5 Solas

[aReformedPatriot]

How many of the 5 Solas does RC reject

 

[Spence06]

Just the two Sola Scriptura and Sola Fide.

I think.. because i have a different interpretation to the one, Soli Deo gloria, i don't think the Pope takes away from God's glory, unlike the reformers.

 

[bigsierra]

You say "The 5 solas" as though they have always existed, like they were written in stone and we are denying their truth.

 

[Ann M]

What are the 5 Solas please?

 

[ps139]

Well we reject sola scriptura, obviously. Simpy put, if the Bible was the sole authority, well then we never would have had a Bible! There must have been an authority that put together the Bible, it did not float down nicely bound from Heaven .
Also we see Paul command the Thessalonians to follow Scripture and Tradition equally. (2 Thess. 3:15)
Also in his first letter to the Thessalonians, Paul mentions instructions which he has given to them, directly from Jesus and by His authority. As this is Paul's first epistle to that congregation, he could not be referring to an earlier epistle, but to oral teaching.
Then he tells Timothy to teach that which he has heard Paul preach, not just what Paul wrote down. (1 Tim 2:2)
Also, Paul calls the Church the "pillar and foundation of the truth."

I have always wondered about how "sola fide" and "sola gratia" can co-exist, since their "only-ness" seems to cancel out each other? We are saved by grace, through faith. Also James' famous verse that says "Faith without works is dead" and that the "demons have faith" seems to contradict the "sola fide" principle. I'll go with James on this one.

 

[stray bullet]

How many of the 5 Solas does RC reject

I think a better way to phrase that is which of the five did the Church not accept

 

[aReformedPatriot]

You say "The 5 solas" as though they have always existed, like they were written in stone and we are denying their truth.

Dont read to much into it there, just asking which of those tenets you guys subscribe to or reject, thats all.

 

[PeterPaul]

I have always wondered about how "sola fide" and "sola gratia" can co-exist, since their "only-ness" seems to cancel out each other?

Exactly. Only the queen can move with all the powers of the pieces on a chessboard. This doesn't mean the rook can as well, as "only" implies solitude. I can not be alone with people. That's impossible.

 

[aReformedPatriot]

so none of them then?

 

[stray bullet]

Dont read to much into it there, just asking which of those tenets you guys subscribe to or reject, thats all.

Well, some Catholics can be a little bit snippy about words. Protestants sometimes say things like "Added seven books to the bible" and other things which sort of imply that Catholicism separated itself from tradition and common Christianity.
We have a tendency to want to critique phrasing

 

[PeterPaul]

The interesting thing is that the Bible itself tells us what the pillar and bulwark of the truth is, and its not scripture, but the Church.

 

[aReformedPatriot]

What are the 5 Solas please?

THESIS ONE: SOLA SCRIPTURA[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
We reaffirm the inerrant Scripture to be the sole source of written divine revelation,which alone can bind the conscience. The Bible alone teaches all that is necessary for our salvation from sin and is the standard by which all Christian behavior must be measured.

We deny that any creed, council or individual may bind a Christian's conscience, that the Holy Spirit speaks independently of or contrary to what is set forth in the Bible, or that personal spiritual experience can ever be a vehicle of revelation.[/font]

THESIS TWO: SOLUS CHRISTUS[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
We reaffirm that our salvation is accomplished by the mediatorial work of the historical Christ alone. His sinless life and substitutionary atonement alone are sufficient for our justification and reconciliation to the Father.

We deny that the gospel is preached if Christ's substitutionary work is not declared and faith in Christ and his work is not solicited.[/font]

THESIS THREE: SOLA GRATIA[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
We reaffirm that in salvation we are rescued from God's wrath by his grace alone. It is the supernatural work of the Holy Spirit that brings us to Christ by releasing us from our bondage to sin and raising us from spiritual death to spiritual life.

We deny that salvation is in any sense a human work. Human methods, techniques or strategies by themselves cannot accomplish this transformation. Faith is not produced by our unregenerated human nature.[/font]

THESIS FOUR: SOLA FIDE[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
We reaffirm that justification is by grace alone through faith alone because of Christ alone. In justification Christ's righteousness is imputed to us as the only possible satisfaction of God's perfect justice.

We deny that justification rests on any merit to be found in us, or upon the grounds of an infusion of Christ's righteousness in us, or that an institution claiming to be a church that denies or condemns sola fide can be recognized as a legitimate church.[/font]

THESIS FIVE: SOLI DEO GLORIA[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
We reaffirm that because salvation is of God and has been accomplished by God, it is for God's glory and that we must glorify him always. We must live our entire lives before the face of God, under the authority of God and for his glory alone.

We deny that we can properly glorify God if our worship is confused with entertainment, if we neglect either Law or Gospel in our preaching, or if self-improvement, self-esteem or self-fulfillment are allowed to become alternatives to the gospel.

From The Cambridge Declaration​

of the Alliance of Confessing Evangelicals[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif] [/font][/font]

 

[bigsierra]

What are the 5 Solas please?

Sola Scriptura: The Scripture Alone is the Standard
Soli Deo Gloria: For the Glory of God Alone
Solo Christo: By Christ's Work Alone are We Saved
Sola Gratia: Salvation by Grace Alone
Sola Fide: Justification by Faith Alone.

 

[Benedicta00]

have always wondered about how "sola fide" and "sola gratia" can co-exist, since their "only-ness" seems to cancel out each other? We are saved by grace, through faith

They do contradict one another don't they?

Envoy,

The deposit of faith left by Jesus does not teach "bible only" the deposit of faith left by Jesus does not teach "faith only." Martin Luther taught those- neither Jesus nor the apostles handed those down to us.


If that answers you're question.

 

[Benedicta00]

Sola Scriptura: The Scripture Alone is the Standard
Soli Deo Gloria: For the Glory of God Alone
Solo Christo: By Christ's Work Alone are We Saved
Sola Gratia: Salvation by Grace Alone
Sola Fide: Justification by Faith Alone.

I also heard that Calvin’s have this 7 point thing. What would be the other two “points”?

Also, if truth is truth how can one be able to pick how many “points” they ascribe to? I often hear Calvins say they are this many points or that many points. If these points are truth how can one choose between them? Seems to me they would be bound to accept them all.

 

[Roald]

THESIS TWO: SOLUS CHRISTUS[font=Verdana, Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif]
We reaffirm that our salvation is accomplished by the mediatorial work of the historical Christ alone. His sinless life and substitutionary atonement alone are sufficient for our justification and reconciliation to the Father.

We deny that the gospel is preached if Christ's substitutionary work is not declared and faith in Christ and his work is not solicited.[/font]

I think we would have a strong disagreement over the term "substitutionary atonement."

 

[tigersnare]

I also heard that Calvin’s have this 7 point thing. What would be the other two “points”?

Also, if truth is truth how can one be able to pick how many “points” they ascribe to? I often hear Calvins say they are this many points or that many points. If these points are truth how can one choose between them? Seems to me they would be bound to accept them all.

The 5 solas were "The battle cry of the Reformation". They aren't the 5 points of Calvinism, and there historically isn't more than 5 points.

At the Synod of Dort, 5 Treaties were drawn from scripture to combat the 5 tenets of Arminian Theology.
T-Total Depravity
U-Unconditional Election
L-LImited Atonement
I-Irresistible Grace
P-Perseverance of the Saints

Later came know to be the 5 Points of Calvinism, but they are very minimalistic in terms of the whole of Reformed Theology.

And yes, all 5 points hinge on one another, there are people that call themselves 4 point Calvinist, they generally through out "L". This just shows a misunderstanding of the system as a whole, and they generally are not in line with other important aspect of Reformed Theology.

Hope that helped....

 

[Benedicta00]

The 5 solas were "The battle cry of the Reformation". They aren't the 5 points of Calvinism, and there historically isn't more than 5 points.

At the Synod of Dort, 5 Treaties were drawn from scripture to combat the 5 tenets of Arminian Theology.
T-Total Depravity
U-Unconditional Election
L-LImited Atonement
I-Irresistible Grace
P-Perseverance of the Saints

Later came know to be the 5 Points of Calvinism, but they are very minimalistic in terms of the whole of Reformed Theology.

And yes, all 5 points hinge on one another, there are people that call themselves 4 point Calvinist, they generally through out "L". This just shows a misunderstanding of the system as a whole, and they generally are not in line with other important aspect of Reformed Theology.

Hope that helped....

So I as dreaming when I heard someone say they were a 7 point Calvinist? I could have been, maybe it was them saying they were a 5 point Calvin.

And historically and biblically speaking- there are is only 1 sola taught in the bible and that is- "We are saved by grace alone." There isn’t any instance where the bible says we are saved by the bible alone- that we are saved by faith alone, that we are saved by the glory of God alone that we are saved by infused righteousness alone. The bible clearly says in the epistle of James that we are NOT save by faith alone.

So not only does those other 4 solas contradict each other by attaching the “alone and only” meaning on to them but they contradict the scripture rather plainly. Especially since we read the CHURCH is the pillar of truth and especially since we read that it is grace saves alone a saves and not faith alone.

I mean think about for a second. It make logical sense that the authors of the letters, Paul and James would tell us That grace alone saves us, meaning that Christ won for us the out pouring of God’s grace of salvation on to us with his sacrifice. It makes sense then to say it is NOT by faith alone you are saved because you aren’t saved by faith alone or even works alone- you are saved by grace alone.

Redemption is through grace alone- salvation, the kind that matters, when you are gone from time and you have entered eternity and are “saved” from hell is through faith and works.

 

[tigersnare]

So I as dreaming when I heard someone say they were a 7 point Calvinist? I could have been, maybe it was them saying they were a 5 point Calvin.

They may have been joking, or decided to just throw in some extra stuff....who knows....

And historically and biblically speaking- there are is only 1 sola taught in the bible and that is- "We are saved by grace alone." There isn’t any instance where the bible says we are saved by the bible alone- that we are saved by faith alone, that we are saved by the glory of God alone that we are saved by infused righteousness alone. The bible clearly says in the epistle of James that we are NOT save by faith alone.
So not only does those other 4 solas contradict each other by attaching the “alone and only” meaning on to them but they contradict the scripture rather plainly. Especially since we read the CHURCH is the pillar of truth and especially since we read that it is grace saves alone a saves and not faith alone.

You misunderstand the 5 solas. Please read, or re-read "The Lord's Envoy"'s post as quoted from the A.C.E.

I mean think about for a second. It make logical sense that the authors of the letters, Paul and James would tell us That grace alone saves us, meaning that Christ won for us the out pouring of God’s grace of salvation on to us with his sacrifice. It makes sense then to say it is NOT by faith alone you are saved because you aren’t saved by faith alone or even works alone- you are saved by grace alone.

Redemption is through grace alone- salvation, the kind that matters, when you are gone from time and you have entered eternity and are “saved” from hell is through faith and works.

It was not the position of the Reformers that we are saved by faith.

Once again, the post further down the up the page clearly states the Reformed Communities position.

 

[aReformedPatriot]

They do contradict one another don't they?

Envoy,

The deposit of faith left by Jesus does not teach "bible only" the deposit of faith left by Jesus does not teach "faith only." Martin Luther taught those- neither Jesus nor the apostles handed those down to us.


If that answers you're question.

One would think at first glance, but when you read them closely they do not. Im not looking to debate here, just wanted to know what roman catholicism's views on the subject are.