A tough questions for a blind man...

k4c · Mar 21, 2011

ricker said:
Jews who were converted to Christianity were allowed to worship or rest on the sabbath as was their custom, as the verses show.
.
We would have heard a huge controversy if the Jews thought Gentiles were allowed to observe their special day. They were super protective of their Sabbath and would be appalled if Gentiles were to be allowed to participate.

The Sabbath was unarguably given to Israel as a sign per EX. 31. It is ceremonial in nature. Which other of the ten could be a sign? Could the command not to kill be a sign between Israel and God? Could the command to not take the Lord's name in vain be given as a sign? The Sasbbath was a sign between God and the nation of Israel and is never said to be relevant to the Christian movement.

God bless as you start the new week!

God can take something meant for His creation and use it as a sign of something else but that does not mean its not still important for the rest of the world. Did you know that the obeying the whole Law was supposed to be s a sign that we love God and man. As a matter offact, if we use idols in worship it means we hate God. Do you believe the rain bow is a covenant sign of a promise for Israel only or for the whole world?

The seventh day of creation was blessed, sanctified and called holy at creation before a Gentile or Jew ever existed. These words used by God to define the seventh day are important to grasp.

God reinstitued the Sabbath to the people He was calling out of the world. When we, Gentiles come to God we are grafted in and are given His Spirit in order that we walk in His ways and keep His Law. This is the promise of the new covenant. Keeping the Sabbath holy in light of what it represents is for mankind, this is how it was under the old covenant as well. Remember, Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath. The word (the) identifies a spesific thing. If Jesus is your Lord then the Sabbath is your day as well.

realtruth101 · Mar 21, 2011

EastCoastRemnant said:
Gen 17:4
As for me, behold, my covenant is with thee, and thou shalt be a father of many nations.

Not just the one nation of Israel.

Gen 18:18
Seeing that Abraham shall surely become a great and mighty nation, and all the nations of the earth shall be blessed in him?

All peopels were to benefit from this covenant.

Deut 4:6-8
Keep therefore and do them; for this is your wisdom and your understanding in the sight of the nations, which shall hear all these statutes, and say, Surely this great nation is a wise and understanding people.

For what nation is there so great, who hath God so nigh unto them, as the LORD our God is in all things that we call upon him for?
And what nation is there so great, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day?

They were to be an example to the world, a beacon on a hill.

Matt 5:14
Ye are the light of the world. A city that is set on an hill cannot be hid.

Yes this was the NT but who was Jesus speaking to here? The Jews... this was not a new concept but one that God's people had long ago forgotten.

These are supposed to prove a Abraham spearheaded a campaign to bring all nations under God?........I believe any evangelistic campaign by Abraham would of more resembled the lives of the Amish and Mennonite communities, peaceful quiet lives, Isreal was to separate themselves from the world, not be joined to the world

realtruth101 · Mar 21, 2011

EastCoastRemnant said:
So you do not believe that we are also spiritual Israel? That we are Abrahams seed? Why would God have a bias towards one group of people exclusively? Are we not all His creation? How do you view the gentiles in Moses day? Were they not subject to the same Laws as the Israelites? Did they not also receive the Law at Sinai?

Also, why is a sign a ceremonial law? A sign is a covenant and a mark of our allegiance to the creator, is it not?

Its very obvious you should keep the Sabath, as a Holy day, or it will be a sin if you don't. but the new testiment, The new Covenant, has freed us from such traditition as a gentile believer, you possibly are not a gentile and these laws are written on your heart, so you should keep them, but the bible is very clear for us who have accepted what is taught about these special days. you could make everyday Holy and receive even a greater blessing than just the one, as long as its done unto the Lord. but I would stick just with the one as it has you pretty wrapped up all ready....God bless

k4c · Mar 21, 2011

realtruth101 said:
Its very obvious you should keep the Sabath, as a Holy day, or it will be a sin if you don't. but the new testiment, The new Covenant, has freed us from such traditition as a gentile believer, you possibly are not a gentile and these laws are written on your heart, so you should keep them, but the bible is very clear for us who have accepted what is taught about these special days. you could make everyday Holy and receive even a greater blessing than just the one, as long as its done unto the Lord. but I would stick just with the one as it has you pretty wrapped up all ready....God bless

There is no such thing as a Gentile believer...you have been deceived.

http://www.christianforums.com/t7545567/#post57027817

EastCoastRemnant · Mar 21, 2011

realtruth101 said:
Its very obvious you should keep the Sabath, as a Holy day, or it will be a sin if you don't. but the new testiment, The new Covenant, has freed us from such traditition as a gentile believer, you possibly are not a gentile and these laws are written on your heart, so you should keep them, but the bible is very clear for us who have accepted what is taught about these special days. you could make everyday Holy and receive even a greater blessing than just the one, as long as its done unto the Lord. but I would stick just with the one as it has you pretty wrapped up all ready....God bless

Why could you not answer one of the many questions I asked in the post you quoted?

I thank you for recognizing that God's Laws are written on my heart but they are to be written on every believers heart.

Joe67 · Mar 21, 2011

EastCoastRemnant said:
Why could you not answer one of the many questions I asked in the post you quoted?

I thank you for recognizing that God's Laws are written on my heart but they are to be written on every believers heart.

ECR,

Two Words are enough to fulfill all things.

Joe

Cribstyl · Mar 21, 2011

k4c said:
The very words holy (regarded as deserving special respect or reverence), sanctified (to set apart for sacred use; consecrate) and blessed (to invoke divine favor upon) carry meanings that deserves mankind's attention.

If the words "blessed and sanctified" requires man to do something to keep God's rest Holy it would have been written. Truth is God's rest and Sabbath day are two different events. The 4th commandment proves it, if people dont inject commentary.

The Sabbath as a sign of the covenant is only one use of the Sabbath day. It's also used as a sign of creation and it's Creator. It's also a sign that when people remember to keep it holy it tells people around them which God they serve. It also separates a people for God that He can call His own. A people He calls, a royal priesthood, a peculiar people, a holy nation and the Israel of God.

There are several reasons given to keep the sabbath....It was not given at creation and you cannot seperate the children of Israel from the sabbath no matter how you twist the word of God.

By the way, where did God get the idea that the seventh day was anything special anyway? Why not use the 6th day as the sign of the covenant since man was created on the 6th day. Do you think that maybe it's because the seventh day was created a special and holy day in the begining?

You dont have a clue, so any answer I give would be ignored.

Just because God uses a holy thing as a sign or a symbol does not make it void for anything else. God uses marriage as a symbol of the relationship between Him and His people but that does not make void marriage itself.

here we go again with how you apply God's word to understanding.

I don't expect you to be able to receive the same deep spiritual truths as ECR, you have to have eyes to see and ears to hear. This is why I've so patient with you. Maybe God will grant you repentance.

You dont have a clue and He's a SDA yes-man.

Just some food for thought.

Jesus kept the Sabbath holy and He's called, the last Adam. In other words, Jesus did what Adam should have done.

Another falsely reasoned teaching taken from the context that Jesus is called the last Adam.
1Cr 15:45And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam [was made] a quickening spirit.

Joe67 · Mar 21, 2011

Cribstyl said:
If the words "blessed and sanctified" requires man to do something to keep God's rest Holy it would have been written. Truth is God's rest and Sabbath day are two different events. The 4th commandment proves it, if people dont inject commentary.

There are several reasons given to keep the sabbath....It was not given at creation and you cannot seperate the children of Israel from the sabbath no matter how you twist the word of God.

You dont have a clue, so any answer I give would be ignored.

here we go again with how you apply God's word to understanding.

You dont have a clue and He's a SDA yes-man.

Another falsely reasoned teaching taken from the context that Jesus is called the last Adam.
1Cr 15:45And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam [was made] a quickening spirit.

Cribstyl,

Amen, concerning soul and spirit.

Heb 4:12
12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit,... KJV

We need to discern the distinction between soul and spirit, then we will be given to see their unity in Jesus Christ, who of two is made one new man, thereby making peace between Gentile and Jew.

Our soul is delivered from hell (the free gift of justification and peace with God). Our spirit will be saved (from sin) as our bodies are handed over to Satan on the day of the Lord and Satan's agents do with us as they did to our Lord on Calvary and as they did to Stephen the day of his stoning. Both cried out for their spirit to be received.

The Jews stoned for blasphemy.

The Romans crucified for political crimes.

Herod cut off the head of James, to do the Jews a favor.

2 Cor 4:16-17
6 For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.

17 For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, worketh for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory; KJV

Joe

k4c · Mar 21, 2011

Cribstyl said:
If the words "blessed and sanctified" requires man to do something to keep God's rest Holy it would have been written. Truth is God's rest and Sabbath day are two different events. The 4th commandment proves it, if people dont inject commentary.

There are several reasons given to keep the sabbath....It was not given at creation and you cannot seperate the children of Israel from the sabbath no matter how you twist the word of God.

You dont have a clue, so any answer I give would be ignored.

here we go again with how you apply God's word to understanding.

You dont have a clue and He's a SDA yes-man.

Another falsely reasoned teaching taken from the context that Jesus is called the last Adam.
1Cr 15:45And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam [was made] a quickening spirit.

You're not allowed to play until you answer my question.

Cribstyl · Mar 21, 2011

EastCoastRemnant said:
Crib, it saddens my heart that you may be lamenting your stubborness when standing outside the city, unless you open your eyes.

Dude, dont get too personal with me, you come off as bipolar with mean spirited edges. (you will try to run me off for not agreeing with the commentary of others that you're quick to agree with.)

If you cannot see the direct link between these two verses my friend, there is no sense in any of us here continuing to dialogue with you on this subject..

Ex 20:10,11
But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:

For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

Gen 2:3
And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

It's exactly the same language Crib...

Also, how can you say that the seventh day and Sabbath are not interchangeable in Exodus 20:11? The mention of the seventh day is sandwiched in between two Sabbath statements.... please brother, open your heart to the truth!

First of all, you're being deceptive. If you added Exd 20:9Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: ...you will quickly see that it's not talking about "God's 6days of creation" nor His seventh day rest. So the seventh day you're being ask to keep as a Sabbath is not directly connected to day#7 of creation. It is a simply a sign of the seventh day of creation.

What exactly are you afraid of? Do you think God will be upset for keeping the seventh day or are you just hardened to principle??

I dont add commentary to God's word and then call you blind for not believing my spin.

Cribstyl · Mar 21, 2011

k4c said:
You're not allowed to play until you answer my question.

You've got the Question game down to a science dont you?
You created this thread to call me "the blind man" #4 . I walked into the trap and you want to have all control.
I replied to the OP, answered questions and also posted questions in this thread.

I've played your games too long and not held you accountable for your commentary.

Let's see who will play along with your Q games.

Cribstyl · Mar 21, 2011

realtruth101 said:
Its very obvious you should keep the Sabath, as a Holy day, or it will be a sin if you don't. but the new testiment, The new Covenant, has freed us from such traditition as a gentile believer, you possibly are not a gentile and these laws are written on your heart, so you should keep them, but the bible is very clear for us who have accepted what is taught about these special days. you could make everyday Holy and receive even a greater blessing than just the one, as long as its done unto the Lord. but I would stick just with the one as it has you pretty wrapped up all ready....God bless

Keep speaking the truth friend, but these guy will ignor what you're saying because their teachings is based on misrepresenting you and God's word. They will not reply directly because their comment will be exposed by the very scriptures they post or ignor in context.
You'll tell them that sin is not an option, but they will claim you're giving a liscense to sin.

Blessing

Cribstyl · Mar 21, 2011

Every thread can be a continuing argument if we dont respond to the points made by those who reply to our post.

realtruth101 · Mar 21, 2011

k4c said:
There is no such thing as a Gentile believer...you have been deceived.

http://www.christianforums.com/t7545567/#post57027817

Well then I've been deceived by the Apostle's themselves and they will have to answer for it when I stand in judgement,......read more listen less

realtruth101 · Mar 21, 2011

EastCoastRemnant said:
Why could you not answer one of the many questions I asked in the post you quoted?

I thank you for recognizing that God's Laws are written on my heart but they are to be written on every believers heart.

well I would answer your questions, but we both know, no matter what my answers are, they would serve no good purpose, and be a waste of my time. First thing you need to understand is the historical history of your faith, and its failures in Prophecies. when your able to grasp that false prophets were the founding fathers of your faith, you should get a big fat red flag that there might be other false teaching and doctrine woven into your faith. But you fail to understand this most basic principle of discernment. This is why I'm not a Jehovahs witness and Mormon a Catholic, and many other denominations that have proven themselves by their own historical record to be in complete error of the teachings we find written in the bible. The bible is true, and yes! keeping the commandments is part of the true faith, we can find Jesus telling us what the ten commandments are in a much simplified version where the ten can be broken down to just TWO, and if I follow the two that Jesus gave me, I will be in full compliance with the law. your error is your still under the old covenant and wish that everyone would join you. Its not going to happen the wild branch grafted in knows better.

EastCoastRemnant · Mar 21, 2011

Cribstyl said:
I dont add commentary to God's word and then call you blind for not believing my spin.

You just did Crib...

You dont have a clue and He's a SDA yes-man.

Since our reconciliation Crib, I have not disparaged you once even though you've wandered back to your sarcastic language.

The comment 'SDA yes man' is offensive to me as it implies that I am ignorantly believing and following a doctrine. Do you address the people you attend Sabbath worship with the same way... believe it or not, many of them will have the same traditional views as K4C and myself.

I really hope you can approach the dialogue here with a better spirit... I'm pretty sure your real life character is not what you sometimes exibit here.

EastCoastRemnant · Mar 21, 2011

Cribstyl said:
Keep speaking the truth friend, but these guy will ignor what you're saying because their teachings is based on misrepresenting you and God's word. They will not reply directly because their comment will be exposed by the very scriptures they post or ignor in context.
You'll tell them that sin is not an option, but they will claim you're giving a liscense to sin.

Blessing

The more people that come into the traditional Adventist forum and try to convince us that our doctrine is wrong, it only solidifies my belief.

Are you making the same comments in other denominations rooms ie: JW, Mormons etc or are we just special... it seems to me that Satan would want to attack the truth...

EastCoastRemnant · Mar 21, 2011

realtruth101 said:
First thing you need to understand is the historical history of your faith, and its failures in Prophecies. when your able to grasp that false prophets were the founding fathers of your faith, you should get a big fat red flag that there might be other false teaching and doctrine woven into your faith.

Would you be so kind to point out some of these failed prophesies?

Thanx...

Cribstyl · Mar 21, 2011

EastCoastRemnant said:
You just did Crib...

You ignored Ex20:9 from your post and by adding it into the context it belongs, exposes your commentary as false. Now show me what, I added to God's word concerning your post?

Since our reconciliation Crib, I have not disparaged you once even though you've wandered back to your sarcastic language.

I can show you different, but let's not even go there. The truth always come out.

The comment 'SDA yes man' is offensive to me as it implies that I am ignorantly believing and following a doctrine. Do you address the people you attend Sabbath worship with the same way... believe it or not, many of them will have the same traditional views as K4C and myself.

A "yes man" often says Amen without explaining what He understands. That's all I mean to say by that.

I really hope you can approach the dialogue here with a better spirit... I'm pretty sure your real life character is not what you sometimes exibit here.

Being "the blind man" in this thread, I've made valid arguments that are always ignored because I wont accept commentary that contradicts God's word, and then being forced to answer questions after questions with no response.

K4c methods will be exposed and you'll show your true colors as ususal.

Cribstyl · Mar 21, 2011

EastCoastRemnant said:
The more people that come into the traditional Adventist forum and try to convince us that our doctrine is wrong, it only solidifies my belief.

Did'nt have to wait long for you to misrepresent me or other people who come here in fellowship.
You're well known for agreeing with every K4c thread with "Amen". This post show how you feel about me agreeing with RT101 because I said "

to his post. What's up with that?

Are you making the same comments in other denominations rooms ie: JW, Mormons etc or are we just special... it seems to me that Satan would want to attack the truth...

I'm in the family whether you like it or not. You comparing SDA churches or other churches has nothing to do with what you and K4c are presenting without responding to rebuttals.

A tough questions for a blind man...

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