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A Russian Witch-Hunt
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Susan
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Same old same old though. . .Russia seems to be a real nest for this kind of thing. IIRC, the Aum cult used to be quite popular (17,000 to 30,000 active members at its height in early 1995) and before that it was the White Brotherhood cult.I don't know why, but the society there seems really attracted to anything that can pronounce powers, whether it be a crazed "guru" telling everyone that killing will make them holy or a mystic proclaiming that she can heal with toilet paper and "energized salve."
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nephilimiyr and Susan-
Ukraine is a hotbed of this sort of thing too. Nearly every metro stop has a kiosk full of New Age, Pagan or Satanist lit. Most of the young men I work with here have been involved in one sort of paganism or another along the way. There has always been a strain of Russian sectarianism, but I think more emphasis should be put on Nietzsche's "rain of gods." The vaccum opened up by the fall of the national religion of Communism has left the people searching for answers.
Some really good things are happening. For instance, the number of Evangelical churches in Ukraine is doubling every 8 years. On the other hand, every aberrant sect and idea imaginable has poured into the country.
There is a large movement of pagans called "Tolkienisti" (really!) over here. Back Stateside most of my friends were neo-pagans, everything from shamans to Nordic god worshipers. I'm planning to start hanging out and hopefully ministering to Tolkienisti this summer...
Susan-
Sorry to digress, but I'm hoping to add an anime page to my website soon. Do you know any good sites for Christian otakus, etc? In addition to those in your sig... If so, could you drop me an E at Discoshaman@saintly.com?
I'm jonesing for anime over here. Someone is about to send my 10 CDs of Ranma MP4s, which should help a bit...
Ukraine is a hotbed of this sort of thing too. Nearly every metro stop has a kiosk full of New Age, Pagan or Satanist lit. Most of the young men I work with here have been involved in one sort of paganism or another along the way. There has always been a strain of Russian sectarianism, but I think more emphasis should be put on Nietzsche's "rain of gods." The vaccum opened up by the fall of the national religion of Communism has left the people searching for answers.
Some really good things are happening. For instance, the number of Evangelical churches in Ukraine is doubling every 8 years. On the other hand, every aberrant sect and idea imaginable has poured into the country.
There is a large movement of pagans called "Tolkienisti" (really!) over here. Back Stateside most of my friends were neo-pagans, everything from shamans to Nordic god worshipers. I'm planning to start hanging out and hopefully ministering to Tolkienisti this summer...
Susan-
Sorry to digress, but I'm hoping to add an anime page to my website soon. Do you know any good sites for Christian otakus, etc? In addition to those in your sig... If so, could you drop me an E at Discoshaman@saintly.com?
I'm jonesing for anime over here. Someone is about to send my 10 CDs of Ranma MP4s, which should help a bit...
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I was hopeing you would see this thread and reply SemperReformanda, thanks for the input! Your in ministry over there right? Those teenagers over there need direction and I hope you can help.
You got alot of guts to be over there. It's something I'm not sure if I'd do to be totally honest with you. I'll start praying for you! God Bless!
You got alot of guts to be over there. It's something I'm not sure if I'd do to be totally honest with you. I'll start praying for you! God Bless!
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nephilimiyr-
That's incredibly kind of you to say, but I can't take any credit for the work I'm doing. And this isn't false piety. I really have seen over and over how limited I am, and anything good that comes of my work here is because of God's grace. In spite of my faults though, God IS moving over here. Ukraine has never had a true Reformation, but the last few years have begun what may well become one.
All-
Before any pagans get offended, I want to be quick to clarify my earlier statement. I am NOT equating Satanism and Paganism. They are two entirely different religions. I respect Paganism as a genuine group of religions, on par with Islam or any other. I think Paganism deserves this recognition.
My comments are in the context of Christian belief, which sees all of these various sectarian movements as false. In that sense I can speak of Satanism and Paganism in the same sentence, as both come under the heading of sectarian. Just wanted to clarify.
That's incredibly kind of you to say, but I can't take any credit for the work I'm doing. And this isn't false piety. I really have seen over and over how limited I am, and anything good that comes of my work here is because of God's grace. In spite of my faults though, God IS moving over here. Ukraine has never had a true Reformation, but the last few years have begun what may well become one.
All-
Before any pagans get offended, I want to be quick to clarify my earlier statement. I am NOT equating Satanism and Paganism. They are two entirely different religions. I respect Paganism as a genuine group of religions, on par with Islam or any other. I think Paganism deserves this recognition.
My comments are in the context of Christian belief, which sees all of these various sectarian movements as false. In that sense I can speak of Satanism and Paganism in the same sentence, as both come under the heading of sectarian. Just wanted to clarify.
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Susan-
You're just so much fun to digress WITH, I suppose.
Back on topic... (said sternly)
One point I make with people often when explaining how popular these types of sects and cults are here is that the people have very little spiritual discernment. The Orthodox Church is popular in a brand-name affiliation sort of way, but it certainly isn't educating many of them in the basics of the faith. Further, it doesn't exactly thrust Bibles into the people's hands, so they don't have a reservoir of the Word with which to refute the false teachers.
Another reason is that it was already VERY popular on an underground level before the fall. Particularly New Age stuff. They just cloaked it in a pseudo-science rather than using spiritual terminology and that was good enough for the censors. There was practically a fistfight not long after Independence when a group of New Age "doctors" demanded to be let into a scientific symposium on biology. They were demanding a hearing for their theories on bio-rhythms.
Thirdly, the region basically entered the post-modern world overnight. For 70 years they had a defined worldview, religion and philosophy which tolerated little dissent. Suddenly they woke up one day and were told that pluralism was the order of the day and that their religion was dead. Changes that took place over 30 years during America's slow glide path to cultural decline took place almost instantly here. When pluralism hit, it hit hard.
Anyway, just a few thoughts.
You're just so much fun to digress WITH, I suppose.
Back on topic... (said sternly)
One point I make with people often when explaining how popular these types of sects and cults are here is that the people have very little spiritual discernment. The Orthodox Church is popular in a brand-name affiliation sort of way, but it certainly isn't educating many of them in the basics of the faith. Further, it doesn't exactly thrust Bibles into the people's hands, so they don't have a reservoir of the Word with which to refute the false teachers.
Another reason is that it was already VERY popular on an underground level before the fall. Particularly New Age stuff. They just cloaked it in a pseudo-science rather than using spiritual terminology and that was good enough for the censors. There was practically a fistfight not long after Independence when a group of New Age "doctors" demanded to be let into a scientific symposium on biology. They were demanding a hearing for their theories on bio-rhythms.
Thirdly, the region basically entered the post-modern world overnight. For 70 years they had a defined worldview, religion and philosophy which tolerated little dissent. Suddenly they woke up one day and were told that pluralism was the order of the day and that their religion was dead. Changes that took place over 30 years during America's slow glide path to cultural decline took place almost instantly here. When pluralism hit, it hit hard.
Anyway, just a few thoughts.
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Blessed-one
a long journey ahead
are they really concerned with the spirituality of the country or is it just because the religions are gaining in power?
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blessed one-
are they really concerned with the spirituality of the country or is it just because the religions are gaining in power?
I'll give an answer to this question, hope you don't mind me jumping in.
It depends on how one defines "spirituality." The fact is, the Orthodox Church has a medieval view of religious freedom, and views anyone operating in Russia or Ukraine as an invader. Here in Kiev, for example, Orthodox churches were doing the "liturgy against the enemy" when the Pope came to town. The last time this was done, as I understand it, was during the invasion by Hitler.
It grieves me to see how nakedly political the Orthodox Church has become. There are three branches of it here in Ukraine, and they literally fight physically for control of various monasteries and churches. A nun was killed awhile back in Western Ukraine under very suspicious circumstances.
Evangelicals spoke out eloquently for freedom for the Orthodox Church during the Cold War, and lobbied Washington to press the Soviets for more religious liberty for Orthodox Christians.
Their repayment in the post-Cold War era has been a constant campaign of harrassment and low-level official persecution at the instigation of the Orthodox. Protestant churches are closed in Russia on the flimsiest pretexts, discriminatory laws are passed, and Christian workers are arbitrarily deported.
It's sad, but the Orthodox have formed an unholy alliance with the Communist and former Communist parties, who have their own reasons for hating Protestants and Catholics. It's breathtakingly hypocritical--the victim and the persecuter now joining forces to persecute others.
In some ways it isn't THAT surprising, given that about 1/3 of the Orthodox priesthood was actively Communist. The only priest ever to win the Order of Lenin (for his work as a KGB informant in Estonia) is Alexey II. He's the Patriarch of the Russian Orthodox Church now. Nice. Pastor Gleb Yakunin has done some brave work calling the hierarchy to accountability, but to little avail.
I've focused on the crusade against Protestants because it serves to illustrate just how wide the focus is of this witch hunt. Protestants are habitually lumped in with dangerous "sects" as a threat to national security.
So I'm not surprised to see this article, it fits the current M.O.
are they really concerned with the spirituality of the country or is it just because the religions are gaining in power?
I'll give an answer to this question, hope you don't mind me jumping in.
It depends on how one defines "spirituality." The fact is, the Orthodox Church has a medieval view of religious freedom, and views anyone operating in Russia or Ukraine as an invader. Here in Kiev, for example, Orthodox churches were doing the "liturgy against the enemy" when the Pope came to town. The last time this was done, as I understand it, was during the invasion by Hitler.
It grieves me to see how nakedly political the Orthodox Church has become. There are three branches of it here in Ukraine, and they literally fight physically for control of various monasteries and churches. A nun was killed awhile back in Western Ukraine under very suspicious circumstances.
Evangelicals spoke out eloquently for freedom for the Orthodox Church during the Cold War, and lobbied Washington to press the Soviets for more religious liberty for Orthodox Christians.
Their repayment in the post-Cold War era has been a constant campaign of harrassment and low-level official persecution at the instigation of the Orthodox. Protestant churches are closed in Russia on the flimsiest pretexts, discriminatory laws are passed, and Christian workers are arbitrarily deported.
It's sad, but the Orthodox have formed an unholy alliance with the Communist and former Communist parties, who have their own reasons for hating Protestants and Catholics. It's breathtakingly hypocritical--the victim and the persecuter now joining forces to persecute others.
In some ways it isn't THAT surprising, given that about 1/3 of the Orthodox priesthood was actively Communist. The only priest ever to win the Order of Lenin (for his work as a KGB informant in Estonia) is Alexey II. He's the Patriarch of the Russian Orthodox Church now. Nice. Pastor Gleb Yakunin has done some brave work calling the hierarchy to accountability, but to little avail.
I've focused on the crusade against Protestants because it serves to illustrate just how wide the focus is of this witch hunt. Protestants are habitually lumped in with dangerous "sects" as a threat to national security.
So I'm not surprised to see this article, it fits the current M.O.
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Blessed-one
a long journey ahead
still sounds like a political oriented "activity".
not at all, thanks for the infor.
not at all, thanks for the infor.
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blessed one-
still sounds like a political oriented "activity".
It IS politically-oriented. The Orthodox Church has involved itself heavily in politics, and the persecution of minority religions is one of their key focuses. And aside from this, there is no real understanding of religious plurality among the population at large. To be Russian is to be Orthodox (or an atheist Communist, that's hunkey-dorey too.) Let's just say that not many government officials have "Celebrate Diversity" bumper stickers on their Volgas.
still sounds like a political oriented "activity".
It IS politically-oriented. The Orthodox Church has involved itself heavily in politics, and the persecution of minority religions is one of their key focuses. And aside from this, there is no real understanding of religious plurality among the population at large. To be Russian is to be Orthodox (or an atheist Communist, that's hunkey-dorey too.) Let's just say that not many government officials have "Celebrate Diversity" bumper stickers on their Volgas.
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Wolseley
Beaucoup-Diên-Cai-Dāu
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This seems like an extension of the traditional Russian xenophobia, which in a way, is sort of understandable. Every time the Russians have gotten involved with anybody from "the outside", they've gotten the snot beaten out of them....first it was the Huns and the Mongols, then the Vikings, then the Teutonic Knights, then the Turks, then the Japanese, then the Germans, and then the Germans again......
The only luck they ever had with anybody was with the French.
Good heavens, I had no idea.
Judging from his attitudes and actions (which I can only describe as being just plain arrogant and nasty), it doesn't surprise me, however.
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