2 questions on subjects I don't understand

[ToBeLoved]

1. Why would God, who made everything chose one group of people, the Jews to be his "chosen" group?

This could well be because the Lord Jesus came from the Jewish line. They had to be a people set apart and not mixing with pagans or else all their blood lines might have been mixed or non-Hebrew.

Although Joseph is not Christ's biological father, Joseph as well as Mary both came through the line of David.

There are verses in the Old Testament that specifically tell the Jewish/Hebrew/Israelite people not to mix with pagans. There were some that converted from pagans, but those were not a lot because it was a big thing to do so and they would have had to have been circumcized in adulthood to have done so. Now I am not a man so I can't say for sure, but I'm thinking most willing to do that would have been serious and probably wanting to marry a Hebrew woman.

Another interesting thing to think about is Noah. During the time of Noah, there were only 8 people who were not wicked and could be saved from destruction. Noah, his wife, their three sons and their wives. So obviously there were big bloodline issues back then with Nephelim and other things like that mixing with human women and such.
This is not exhaustive, but I hope this adds a little information to your question

 

[ananda]

Sounds rather human to me.

Why would God follow a human motivation?

It is my expectation based on personal experience. When I am content, I am also less active (I need to "do" less, because I perceive less imperfections at that moment).

For a deity to act otherwise would be an expectation based on faith.

 

[Dave-W]

It is my expectation based on personal experience. When I am content, I am also less active (I need to "do" less, because I perceive less imperfections at that moment).

For a deity to act otherwise would be an expectation based on faith.

I have no doubt that is your experience and motivation.

But it seems like a HUGE assumption to assign that same motivation to something/someone that is entirely different than ourselves.

It is not unlike an amoeba thinking that we humans should react the same way it does.

 

[ananda]

I have no doubt that is your experience and motivation.

But it seems like a HUGE assumption to assign that same motivation to something/someone that is entirely different than ourselves.

It is not unlike an amoeba thinking that we humans should react the same way it does.

As I understand your argument, it is this: "my deity does different from our own experiences, because my scripture says so"

 

[Strathos]

I don't see how that can happen. As I see it, there's always some give & take in every action.

That seems quite cynical.

 

[ananda]

That seems quite cynical.

IMO it is realistic, in my experience.

 

[ananda]

Sounds rather human to me.

Why would God follow a human motivation?

Besides, what else do we have to compare things to, but our own experiences?

 

[ToBeLoved]

Besides, what else do we have to compare things to, but our own experiences?

I would like to ask are you speaking as a Buddhist and your experience being a Buddhist OR are you talking about the Only Lord and God who is the God of Christianity?

I understand it if it is from an experience of a Buddhist.

 

[ananda]

I would like to ask are you speaking as a Buddhist and your experience being a Buddhist OR are you talking about the Only Lord and God who is the God of Christianity?

I understand it if it is from an experience of a Buddhist.

I'm speaking of the immediate, direct human experience, disregarding various interpretations of that experience.

 

[Protos]

It is irrational and illogical to me, that a deity which is supposed to transcend space and time would be so limited by space and time.

Why do you suppose the deity has to be limited?

Activity among imperfect beings is due to the fact that we are active, and in a constant effort, to address our imperfections, to alleviate our discontentments or sufferings. E.g. It would likely add to my discontentment to not be interested and active in my loved one's well-being.

A being who is perfect is altogether complete, and must necessarily be inactive.

To me it sounds like you're saying God can't create a world in which He tells one of his creatures "worship me like this." That doesn't seem a necessary constraint to me.

I think you are employing the fallacy of language or false equivocations. Activity does not need to presuppose imperfection or lack of completion. If you are suggesting how it is that things like "time" exist and how God hasn't technically accomplished something that He wants (even though He can if He wanted to speed it up), and you feel this technically makes him less than perfect/incomplete, I would avail you of some simple (advanced) mathematics:

In Set Theory, one can have a more than infinite amount. For example, there are an infinite number of whole numbers. But there are even more real numbers (irrational + rational) that outnumber this infinity - see cardinality and Cantor's diagonal proof.

This by itself should alleviate this technical supposition of "incompletion" for a perfect deity, in my opinion: He can be perfect while creating an imperfect world in which He is free to operated as if "incomplete" in our eyes (why also God seems to "change His mind" - e.g. 2 Kings 20:1 vs. v.6 - where he obviously knows and has no qualms about Hezekiah's simple request versus Moses' plea to enter Canaan).

I don't see how that can happen. As I see it, there's always some give & take in every action.

This Ying-Yang, there must always be "bad" to compare "good", "lack of completion" for "activity" presupposes a human's experience and terminology of the world. I can solve a math equation in "real time" by writing out "2+2=4." Does it mean 2+2 did not equal 4 before I wrote it? Before math was created/discovered? Before the universe existed? That's the very problem with (mis)using superlatives and then reapplying them to absolutes in the wrong base.

 

[ananda]

Why do you suppose the deity has to be limited?

Because it operates within space-time.

To me it sounds like you're saying God can't create a world in which He tells one of his creatures "worship me like this." That doesn't seem a necessary constraint to me.

I think you are employing the fallacy of language or false equivocations. Activity does not need to presuppose imperfection or lack of completion. If you are suggesting how it is that things like "time" exist and how God hasn't technically accomplished something that He wants (even though He can if He wanted to speed it up), and you feel this technically makes him less than perfect/incomplete, I would avail you of some simple (advanced) mathematics:

In Set Theory, one can have a more than infinite amount. For example, there are an infinite number of whole numbers. But there are even more real numbers (irrational + rational) that outnumber this infinity - see cardinality and Cantor's diagonal proof.

This by itself should alleviate this technical supposition of "incompletion" for a perfect deity, in my opinion: He can be perfect while creating an imperfect world in which He is free to operated as if "incomplete" in our eyes (why also God seems to "change His mind" - e.g. 2 Kings 20:1 vs. v.6 - where he obviously knows and has no qualms about Hezekiah's simple request versus Moses' plea to enter Canaan).

If Christians posit a deity which is perfect in every possible way (not simply specific ways), then it is incomparable to Set Theory.

This Ying-Yang, there must always be "bad" to compare "good", "lack of completion" for "activity" presupposes a human's experience and terminology of the world. I can solve a math equation in "real time" by writing out "2+2=4." Does it mean 2+2 did not equal 4 before I wrote it? Before math was created/discovered? Before the universe existed? That's the very problem with (mis)using superlatives and then reapplying them to absolutes in the wrong base.

Without direct experience, we have only unconfirmed faith to fall back on.

 

[ToBeLoved]

I'm speaking of the immediate, direct human experience, disregarding various interpretations of that experience.

Well then sorry, but you do not worship the God of the Bible and the Living God, so you probably do have a very course experience.

But that is no reason to fault a belief system you do not know as being dry and calling only your experience as a various interpretation. It is not. You worship a different God entirely, one that is not the Living God.

I'm not judging you, just don't put a Buddhist experience of God into a Christian context because they are not the same.

 

[ananda]

Well then sorry, but you do not worship the God of the Bible and the Living God, so you probably do have a very course experience.

But that is no reason to fault a belief system you do not know as being dry and calling only your experience as a various interpretation. It is not. You worship a different God entirely, one that is not the Living God.

I'm not judging you, just don't put a Buddhist experience of God into a Christian context because they are not the same.

What is the "Christian context", in your opinion? I was in Christianity for 3 decades.

 

[ToBeLoved]

What is the "Christian context", in your opinion? I was in Christianity for 3 decades.

Well first, our Savior died so we can have "God with us". We have the indwelling Holy Spirit living inside of us who leads us in all truth, prays for us when we know not what to pray for ourselves, comforts us in our times of need, and seals us in the New Coveanant and is a down payment of our inheritance as sons and daughters of God until the Day of Redemption when we will receive our full inheritance, in Christ Jesus.

1 Corinthians 6:19
Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own?

2 Corinthians 6:16
Or what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For we are the temple of the living God; just as God said, "I WILL DWELL IN THEM AND WALK AMONG THEM; AND I WILL BE THEIR GOD, AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE.

John 16:13
"But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come.

Romans 8:26-27
26 In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us through wordless groans. 27 And he who searches our hearts knows the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for God’s people in accordance with the will of God.

Ephesians 1:13
In Christ ye also trusted after ye heard the word of truth, the Gospel of your salvation, in Whom also after ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise

2 Corinthians 1:21-22
21 Now it is God who establishes both us and you in Christ. He anointed us, 22 placed His seal on us, and put His Spirit in our hearts as a pledge of what is to come.

Ephesians 1:14
The Spirit is the pledge of our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession, to the praise of His glory.

Romans 8:16
but you received the Spirit of sonship, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!” 16 The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are God’s children. 17And if we are children, then we are heirs: heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ


I think I included all the verses. We are not only adopted by God, but we are given the titles of sons/daughters, heirs and co-heirs with Christ.

 

[ananda]

Well first, our Savior died so we can have "God with us". We have the indwelling Holy Spirit living inside of us who leads us in all truth, prays for us when we know not what to pray for ourselves, comforts us in our times of need, and seals us in the New Coveanant and is a down payment of our inheritance as sons and daughters of God until the Day of Redemption when we will receive our full inheritance, in Christ Jesus.

1 Corinthians 6:19
Or do you not know that your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit who is in you, whom you have from God, and that you are not your own?

2 Corinthians 6:16
Or what agreement has the temple of God with idols? For we are the temple of the living God; just as God said, "I WILL DWELL IN THEM AND WALK AMONG THEM; AND I WILL BE THEIR GOD, AND THEY SHALL BE MY PEOPLE.

John 16:13
"But when He, the Spirit of truth, comes, He will guide you into all the truth; for He will not speak on His own initiative, but whatever He hears, He will speak; and He will disclose to you what is to come.

Romans 8:26-27
26 In the same way, the Spirit helps us in our weakness. We do not know what we ought to pray for, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us through wordless groans. 27 And he who searches our hearts knows the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for God’s people in accordance with the will of God.

Ephesians 1:13
In Christ ye also trusted after ye heard the word of truth, the Gospel of your salvation, in Whom also after ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise

2 Corinthians 1:21-22
21 Now it is God who establishes both us and you in Christ. He anointed us, 22 placed His seal on us, and put His Spirit in our hearts as a pledge of what is to come.

Ephesians 1:14
The Spirit is the pledge of our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God's possession, to the praise of His glory.

Romans 8:16
but you received the Spirit of sonship, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!” 16 The Spirit Himself testifies with our spirit that we are God’s children. 17And if we are children, then we are heirs: heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ


I think I included all the verses. We are not only adopted by God, but we are given the titles of sons/daughters, heirs and co-heirs with Christ.

How is this your experience, and not merely your faith?

 

[ToBeLoved]

How is this your experience, and not merely your faith?

Because I have the Holy Spirit, God Himself residing in me. I am Christ's and He is mine.

It is not just faith. It is love, it is worship of who He is and what He has done for me. It is a devotion to God to do His will and that His will be done in my life as my Savior see's fit.

I trust in Him to guide my soul. He puts things on my conscience and heart, answers my prayers with answers that I get that could have come from no where else. Not coincidence or desire, but answers that hit me over the head with a frying pan.

It is a real relationship and I walk with Him each day. I do not live for the God I will meet some day, but the God who guides my path and my life.

 

[ananda]

Because I have the Holy Spirit, God Himself residing in me. I am Christ's and He is mine.

It is not just faith. It is love, it is worship of who He is and what He has done for me. It is a devotion to God to do His will and that His will be done in my life as my Savior see's fit.

I trust in Him to guide my soul. He puts things on my conscience and heart, answers my prayers with answers that I get that could have come from no where else. Not coincidence or desire, but answers that hit me over the head with a frying pan.

It is a real relationship and I walk with Him each day. I do not live for the God I will meet some day, but the God who guides my path and my life.

I'm glad to hear that you have that personal knowledge of your deity. Unfortunately, I do not.

 

[ToBeLoved]

I'm glad to hear that you have that personal knowledge of your deity. Unfortunately, I do not.

I recommend you try Christianity again and try to become a little closer to God. It doesn't sound like your current religion is serving you very well.

You can reach out to me anytime if you like.

 

[ananda]

I recommend you try Christianity again and try to become a little closer to God. It doesn't sound like your current religion is serving you very well.

You can reach out to me anytime if you like.

Actually, Buddhism is serving me much better than Christianity ... thanks though

 

[ToBeLoved]

Actually, Buddhism is serving me much better than Christianity ... thanks though

Ok. Whatever floats your boat.