A curious question..

[Lillen]

I see we have finally met eachother. We can agree on that...

 

[Blackwater Babe]

You're all trying to make me look stupid, aren't you?? I say this once again, navigating to a unknowned territory is impossible the way you do it. They could not know that the terrotry was there in the first place making it imossible to know whether to go to south, north, east or west.

This is how you explore:

You take one star when entering the unknowned. A star that indicates to you it will take you to heaven. You pull the star down from the sheet up there and let it be the sun during day. You follow that sun until next night and repete that until you find heaven. Sailing on the stars to heaven is possible. Colombo did that so can you...

I'm gunna go ahead and assume this is a language difficulty...

But, I was taught in the scouts and the army to do it this way:

At night, find the Southern Cross and the Two Pointers, draw a line perpendicular to the line between the two pointers, when it meets a line drawn and continuing on from the two stars in the Cross furthest apart, drop a line from the point they bisect to the horizon, and thats south.

During the day, point the 12 of an analogue watch at the sun, and half way between the hour hand and the 12 points north.

Worked as well as any magnetic compass for us!

 

[Lillen]

so tell me, using 12 o clock sun (as we also been taught), and using stars your way, which direction shall i go to meet my sister? I know i am in northern sweden! Or better, which way should you go to meet my sister!?

It is impossible for you to know, no!? same way -it was impossible to malyasians to know which way to go to find hawaii.

Exploration as many has mentioned it, only looks for signs using your methods... such as seagals flying close and so on. But it is impossible to navigate to an unknowned target, of the obious reason that it is unknowned...

 

[Blackwater Babe]

so tell me, using 12 o clock sun (as we also been taught), and using stars your way, which direction shall i go to meet my sister? I know i am in northern sweden!

if you give me a starting destination and an end destination, I could tell you.

If you're just going for an explore, then you navigate to tell where you are in relation to where you've come from, not where you are going to.

 

[Lillen]

So we are finally in agreement...

 

[Tiberius]

Lillen, are you ignoring me? I stated quite clearly in post 81 of this thread that your argument only works if they were heading for a specific destination. If they are simply sailing around, perhaps just for fishing, then they can come across other islands by accident.

Let me repeat post 81 for you...

You are assuming that these people were intentionally sailing to undiscovered islands, and they went directly there. Both of these assumptions are unwarranted. They could have been sailing for other reasons, and they may have taken a circuitous route the first time they went there, gradually developing a more and more direct route.

 

[TLK Valentine]

You're all trying to make me look stupid, aren't you??

Not trying very hard.

I say this once again, navigating to a unknowned territory is impossible the way you do it. They could not know that the terrotry was there in the first place making it imossible to know whether to go to south, north, east or west.

it's called "exploring" -- people have done it all the time.

This is how you explore:

You take one star when entering the unknowned. A star that indicates to you it will take you to heaven. You pull the star down from the sheet up there and let it be the sun during day. You follow that sun until next night and repete that until you find heaven. Sailing on the stars to heaven is possible. Colombo did that so can you...

No, that is how you trip out on magic mushrooms...

 

[Lillen]

I didn't answer your post because I agree with you... We are in agreement there! - It requires luck...

 

[Lillen]

Stars do not tell you were unknowned land are... You explore, as someone mentioned, looking at the stars in relation were you came from, not in relation were you are going when you are using your method (if your method works at all).

 

[TheReasoner]

Stars do not tell you were land is...

Have you ever played StarCraft, WarCraft, Age of Empires or Civilization on a computer?
You know how the map is black where you have not been?

To dumb it down, it's like that. Explorers did not know what was out there, so they went and looked. Maybe it was an ocean, maybe it was land. They would not know until they went.
Stars helped them see what was north, what was south. As stars help point out what's north south east and west they can help you find out which way to go, if you're sailing away from where you started or towards it. Just like a compass does for us when we're out hiking.

 

[Lillen]

I don't follow you! I am sure we both can think clearly. But we are not in agreement yet. We simply do not understand eachother yet. Can you elaborate on that!

 

[TLK Valentine]

Stars do not tell you were unknowned land are... You explore, as someone mentioned, looking at the stars in relation were you came from, not in relation were you are going when you are using your method (if your method works at all).

Stars don't just tell you where you came from, they also tell you where you currently are -- and if there's no land where you currently are, you've got this amazing thing called "memory" that makes a note of that.

So you strike out in a different direction next time, and lo and behold, you eventually find something which was previously unknown!

 

[Lillen]

We live in diffrent worlds.

 

[Lillen]

Up with you, and try again..

 

[Elendur]

We live in diffrent worlds.

Nope, same world.

 

[Lillen]

I guess it all depends on which perspective you have. This can go on forever. We are not yet in agreement all of us. some are but not all.

Not even the compass tells you where you are without a map, and what is so obious is that unknowned terrotory doesn't have maps. The compass tells you which direction, but not which direction you should go. You need gps to do that...

 

[Lillen]

I guess i am looking from the lost perspective. I assume you are lost for starters to navigate. If you don't know where you are you don't know where you are going either. Not even map and compass will reveal to you where you are, unless you recognize some sign or hint where you are.

 

[TLK Valentine]

We live in diffrent worlds.

Indeed -- ours is the real one -- not sure about yours.

 

[Lillen]

I told my steward to add my world in the declaration to the tax authorties. It somewhere by the islands of the sea...

 

[Lillen]

That was in response to your slanderess report of me being insane...