A very simple question.

[automan]

Because it was still in him from when he was 16, they got to him when he was young and it stuck, he now thinks it was his idea.

 

[AV1611VET]

Because it was still in him from when he was 16, they got to him when he was young and it stuck, he now thinks it was his idea.

Automan, here's how this works:

1. You plant the Word of God in someone when they're young, and others water it.

[bible]1 Corinthians 3:7[/bible]

2. Then something happens.

[bible]Isaiah 55:11[/bible]

3. Eventually they get saved.

[bible]Hebrews 10:17[/bible]

Salvation may come the first time they hear the Gospel, or the 100th time, or maybe not at all (unfortunately).

It clearly doesn't work that way with any other writing (Koran, Bhagavad-Gita, etc.).

God's Word only.

 

[Beastt]

Automan, here's how this works:

1. You plant the Word of God in someone when they're young, and others water it.

[bible]1 Corinthians 3:7[/bible]

2. Then something happens.

[bible]Isaiah 55:11[/bible]

3. Eventually they get saved.

[bible]Hebrews 10:17[/bible]

Salvation may come the first time they hear the Gospel, or the 100th time, or maybe not at all (unfortunately).

The problem is that it works the same way whether you plant God, Allah, The Creator, Apollo, Zeus or any other god. Osiris was offering people salvation 3000 years before Jesus was said to be born and the people who had that notion planted in their heads as children believed every bit as much (if not more), than Christians do of Jesus, today.

When a phenomenon can be shown to exist and function without regard to the specifics of the particular concept provided to spark the phenomena, it's not a rational demonstration that the concept is correct, but simply that the phenomena is consistent.

It clearly doesn't work that way with any other writing (Koran, Bhagavad-Gita, etc.).

God's Word only.

Which is how we can tell that this claim is completely devoid of merit.

 

[phsyxx]

Thaumaturgy, I am, of course, sorry you went through such hard times.

I am, however, very happy to see you alive and posting.

Go ahead and get mad at God and shake your fist at Him - (He can take it).

As long as you get over it, repent, and move on.

Like the song says: He was there all the time.

Why should he repent? What did he do wrong?

Incase you overlooked something here, it was God that didn't answer - or chose to answer with silence - not the wrongdoing of the person involved

 

[AV1611VET]

Why should he repent? What did he do wrong?

Incase you overlooked something here, it was God that didn't answer - or chose to answer with silence - not the wrongdoing of the person involved

I meant as long as he repents from shaking his fist at God --- not at what happened to him.

 

[phsyxx]

I meant as long as he repents from shaking his fist at God --- not at what happened to him.

Ok, in what particular direction do you suggest shaking the fist?
I prefer East, but I'm not sure if that's the Holiest of directions....

 

[automan]

The problem is that it works the same way whether you plant God, Allah, The Creator, Apollo, Zeus or any other god. Osiris was offering people salvation 3000 years before Jesus was said to be born and the people who had that notion planted in their heads as children believed every bit as much (if not more), than Christians do of Jesus, today.

When a phenomenon can be shown to exist and function without regard to the specifics of the particular concept provided to spark the phenomena, it's not a rational demonstration that the concept is correct, but simply that the phenomena is consistent.


Which is how we can tell that this claim is completely devoid of merit.

All religions know this to be a fact but they choose to ignore it because they convince
themselves that when they were indoctrinated they were lucky enough to be indoctrinated with
the one true religion, (no matter what the relgion is) sounds crazy I know but can you think of another explanation why none
of them will think about that question?
you would think every one of them would say to themselves
'everything I believe comes down to the luck of the draw'.

 

[thaumaturgy]

I meant as long as he repents from shaking his fist at God --- not at what happened to him.

No fist shaking necessary! Thanks to medical science!

Maybe God will help next time. He just opted not to on this one.

[bible]Matthew 7:8[/bible]

 

[AV1611VET]

Ok, in what particular direction do you suggest shaking the fist?
I prefer East, but I'm not sure if that's the Holiest of directions....

Take your pick:

• the local soup kitchen
• the local homeless shelter
• the local hospital
• the local jailhouse

[bible]Matthew 25:37-40[/bible]

 

[AV1611VET]

No fist shaking necessary! Thanks to medical science!

Maybe God will help next time. He just opted not to on this one.

[bible]Matthew 7:8[/bible]

You DO know the one prayer that Jesus prayed that God answered "No", don't you?

[bible]Matthew 26:39[/bible]

 

[Beastt]

All religions know this to be a fact but they choose to ignore it because they convince
themselves that when they were indoctrinated they were lucky enough to be indoctrinated with
the one true religion, (no matter what the relgion is) sounds crazy I know but can you think of another explanation why none
of them will think about that question?
you would think every one of them would say to themselves
'everything I believe comes down to the luck of the draw'.

I see this as pretty much the same phenomena as the man who proposes to the love of his life and receives acceptance. Even if all of his friends, his family and even some of her friends try to tell him they think she's after something other than a relationship with him, he's not likely to accept any of what they say as worthy of his serious consideration.

How many times do we see these scenarios play out on television programs such as Cold Case Files where nearly everyone a guy knows senses there's something wrong with his new fiancee's motives but he blindly refuses to hear them? Of course we usually hear about them because he's long-since deceased under suspicious circumstances and his widow is now living quite well on the money from his insurance policy, her inheritance, or both.

There are simply times when listening to reason is very difficult or nearly impossible because to do so might well mean sacrificing one of our dearest desires. In the case of the groom-to-be, he can't stand the thought that his intended wife doesn't love him. In the case of the theist, it's usually more of the loss of comfort and security brought about through a promise of eternal life in paradise and a reuniting with dead loved-ones.

In either case, the blindness is willful and designed to protect fragile beliefs. Sometimes the truth is just too painful for people to face reality, even when the evidences of reality should be overwhelming. I think the choice people make concerning what religion they should follow is a prime example of this. The mere numerical odds of selecting the "one true religion" (assuming such a thing even exists), are astronomically against the believer but because the loss they might feel through facing such a reality is so massive, they simply choose not to examine the evidence for fear they'll reach a conclusion they're psyche may be unable to handle.

 

[automan]

I see this as pretty much the same phenomena as the man who proposes to the love of his life and receives acceptance. Even if all of his friends, his family and even some of her friends try to tell him they think she's after something other than a relationship with him, he's not likely to accept any of what they say as worthy of his serious consideration.

How many times do we see these scenarios play out on television programs such as Cold Case Files where nearly everyone a guy knows senses there's something wrong with his new fiancee's motivesbut he blindly refuses to hear them. Of course we usually hear about them because he's long-since deceased and his widow is now living quite well on the money from his insurance policy, her inheritance, or both.

There are simply times when listening to reason is very difficult or nearly impossible because to do so might well mean sacrificing one of our dearest desires. In the case of the groom-to-be, he can't stand the thought that his intended wife doesn't love him. In the case of the theist, it's usually more of the loss of comfort and security brought about through a promise of eternal life in paradise and a reuniting with dead loved-ones.

In either case, the blindness is willful and designed to protect fragile beliefs.

I agree love is blind, and a longing to belong to something or someone causes inadequate people to flock to the cults,
and the longer it goes on the harder it is to admit you could have been wrong,
denial sets in and all kinds of problems arise,
perhaps the religious fanatic comes about when a person franticly tries to prove
to themselves their religion is not all a lie they eventually go over the top.

 

[thaumaturgy]

You DO know the one prayer that Jesus prayed that God answered "No", don't you?

[bible]Matthew 26:39[/bible]

That will be important when I'M the savior of mankind, actually God himself, sacrificing myself to myself to atone man to myself.

Until then, I'm merely a simple man and God doesn't talk to me, which leads my simple mind to one and only one conclusion:

he's not there.

But I'll keep you informed if I do turn out to be Jesus!

 

[AV1611VET]

That will be important when I'M the savior of mankind, actually God himself, sacrificing myself to myself to atone man to myself.

Until then, I'm merely a simple man and God doesn't talk to me, which leads my simple mind to one and only one conclusion:

he's not there.

But I'll keep you informed if I do turn out to be Jesus!

You do that, but keep in mind that He didn't talk to Jesus while Jesus was here either --- not once --- (at least, it's not recorded that He did).

In fact, on more than one occasion, God talked to everyone around BUT Jesus.

And I'll make this point again --- while I'm here in the flesh, I don't want God talking to me (audibly) --- I want it in writing.

 

[Pesto]

You do that, but keep in mind that He didn't talk to Jesus while Jesus was here either --- not once --- (at least, it's not recorded that He did).

In fact, on more than one occasion, God talked to everyone around BUT Jesus.

And I'll make this point again --- while I'm here in the flesh, I don't want God talking to me (audibly) --- I want it in writing.

Agreed. This is an open notice to God.

Every time I put a pencil down on a piece of paper, that is an invitation for Him to pick up the pencil and write me a note.

 

[AV1611VET]

Agreed. This is an open notice to God.

Every time I put a pencil down on a piece of paper, that is an invitation for Him to pick up the pencil and write me a note.

Have you read His first 66 notes to you?

 

[Pesto]

Have you read His first 66 notes to you?

<plays dumb>What notes?</plays dumb>

I read Jonah just yesterday. In church, no less.

 

[toddpianoworks]

Oh, come on. He was talking about chance in terms of good things or bad things happening, and who gets the credit/blame for those chance occurrences.

Except atheists. They always seem to decide for themselves.

 

[toddpianoworks]

Every time I put a pencil down on a piece of paper, that is an invitation for Him to pick up the pencil and write me a note.

Yeah, then you'll devise some scientific explanation as to why the pencil wrote you a note, lol.

 

[Pesto]

Yeah, then you'll devise some scientific explanation as to why the pencil wrote you a note, lol.

Nope. I see no way a pencil could write an intelligible note on its own.