A Third Temple Is A Slap Across Christ's Face.....

Straightshot · Aug 7, 2015

"Come on now. If you believe that the old covenant is still in play, surely it's not so difficult for you to convince us. Explain how a covenant that has been described as old and obsolete can still hold value in the eyes of the Lord."

The Lord has not broken His covenant with Israel .... and never will

And He will confirm this truth during the 70th week decreed for a believing remnant part of the nation

And by the way, I am not trying to convince you and your fellow preterists of anything .... I am using your off course ideas for the purpose of teaching against them on this forum .... a place where you are not even to be .... but I like your presence

Carry on

Straightshot · Aug 7, 2015

"It doesn't get much clearer than that. We are citizens of Israel"

Not unless you are of ethnic Israel .... if so which tribe are you from? [Revelation 7:1-8]

Do you know what the Lord has said about those who claim to "spiritual" Jews and are not? [Revelation 2:9; 3:9]

LastSeven · Aug 7, 2015

Straightshot said:
"It doesn't get much clearer than that. We are citizens of Israel"

Not unless you are of ethnic Israel .... if so which tribe are you from? [Revelation 7:1-8]

Do you know what the Lord has said about those who claim to "spiritual" Jews and are not? [Revelation 2:9; 3:9]

Are you saying that only those who were already Israelites ethnically, were granted citizenship to Israel through Christ?

LastSeven · Aug 7, 2015

Straightshot said:
"Come on now. If you believe that the old covenant is still in play, surely it's not so difficult for you to convince us. Explain how a covenant that has been described as old and obsolete can still hold value in the eyes of the Lord."

The Lord has not broken His covenant with Israel .... and never will

But if Israel has broken the covenant with the Lord, then is the covenant not broken?

Straightshot · Aug 7, 2015

He has not broken it .... this is what you say

He has punished the nation, but continues to honor His covenant .... His requirement to continue .... that Israel repents and tuns to Him as Messiah and King .... this a remnant will do

The Lord knows that this is coming .... and He waits for the day ... and He will make good by His covenant with Israel

Enough on this subject for now .... you simply are unwilling to grasp this truth which is recorded in you bible

I will watch your postings and may check in on you from time to time

Argumentation with a preterist does have some value to a point .... and then the discussion tails off into a boring conversation

LastSeven · Aug 7, 2015

But it's when we get down to the "conversation" that we really begin to understand each other. It sure beats, "you're wrong. no you are. you don't know what you're talking about. you're ignoring scripture. etc."

parousia70 · Aug 7, 2015

Straightshot said:
His requirement to continue .... that Israel repents and tuns to Him as Messiah and King .... this a remnant will do

This a Remnant ALREADY DID. Remnant Israel was John the Baptist, Mary, Joseph, Jesus, Elisabeth, the 12, the 70, the 3000 at Pentecost, and the great many jews that first rejected but later accepted Jesus Christ. These Remnant Jews are true Israel.

These followers of Jesus rightfully claimed that THEY were true Israel and not their unbelieving kin (Gal 6:15-16; Phil 3:3; 1 Peter 2:9, etc).

Paul points out that jews that are not "circumcised of Heart" are actually to be recognized as heathen (Romans 2:25-29) and that gentiles who were displaying circumcision of the heart are counted as "circumcision" (jewish).

Paul goes on to point out that "They are not all Israel who are OF Israel; nor are they all children because they are the seed of Abraham" (Romans 9:6-7). So you must not forget to account for these jews/sons of Abraham that Paul does NOT consider special at all. In fact, these jewish sons of Abraham are not actually "ISRAEL" even though they are "OF" Israel. They are fully disinherited as also described in Galatians 4:24-31.

Finally, Paul is arguing that a blindness came over memebers of Israel so that the gentiles could join into the true Israel. The result is: "AND SO (i.e. in this way) ALL ISRAEL SHALL BE SAVED." Paul argued all along for a defining of Israel that excludes unbelieving natural-born sons of Abraham and includes believing non-genetic sons of Abraham.

This re-constitution of Israel under Jesus Christ happened in the 1st century and forced the cutting off of the unbelieving jews from among the People of God (as Moses had foretold -- Acts 3:22-24). Jews that reject Jesus hate Jehovah too (John 15:23-24;1 John 2:23). They are heathen in the exact same way as all other pagan peoples of the earth.

The inclusion of the gentiles into Christ's Israel happened during the ministry of the apostle Paul whose ministry alone was responsible for making the gentiles joint heirs and sons of Abraham along with the genetic sons of faith (Eph 3:1-13). We that are gentiles have received the fullness -- we have obtained sonship and are full sons and co-heirs and co citizens of Israel. This happened 19 centuries ago.

Gideon · Aug 7, 2015

LastSeven said:
Ephesians 2:19
Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and strangers, but fellow citizens with God’s people and also members of his household.

It doesn't get much clearer than that. We are citizens of Israel.

Heck, even I can understand that.

Jipsah · Aug 7, 2015

Straightshot said:
You might as well find something else to do jip .......... all you have is a boring excuse

Yeah, I reckon the New Covenant of our Lord is just a boring excuse, no need to hang onto it once there's a nice new temple to sacrifice sheep and doves and such in.

Jipsah · Aug 7, 2015

BABerean2 said:
If you don't like the message, attack the messenger...
.

It's always easier, especially when you know you don't have a leg to stand on.

Jipsah · Aug 7, 2015

Straightshot said:
I will remind you that you need to dump your preterism against the Lord's more sure word of prophecy

So we can become Neo-Jews in The Millennium, bound under the Law, the Cross of Christ having been set aside? I reckon I'll pass.

.... and if the Lord wants to give the mortals of the millennium symbolic reference on this issue which He is going to do .... who are you tell anything different

Sorry, but it's your lot who believe that load of hogwash; it has nothing to do with God at all.

In a risky business you are .... do not second guess Him [Ezekiel 40-48]

So is it your belief that: A) the writer of Hebrews got it all wrong, B) that Hebrews is valid now, but will become null and void in The Millennium, C) that Hebrews was simply included in the Canon of Scripture by mistake, or D) all of the above?

.... what you spout does not matter

Kinda like the letter to the Hebrews, huh?

Jipsah · Aug 7, 2015

Straightshot said:
No .... the other half that the preterism intentionally skews or leaves out completes the whole truth .... and nothing but the truth The selected shunted preteristic story by itself is a dangerous doctrine not to be entertained .... and it is not the only one

Just out of curiousity, have you ever actually read Hebrews? Or is it just too "preterist" for you?

Jipsah · Aug 7, 2015

Straightshot said:
You are mixing His covenant of salvation for both "Jew" and Gentile with no regard for national identity with the continuing covenant that He has with His nation of Israel with regard for national identity

Yep, standard New Religion boilerplate. Nothing to do with Scripture, though.

You really need to open up the New Testament some time. If you aren't skeered it'll woo you away from your dreams of sacrificing a sheep in the Millennial Temple, that is.

Jipsah · Aug 7, 2015

BABerean2 said:
The writer of the Book of Hebrews clearly stated that the covenant you quoted from the Old Testament was fulfilled in the New Covenant of Jesus Christ.
It is in effect now.

Trick is that these folks have decided that, since Hebrews pretty much sinks their doctrine without a trace, that it will cease to be true after Temple Judaism is restored in The Millennium. (Straightshot hasn't had the chutzpah to say so directly, but others of his persuasion, notably Biblewriter, have been less shy about saying what they actually believe.)

Such Dispensationalist luminaries as John N. Darby, William Kelly, W. E. Blackstone, C. I. Scofield and others, believe that the church was unknown to the prophets, and view the present age as a “parenthesis” in God’s plan, which according to them, is really focused upon the future of the Jews. Most of them have stopped short of openly proclaiming the return to Temple Judaism that has become increasingly common amongst younger Dispys. But the New Religion DFs are merely carrying their beliefs to their logical conclusion, without regard to whether it conflicts with New Testament Scripture or not.

It could not be any clearer... The Old Covenant is finished.
However, the Judaizers could not let go of it.

Click to expand...

They just dodge it by claiming that Hebrews ceases to be valid in The Millennium. Handy, huh?

Jipsah · Aug 7, 2015

Straightshot said:
And He will confirm this truth during the 70th week

Except that the 70th week followed immediately after the 69th (imagine that!). The prophecy meant pretty much what it said, whether your doctrine can stand it or not.

And by the way, I am not trying to convince you and your fellow preterists of anything

I'd say you're certainly succeeding at not convincing anyone of anything.

I am using your off course ideas for the purpose of teaching against them on this forum

Teaching whom? Others who can't or won't read any of the New Testament other than Matthew 24 and the Revelation?

.... a place where you are not even to be

I'm an orthodox Preterist, SS, and we're explicitly mentioned as being welcome here. But then you to tend to substitute your own "meanings" for things, don't you?

Jipsah · Aug 7, 2015

Straightshot said:
Argumentation with a preterist does have some value to a point .... and then the discussion tails off into a boring conversation

Right up to the point where you realize that you're being thrashed, I'd say. <Laugh>

BABerean2 · Aug 7, 2015

I have been forced to the conclusion that it is a doctrine of "Ignorance" and "Stubbornness".

The only way one can make it work is by ignoring what is plainly written in the New Testament.

Some people are just too stubborn to ever admit they were wrong, even when faced with the words written in God's Word.

Some of those most opposed to the doctrine are former Dispensationalists who finally overcame both their "Ignorance" and their "Stubbornness".
.

Jipsah · Aug 7, 2015

BABerean2 said:
Some of those most opposed to the doctrine are former Dispensationalists who finally overcame both their "Ignorance" and their "Stubbornness".

I know, I'm one of them. I was a Hal Lindsey - Salem Kirban - John Hagee kinda guy. Right up until I was shown how pernicious and contrary to Scripture their teachings actually are.

Reyes4Christ · Aug 15, 2015

Tim Myers said:
In the mind and beliefs of true Christians, wouldn't the reinstitution of animal sacrifice be a slap in the face of Christ Himself and all that they believe in?? Yet, I have heard and read about countless evangelicals who are more than willing to slap Christ across the face if it means the hastening of the Second Coming. They believe, the sooner the Temple is built, the sooner Christ will return and set up His millennial kingdom.

You are spot on. This is the worst thing that can happen in our time. It is the abomination that causes desolation. It is the reason Satan can appear. It is the reason the Holy Spirit and the believers in Christ are raptured. It causes the end of the Church age and the begging of Daniels 70th week. It is the nexus point of all the new testament. Every warning points to it and everything bad that comes, comes out of it. It is the UNresurrection. The third temple might as well be called the synagog of satan. The third temple will be built in the next several years and anyone still alive during that time who does not want to take part in the great deception better be praying for salvation that entire time because the rapture happens around that time because of what they do in the temple.

When you see the sacrificial animal standing where it should not be standing (because there is no need to sacrifice an animal to God anymore since Jesus became the sacrifice and doing so is an abomination to God) you better start running because you only have a short time before they cut its throat. When that happens all bets are off on your ability to be raptured. Especially if you are watching this live on TV.

Straightshot · Aug 15, 2015

My comment

The next temple of the Lord's will be built just after the battle of Armageddon at the end of the tribulation [Ezekiel 40] .... the Lord will require memorial sacrificing during His coming millennial kingdom of mortals

There will be no tribulation temple of His on the mount [Revelation 11:2]

The temple that Satan's beast in the human little horn sits in will a pagan temple of his "god"

This temple is already on the mount as we speak

A Third Temple Is A Slap Across Christ's Face.....

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