A question about tithing (Catholics only, please)

[PloverWing]

This question is for information-gathering only, to help me understand our Episcopal congregation better.

I am on the vestry (lay leadership body) of an Episcopal parish. We are considering strongly encouraging the members of our congregation to begin tithing, partly to help fund a new ministry that our congregation is genuinely excited about. I want to get a sense of how new a concept this will be for our members.

I was raised Baptist, and Baptists are taught about tithing from the earliest years. $1 allowance? put 10 cents in the offering plate. It can be a legalistic concept in some very bad ways, and it can rest on bad hermeneutics, but it can also be a good and fair way to fund a church. Episcopal churches don't generally teach children about tithing, so this is not a habit our cradle Episcopalians are used to.

About half of our members were raised Catholic. Does the Catholic Church raise its members to expect to tithe (or to give N% of their income, for some N)? Will this be a new concept for our former-Catholic members, or can we simply say that what the nuns taught you growing up was a good idea all along? In general, what philosophy or set of rules does the Catholic Church give its members to guide them in deciding how much to donate to their parishes each year?

Thanks for your help. Again, I'm just looking for information here. No arguments, please -- especially no arguments from non-Catholics! This is OBOB, the Catholic forum.

 

[Michie]

I was not raised Catholic. I’m a convert. I was taught that tithing is time, talent, and treasure. Which makes sense to me for parishioners in different positions. Fundraisers are deliberate in asking for funds for a project.

 

[RileyG]

I was not raised Catholic. I’m a convert. I was taught that tithing is time, talent, and treasure. Which makes sense to me for parishioners in different positions. Fundraisers are deliberate in asking for funds for a project.

I've been taught the same thing and I'm a cradle Catholic.

 

[Gnarwhal]

About half of our members were raised Catholic. Does the Catholic Church raise its members to expect to tithe (or to give N% of their income, for some N)? Will this be a new concept for our former-Catholic members, or can we simply say that what the nuns taught you growing up was a good idea all along? In general, what philosophy or set of rules does the Catholic Church give its members to guide them in deciding how much to donate to their parishes each year?

I'm not cradle Catholic so I can't speak to how Catholics are raised re: tithing, but I know the Church generally says "please give if your means allow." There can be multiple collections at Mass, but nobody is ever obligated to give.

My wife was raised Catholic (though not a faithful one per se until recent years) but since she's Hispanic I think the idea of giving to the Church is still tightly woven into her DNA. So the idea that the money is God's anyway is pretty deeply rooted in her. So she's always tried hard to give even when things feel tight, and she often comments how when she gives in those hardest moments God provides a way to get through whatever financial difficulty she's in.

Also, to add to what @Michie said, the Church doesn't necessarily consider tithing to be only our monetary contributions. If we don't have the financial means but we have other resources to offer the Church those are welcome too.

 

[pdudgeon]

I also am not a cradle Catholic, but I was raised in the Methodist Church, and they were tithers.
In fact, there was always a great effort put in by the finance committee every year to encourage members to contribute to the Church. And there was a competition to see who could get the largest number of committed contributes.
But I really heard more about tithing in my young adult years, and tithing was encouraged; not as a set amount, but (and this was important) as a starting point in the giving. And exercising your faith in asking God to help you, ( by His managing your expenses before they arrived) so that all the tithe that you promised would make it into the offering plate.
Yep, those were the days of exercising your faith in God, and especially in His provision!!!

 

[pdudgeon]

But it wasn't just the tithe that was stressed. There was also a great stress put upon two more things related to giving:
1. Faithfulness and 2. Gratitude!
Yep! They taught a full measured lesson about giving back to God in those days, and they weren't shy about doing so either.

 

[eastcoast_bsc]

Cradle catholic here and we were never taught the idea of tithing. We were taught you give what you can.

 

[PloverWing]

But I really heard more about tithing in my young adult years, and tithing was encouraged; not as a set amount, but (and this was important) as a starting point in the giving. And exercising your faith in asking God to help you, ( by His managing your expenses before they arrived) so that all the tithe that you promised would make it into the offering plate.

Just to clarify: Is this description of your young adult years a description of Methodists or Catholics? (I'm not sure when you became a Catholic.)

 

[chevyontheriver]

This question is for information-gathering only, to help me understand our Episcopal congregation better.

I am on the vestry (lay leadership body) of an Episcopal parish. We are considering strongly encouraging the members of our congregation to begin tithing, partly to help fund a new ministry that our congregation is genuinely excited about. I want to get a sense of how new a concept this will be for our members.

I was raised Baptist, and Baptists are taught about tithing from the earliest years. $1 allowance? put 10 cents in the offering plate. It can be a legalistic concept in some very bad ways, and it can rest on bad hermeneutics, but it can also be a good and fair way to fund a church. Episcopal churches don't generally teach children about tithing, so this is not a habit our cradle Episcopalians are used to.

About half of our members were raised Catholic. Does the Catholic Church raise its members to expect to tithe (or to give N% of their income, for some N)? Will this be a new concept for our former-Catholic members, or can we simply say that what the nuns taught you growing up was a good idea all along? In general, what philosophy or set of rules does the Catholic Church give its members to guide them in deciding how much to donate to their parishes each year?

Thanks for your help. Again, I'm just looking for information here. No arguments, please -- especially no arguments from non-Catholics! This is OBOB, the Catholic forum.

I never heard the word 'tithe' growing up. We had a sense that we should contribute. Just not a strict 10%. That idea only entered my head later when I heard it from evangelicals.

I heard it mentioned in a previous parish where they suggested a percentage for the church and another for other charities. It was always a suggestion rather than a rule. And it came with the mention that some who are more blessed (they know who they are) should give even more and those who have less should not feel bad about giving even proportionally less. There was no aspect of it being a binding rule.

I won't say that no parish officials ever watched and accounted for what was given, but I have never felt second or third class for my giving. And for the most part I haven't experienced anything like the high pressure fund-raising of one non-denominational place I went to for a visit that had three collections in one service, and three sermonettes basically on giving more money in the same service. Their music was rock concert too loud as well.

The upshot is Catholics don't tithe. We aren't told we have to either. Some of us give a great deal. Some give nothing. Some in the middle. We are asked to give something for the support of the church and most of us do.

 

[pdudgeon]

Just wanted to add that tithing is a Biblical directive, found in the OT.
First, when God divided the land that He gave to the 10 tribes, His directive ( and provision for the tribe of Levi was that they should become the priests, and from the offerings given to God by the other Tribes, they should take ten per cent as their provision.
Secondly, the idea of giving back to God in gratitude for His help and protection is also from the OT, where a king won a battle against another people, and in gratitude, that King took the top ten per cent ( in other words, the very best) of his battle spoils and gave it as an offering to God in gratitude and thanks for his victory.
It is from these historical examples that the idea and practice of tithing came down to us today.
BTW, the Jews still practice this, as did the Jews in Jesus' day as well.
So yes, tithing was a recognized biblical practice, and one practiced by Jesus Himself.

 

[pdudgeon]

Just wanted to add that tithing is a Biblical directive, found in the OT.
First, when God divided the land that He gave to the 10 tribes, His directive ( and provision for the tribe of Levi was that they should become the priests, and from the offerings given to God by the other Tribes, they should take ten per cent as their provision.
Secondly, the idea of giving back to God in gratitude for His help and protection is also from the OT, where a king won a battle against another people, and in gratitude, that King took the top ten per cent ( in other words, the very best) of his battle spoils and gave it as an offering to God in gratitude and thanks for his victory.
It is from these historical examples that the idea and practice of tithing came down to us today.
BTW, the Jews still practice this, as did the Jews in Jesus' day as well.
So yes, tithing was a recognized biblical practice, and one practiced by Jesus Himself.

It was then known as "The Temple Tax" to distinguish it from the tax levied by Rome.

 

[WarriorAngel]

I'm cradle Catholic and it's always been 'whatever you can afford'.
Fund raisers bring in money for whatever...and or a second collection for that specific purpose.

 

[pdudgeon]

I'm cradle Catholic and it's always been 'whatever you can afford'.
Fun raisers bring in money for whatever...and or a second collection for that specific purpose.

Yes, they do, and our parish has those too.
But for the basic church budget requirements, ( electric bill, sewer, trash collection,etc.) meeting that expected amount of required money should be the goal of the pledged support given by the members.

So it's quite simple: If you want to worship in a comfortably heated or cooled church, be prepared to get your wallet out.
If you want there to be enough of the Eucharist for all, get your wallet out.
If you want to have a priest available, ...well by now you know the answer.

 

[Bob Crowley]

Like some of the others here I'm a Catholic convert. Originally Presbyterian, but at no time did I hear a literal ten percent as a sort of compulsory donation, although I remember my original pastor saying "If everybody gave ten percent, the finance committee wouldn't know what to do with it! ... Well, not for a while anyway!"

On the other hand, I did attend another church on a few occasions. It had big plans and they were pushing pretty hard for donations. I was amazed at some of the pledges - I remember one young couple who pledged about $10,000 over a couple of years towards building their new church. And that was quite a lot of money 35 or so years ago.

You'd be hard pressed to make that sort of approach in a Catholic Church.

My experience as a Catholic is that finance is not pushed very hard. I think part of the reason is that there are several non-tithe collections promoted during the year, and priests are wary of getting heavy if you know what I mean. A lot of the younger families have children in Catholic schools and they pay for that as well.

I've heard several Catholics say that it's a case of giving as God has given to us. Some are better off than others - some are wealthy, and others struggle from week to week on a pension. I'm reminded of the poor widow "who gave all she had to live on" (I sometimes wonder if she found the larder full when she got back home, or whether Christ just left her in her poverty without even the two copper coins to get through the week, but we're not told), whereas the rich men gave out of all their wealth and hardly missed it.

My own personal policy is that I sort of aim towards ten percent, but that's including both church and charities. I rarely get there, and now that I'm retired my giving has decreased a bit. I just use the ten percent as a sort of hopeful guideline.

Back then the tithe and other collections were a form of tax. These days we pay tax to the government and a lot of it (although we get a lot back in various services - I sometimes wonder how governments make ends met - I don't think they do to be honest - defence, police, emergency services, hospitals, health, eduction, roads, pharmaceutical benefits scheme, social security, rubbish colection and recycling, public transport, grants, parks, gardens, sporting fields and facilities, national parks, water supply, airports, electrical supply, telecommunications and all the rest).

With your fifty percent former Catholics, I don't think I'd push the tithe concept too far. I think you'd be better to sell the new ministry in its own right. You could make reference to the OT tithe, but I'd be wary about pushing it too hard.

 

[eastcoast_bsc]

Yes, they do, and our parish has those too.
But for the basic church budget requirements, ( electric bill, sewer, trash collection,etc.) meeting that expected amount of required money should be the goal of the pledged support given by the members.

So it's quite simple: If you want to worship in a comfortably heated or cooled church, be prepared to get your wallet out.
If you want there to be enough of the Eucharist for all, get your wallet out.
If you want to have a priest available, ...well by now you know the answer.

Most priest that do weddings etc. also get a free meal and free drinks plus a stipend in cash.

 

[Michie]

Most priest that do weddings etc. also get a free meal and free drinks plus a stipend in cash.

Definitely. As they should.

 

[WarriorAngel]

Like some of the others here I'm a Catholic convert. Originally Presbyterian, but at no time did I hear a literal ten percent as a sort of compulsory donation, although I remember my original pastor saying "If everybody gave ten percent, the finance committee wouldn't know what to do with it! ... Well, not for a while anyway!"

On the other hand, I did attend another church on a few occasions. It had big plans and they were pushing pretty hard for donations. I was amazed at some of the pledges - I remember one young couple who pledged about $10,000 over a couple of years towards building their new church. And that was quite a lot of money 35 or so years ago.

You'd be hard pressed to make that sort of approach in a Catholic Church.

My experience as a Catholic is that finance is not pushed very hard. I think part of the reason is that there are several non-tithe collections promoted during the year, and priests are wary of getting heavy if you know what I mean. A lot of the younger families have children in Catholic schools and they pay for that as well.

I've heard several Catholics say that it's a case of giving as God has given to us. Some are better off than others - some are wealthy, and others struggle from week to week on a pension. I'm reminded of the poor widow "who gave all she had to live on" (I sometimes wonder if she found the larder full when she got back home, or whether Christ just left her in her poverty without even the two copper coins to get through the week, but we're not told), whereas the rich men gave out of all their wealth and hardly missed it.

My own personal policy is that I sort of aim towards ten percent, but that's including both church and charities. I rarely get there, and now that I'm retired my giving has decreased a bit. I just use the ten percent as a sort of hopeful guideline.

Back then the tithe and other collections were a form of tax. These days we pay tax to the government and a lot of it (although we get a lot back in various services - I sometimes wonder how governments make ends met - I don't think they do to be honest - defence, police, emergency services, hospitals, health, eduction, roads, pharmaceutical benefits scheme, social security, rubbish colection and recycling, public transport, grants, parks, gardens, sporting fields and facilities, national parks, water supply, airports, electrical supply, telecommunications and all the rest).

With your fifty percent former Catholics, I don't think I'd push the tithe concept too far. I think you'd be better to sell the new ministry in its own right. You could make reference to the OT tithe, but I'd be wary about pushing it too hard.

Give in secret and you are blessed in return.

Jesus knew it was all she had. He said you're paid back 100 times. I'm sure she ate well and had all she needed the rest of her life because simple faith.

Douay-Rheims Bible
Mark 10:30
Who shall not receive an hundred times as much, now in this time; houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions: and in the world to come life everlasting.

 

[pdudgeon]

I also aim at 10 per cent, divided between my local parish, my diocese, 4 religious foundations/missions, a political group, and people who really work hard, but are currently short of funds.
Usually all that totals up to more than 10 per cent, but I consider it money well spent, and I don't miss it, because my own needs are small and easily filled.
I just look at it as giving God a helping hand, and it's a privilege.

 

[pdudgeon]

Forgot to mention feeding and housing 6 wonderful cats, all of whom were homeless, skinny, and starving when they found me. They are wonderful friends and excellent company.

 

[chevyontheriver]

Give in secret and you are blessed in return.

Jesus knew it was all she had. He said you're paid back 100 times. I'm sure she ate well and had all she needed the rest of her life because simple faith.

Douay-Rheims Bible
Mark 10:30
Who shall not receive an hundred times as much, now in this time; houses, and brethren, and sisters, and mothers, and children, and lands, with persecutions: and in the world to come life everlasting.

I have the sense that for the most part your giving to the Church is relatively anonymous. Somebody records it for tax purposes but the pastor may not even know who gives what. I have felt that some other kinds of Christians keep a much closer eye on it all, and will let you know if you should be giving more. Never felt that in the Catholic Church.