone is all that matters, and he is the only one who should capture our hearts.

The question got me thinking anyway. What do you guys think?

Sounds as if your teacher has never entered into the presence of God.

Flesh can't stand before God without being completely broken.

As the prophet says it "I am undone"
Isaiah 6.5

 

[JimB]

Probably we too often do worship our worship. That is, when we are not worshipping our doctrine, or our pastor, or our spiritual gifts, or our denomination, or our favorite religious television celebrity, or our position in the church, or our quiet time, or ourselves …etc, etc, ad infinitum.

~Jim

 

[9-iron]

What I mean is, do some people idolise the experience of worship above God?

No doubt!

 

[New_Wineskin]

My Bible college lecturer bought up a really interesting question the other day... it sort of ties your brain in knots...

"Do we worship our worship?"

In many churches I have noticed that sometimes we idolize our worship, and glorify the experience of worship, rather than glorifying the object of our worship - our wonderful God.

I always hear people say "what an awesome time of worship that was!", instead of "what an awesome God we worship!". But I don't think it's just to do with words - I think that sometimes we get hyped up with the emotion and feelings that we have during worship rather than seeking to honour and bless God. I mean, it's great to have a wonderful time of worship (don't get me wrong, I love to worship God), but worship itself is not the end, it's just the means. God is the end - he alone is all that matters, and he is the only one who should capture our hearts.

The question got me thinking anyway. What do you guys think?

I quite agree . I have noticed this for a long time . One example is when the songs talk about the Lord in the third person . What is *that* all about ? Are we singing to each other all of the time ? I always change it to the second person .

 

[Questioning Christian]

I heard John Hagee make a statement one time which has always stuck with me. He said:

When a person finishes a song, do we exclaim "Oh, what a SINGER", or "Oh, what a SAVIOR" ??

 

[Questioning Christian]

The River Creed

Article I. We, the River, affirm that Christianese is now the official language of the United States.
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Article II. We, the River, affirm that henceforth, revival shall be called renewal, "slain in the spirit" shall be called "carpet time", "blessings" shall be called "soakings", "the move of God" shall be called "the river", and "the holiness of God" shall be called "the fire".
_____________________________________________

Article III. We, the River, affirm that the outdated terms "God", "Jesus", and "Holy Spirit" be replaced with references to "the wind", "the rain", "the quicksand", "the 12-point deer" and other metaphorically metaphysical terminologies.
_____________________________________________

Article IV. We, the River, affirm that we will form new churches "independent of denomination", [which we will later denominationally incorporate].
_____________________________________________

Article V. We, the River, affirm that we will not do outreaches to impact society, and that the more God does is more reason to celebrate by holding more meetings and dance longer.
_____________________________________________

Article VI. We, the River, affirm that we worship worship.
_____________________________________________

Article VII. We, the River, affirm that Holy Laughter is the best medicine, above laying on of hands and going to doctors.
_____________________________________________

Article VIII. We, the River, affirm that Third Street has the demon of alcoholism, Fourth Street has the demon of drugs and prostitution, Fifth Street has the demon of child abuse, and that we mapped this from inside the four walls of 129th Street without soiling our hands to actually go to any of those streets.
_____________________________________________

Article IX. We, the River, affirm that in the context of church services, any disorder or chaos automatically indicates the presence of the Holy Spirit ("the wind", because "ruach" means "spirit" or "wind") and therefore must be of God.
_____________________________________________

Article X. We, the River, affirm that the instability of traveling from River Church to River Church is okay, because stable=dead
_____________________________________________

 

[JimfromOhio]

Worship does not deal with what we make our bodies do, but worship consists of who we are, what our heart is feeling. There are different preferences of beliefs and different style of worship. Some prefer one worship style while other prefer another worship style. God knows every believers' hearts and God will accept any believers who truly worship from the HEART.

Romans 12:1-2 (NIV) Therefore, I urge you, brothers, in view of God's mercy, to offer your bodies as living sacrifices, holy and pleasing to God—this is your spiritual act of worship. Do not conform any longer to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God's will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will.

 

[SGM4HIM]

I think Matt Redman summed it up the best in this song "Heart of Worship"

When the music fades and all is stripped away
And I simply come
Longing just to bring something that's of worth
That will bless Your heart

I'll bring You more than a song
For a song in itself
Is not what You have required
You search much deeper within
Through the way things appear
You're looking into my heart

I'm coming back to the heart of worship
And it's all about You
All about You, Jesus
I'm sorry, Lord, for the things I've made it
When it's all about You
All about You, Jesus

King of endless worth, no one could express
How much You deserve
Though I'm weak and poor, all I have is Yours
Every single breath

 

[lovesblessing]

......was that alot of the songs being sung during the p/w service were all about the church and what God had done for them......it was human focused and not God focused.....

The reason it stood out for me, is because I have been listening to ministry from New Creation Church in Singapore......at the end of the teaching tapes, they usually put a worship song......and it is always a song about Jesus or Father God, and how awesome and wonderful He is.......not about what He has done for the church.......

I mean, it's okay to sing and be happy because of what God has done for you, He desires that we rejoice after all, but, when the main thrust is all about yourself and not about Jesus......that isn't really true worship of God.....at least, it isn't for me anymore......

lovesblessing