A re-examination of nothing (2)

Phinehas2 · Feb 26, 2008

Dear EnemyPartyII

A. Jonathon and David.

How can a heterosexual be homosexual? The Bible says David was attracted to women and slept with them, I call that heterosexual, so it cant be homosexuality, nor does the Bible say David slept with Jonathan.

big on civil discussion. Sadly, some of our fellow Christians aren't

All the Christians I see here are big on civil discussion.

EnemyPartyII · Feb 26, 2008

k2svpete said:
How about looking at it in context? David was approved of God and had the support of the people. Saul was put on the throne by men, little wonder he was feeling insecure.

Curious tht the whole "David anointed by God" has so much in common with the "annointed by God" back stories of so many other usurpers... from Persius through Oedipus, Ay, Arthur, Henry VII, Washington...

all have their own little "annointed by God" back story...

Guess its also coincidence how many usurpers wriggle into the corridors of power through being the homosexual lover of the heir apparent... but I guess David is the one exception huh?

EnemyPartyII · Feb 26, 2008

Phinehas2 said:
Dear EnemyPartyII
How can a heterosexual be homosexual? The Bible says David was attracted to women and slept with them, I call that heterosexual, so it cant be homosexuality, nor does the Bible say David slept with Jonathan.

All the Christians I see here are big on civil discussion.

we've been through this... bisexuals can have homosexual relationships.

k2svpete · Feb 26, 2008

Men claiming to be anoited by God is one thing. God demonstrating it is another thing entirely. Apples with apples.

You are familar with the story of David and Goliath aren't you? If not, have a little read of it. That will show you how David came to prominence with Saul.

k2svpete · Feb 26, 2008

Indeed but David was anointed by God (2 Sam 12). God doesn't place his anointing on those deliberately operating outside his will.

Phinehas2 · Feb 26, 2008

Dear EnemyPartyII,

we've been through this... bisexuals can have homosexual relationships.

We have indeed been through this. Firstly a bisexual can also have a heterosexual relationship, but you are claiming homosexuality not heterosexuality. Secondly the only evidence for David sleeping with anyone, is with women, so where did you even get the Bisexual idea from let alone the homosexual.
You cant use this assumption as your answer as its disputed as without any evidencial basis.

Also please dont keep reporting me, you seem to be doing so on almost every post, my inbox is full.

EnemyPartyII · Feb 26, 2008

k2svpete said:
Men claiming to be anoited by God is one thing. God demonstrating it is another thing entirely. Apples with apples.

You are familar with the story of David and Goliath aren't you? If not, have a little read of it. That will show you how David came to prominence with Saul.

and history, being writeen by the victors, is always totally factual and accurate, is it?

EnemyPartyII · Feb 26, 2008

Phinehas2 said:
Dear EnemyPartyII,
We have indeed been through this. Firstly a bisexual can also have a heterosexual relationship, but you are claiming homosexuality not heterosexuality. Secondly the only evidence for David sleeping with anyone, is with women, so where did you even get the Bisexual idea from let alone the homosexual.
You cant use this assumption as your answer as its disputed as without any evidencial basis.

Also please dont keep reporting me, you seem to be doing so on almost every post, my inbox is full.

If people are reporting you, maybe you should stop breaking the rules?

Anyway you look at it, David and Jonathon's relationship looks like a homosexual relationship. I put it to you, in fact, that you will never encounter a strictly heterosexual "friends" relationship that looks anything like it. Therefore, the only logical inference, is that they were homosexually involved.

If david was bisexual, that neatly explains both his homosexual affair with Jonathon and his hetero one with Bathsheba

k2svpete · Feb 26, 2008

EnemyPartyII said:
and history, being writeen by the victors, is always totally factual and accurate, is it?

No, but the Bible being written under the influence of the Holy Spirit is. Unless you reject that too?

k2svpete · Feb 26, 2008

EnemyPartyII said:
Anyway you look at it, David and Jonathon's relationship looks like a homosexual relationship. I put it to you, in fact, that you will never encounter a strictly heterosexual "friends" relationship that looks anything like it. Therefore, the only logical inference, is that they were homosexually involved.

If david was bisexual, that neatly explains both his homosexual affair with Jonathon and his hetero one with Bathsheba

Rubbish. The term gay has been perverted from what it orginally meant so much so that if I said I went to a party and it was a 'gay affair', people would think I'm referring to some homosexual conference. This is where the impurity of our thoughts debases the basic elements of true love, friendship and relationships.

The assertion that this 'the only logical inference, that they were homosexually involved.' is as flawed as the assertion that it is impossible for males and females to have a platonic friendship, or that a man can be interested in a woman for more than just sex.

Phinehas2 · Feb 26, 2008

Dear EnemyPartyII

If people are reporting you, maybe you should stop breaking the rules?

I am not breaking the rules, and if I were to would be decided by the moderators not the poster reporting.

Anyway you look at it, David and Jonathon's relationship looks like a homosexual relationship.

No it looks like a strong friendship as they loved each other, it was with women that David slept.

I put it to you, in fact, that you will never encounter a strictly heterosexual "friends" relationship that looks anything like it. Therefore, the only logical inference, is that they were homosexually involved.

And I have put it to you that love as sex isn’t a Biblical notion, even Jesus loved His disciples and said they were to love Him more than anyone else. No there is no sexual inference there at all. If David had slept with Jonathan like he did with the woman on the roof Bathsheba, then yes but as he didn’t no.
Remember, even the woman went through purification, these guys followed OT laws such as Leviticus 18 and 20, David sinned in murder and adultery, if the prophet didn’t tell him and He didn’t realise he sinned in same-sex sex one can be sure he didn’t.
Remember also that your assumption in these scriptures is on top of your rejection of the scriptures which condemn same-sex sex, so its obvious for us that there is no same-sex inference in the slightest.

EnemyPartyII · Feb 26, 2008

k2svpete said:
No, but the Bible being written under the influence of the Holy Spirit is. Unless you reject that too?

Under the influence of, not inerantly dictated by... two different things, lets not mix them up, huh?

EnemyPartyII · Feb 26, 2008

Remember, even the woman went through purification, these guys followed OT laws such as Leviticus 18 and 20, David sinned in murder and adultery, if the prophet didn’t tell him and He didn’t realise he sinned in same-sex sex one can be sure he didn’t.

OR... that his same sex sex wasn't a sin... equally valid interpretation.

Remember also that your assumption in these scriptures is on top of your rejection of the scriptures which condemn same-sex sex, so its obvious for us that there is no same-sex inference in the slightest.

wha...? So now your telling me which scriptures I can and can't interpret?

Phinehas2 · Feb 26, 2008

Dear EnemyPartyII,

Under the influence of, not inerantly dictated by... two different things, lets not mix them up, huh?

No they are the same as the Holy Spirit leads in truth and thus couldnt influence error whetjer inspired or dictated.

k2svpete · Feb 26, 2008

EnemyPartyII said:
Under the influence of, not inerantly dictated by... two different things, lets not mix them up, huh?

No, in the case of scripture is is very much an unerring work. I don't know if you are aware but as scrolls were copied if the writer made the slightest mistake, the copy was burned and the process started again. That's how seriously the word was taken.

You think those doing the writing in the first place would be even more diligent?

Questioning the accuracy of scripture as God's word is a bad place to be for anyone professing to be a Christian. It's already been pointed out to you the accuracy of the text anyway so why do you persist in going back to the same argument?

Phinehas2 · Feb 26, 2008

Dear EnemyPartyII

OR... that his same sex sex wasn't a sin... equally valid interpretation.

No that’s not valid as you have no evidence that same-sex sex wasn’t a sin, Lev 18 & 20 is evidence that is was. That’s like me saying murder and adultery wasn’t a sin, ist also bsed on rejecting the evidence.

wha...? So now your telling me which scriptures I can and can't interpret?

No I am telling you what the scriptures previously placed before you say which you reject.

Phinehas2 · Feb 26, 2008

Questioning the accuracy of scripture as God's word is a bad place to be for anyone professing to be a Christian. It's already been pointed out to you the accuracy of the text anyway so why do you persist in going back to the same argument?

This is correct, one cant profess to believe in someone whose testimony one doesnt believe is accurate.

OllieFranz · Feb 26, 2008

Phinehas2 said:
Dear EnemyPartyII
How can a heterosexual be homosexual? The Bible says David was attracted to women and slept with them, I call that heterosexual, so it cant be homosexuality, nor does the Bible say David slept with Jonathan.

So you are claiming that David could not have been gay because he married women? In the history of the world there has never been a gay man who married a woman? Or that there has never been a closeted gay man who could perform sexually with women?

Or are you saying that this is a special case, because it involves "a man after God's own heart." And that even if the passage did describe them as havong a physical relationship in terms that in other couples would clearly be read as sexual, you would still believe that it was "just a chaste friendship"? That would be an indication that you have made up your mind before looking at the evidence.

Besides, not only does David say of Jonathan: "Thy love to me was wonderful, passing the love of women," but if you examine the scriptures, you will see that nowhere in his relationships with women is David said to love any of them.

EnemyPartyII · Feb 26, 2008

Phinehas2 said:
Dear EnemyPartyII
No that’s not valid as you have no evidence that same-sex sex wasn’t a sin, Lev 18 & 20 is evidence that is was. That’s like me saying murder and adultery wasn’t a sin, ist also bsed on rejecting the evidence.

No I am telling you what the scriptures previously placed before you say which you reject.

the fact that David wasn't condemned for his homosexuality is evidence that its not a sin *geez* this is like pulling teeth! If it was a sin, he'd have been condemned for it... he WASN'T condemned for it, ergo, its not a sin!

Phinehas2 · Feb 26, 2008

Dear Olliefranz,
No I am claiming someone who sleeps with someone of the opposite sex, like David did with the woman, is a heterosexual. EnemyPartyII referred to David and Jonathan as a homosexual relationship. Love isnt sex, Jesus loved His disciples enough to die for them, He didnt have sex with them. There is no greater love than a man lay down his life for his friend, David and Jonathan were prepared to do that for each other so great was their love.. forget the sex its a perversion of the love the story tells us.

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